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The “mismanaged” war. 23 May 2007

Posted by marisacat in 2004 Election, 2008 Election, Culture of Death, DC Politics, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter, Iraq War.
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Try unjust:

    Agence France Presse photo, via Spiegel.de
More of the world’s refugees now come from Iraq than from any other country in the world. It is a trend that promises to continue this year.

“Now we are beginning to really see the humanitarian consequences of the war in Iraq,” Stefan Telöken, Germany spokesman for the United Nations refugee agency UNHCR, told SPIEGEL ONLINE.

“Nobody can now say they didn’t know. It is one of the biggest refugee problems in the world, right up there with Afghanistan, Sudan and Somalia.”

  Reuters photo, via Spiegel.de
Palestinians who had taken refuge in Iraq have likewise had to leave. Here, a group of Palestinians have set up camp just on the Syrian side of the border with Iraq.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Lebanon:

  
People have been leaving the camp by any means they can: by foot, truck or windowless cars.  [AP via BBC]

The Guardian:

[C]ourting radical Sunni sentiment is a dangerous game. A major sign of trouble ahead had already emerged in February last year, when a protest against the cartoons belittling the prophet Muhammad turned violent and the Danish embassy was set ablaze in the fashionable Beirut district of Ashrafieh. Most of those protesting came from the impoverished areas of the north.

This picture becomes more complicated when the regional dimension is factored in. The invasion of Iraq has inflamed the Sunni-Shia divide and is changing the dynamics of the Middle East. Fear of Shia influence in Arab affairs has prompted many Sunni leaders to warn of a “Shia crescent” stretching from Iran, through Iraq, to south Lebanon. Several reports have highlighted efforts by Saudi officials to strengthen Sunni groups, including radical ones, to face the Shia renaissance across the region.

But building up radical Sunni groups to face the Shia challenge can easily backfire. While militant Islamist groups are sensitive to appeals to Sunni sentiment, they remain locked in their own agenda. Courted by regional players – Syria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia – and infiltrated by intelligence services, Islamist radical groups serve the needs of some without necessarily becoming servants to any.

Some perceive the fighting of recent days as a confrontation between regional forces – the US, Syria, Saudi Arabia – vying for control of the Lebanese political space. Others see it as a plan that went wrong, with Islamist groups escaping the control of the pro-government forces that nurtured them. And others perceive it as an attempt to draw the Lebanese army – regarded as the only genuinely national force in the country – into the fray of Lebanese politics.

The Siniora government is enfeebled. Claims that Syria is behind the current conflict have not so far been endorsed by the White House or other Arab leaders. The army, which has tried to remain neutral, is now muddied and its weaknesses made apparent to all.

The plight of thousands of Palestinian refugees trapped in the Nahr al-Bared camp echoes the Israeli bombing of Palestinian camps in occupied Palestine. Radical Islamist activists are moved by the atrocities in the north and attacks on their fellow militants. Palestinian factions are fractious, weakened, and infiltrated by foreign agents, further destabilising security within the refugee camps. The relations between Palestinian groups and Lebanese authorities are strained, and tensions can easily spill outside the refugee camps. The dangers of a conflagration that could spread across the country are serious. The US once nurtured the mujahideen in Afghanistan, only to pay the price much later. In the dangerous game of sectarian conflict, everyone stands to lose.

    AFP photo via BBC
People are fleeing either to Tripoli or to another nearby refugee camp. There are plans for schools to be set aside to shelter some of the refugees.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Oil patch boys rub their chubby hands in glee:

BBC

‘Show of force’

A series of factors, including tensions in Iran and oil-rich Nigeria, pushed prices to a nine-month high above $70 earlier this month.

A United Nations report published on Wednesday concluded that Iran was still defying the ban on uranium enrichment.

The news coincided with nine US warships sailing through the Strait of Hormuz, off the coast of Iran, in a move interpreted by analysts as a show of strength.

Meanwhile, French president Nicolas Sarkozy warned Tehran it faced tougher sanctions if it did not co-operate with the international community over its proposed nuclear program.

Iran was not notified in advance of the US naval manoeuvres, involving 17,000 personnel.

“We are still of the opinion that this is a more symbolic show of force than anything else,” said Olivier Jakob, from oil analysts Petromatrix. [snip]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Oh puh-uh-leeze:   The definition of a Democratic shit sandwich.  NOW they bravely vote NO.  Some of them. 

And Blahgers bravely, as they Save the Nation! for God!, Mother, Apple Pie and George Washington’s Childhood Cherry Tree…  yes they bravely count how many little piggies go to market.

This could truly illustrate my point (none / 0) (#4)

by Big Tent Democrat on Wed May 23, 2007 at 08:07:12 PM EST

NOT funding after a date certain is howe we do this.We can;t enact bills over Bush’s veto, but if enough vote NO, this could be a great illustration of my point.At the least, it becomes a Republican bill. And we can isolate the Dems who will cave on it.[ Parent ]

If we get 171 and 29 no votes (none / 0) (#5)

by andgarden on Wed May 23, 2007 at 08:17:34 PM EST

it will be a start. In that case, we will probably be able to say that the Republicans funded the war, and Pelosi might just say “this is it; I’m not going to put my caucus and supporters through this anymore!”[ Parent ]

Zactly! (none / 0) (#6)

by Big Tent Democrat on Wed May 23, 2007 at 08:18:36 PM EST

[ Parent ]

jesusfuckingchrist: as long as it is a Republican bill.  Dears, they ALL are.

Platter of sandwiches to Aisle 10 with Blog Maid clean up scheduled to follow the Democratic catering.

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Comments»

1. lucidculture - 23 May 2007

Would you strategize if your life was in danger? Do you have the luxury of issuing talking points if your family members are dying from gunshot wounds and chemical warfare? Would you write a letter to your ‘representative’ if your child was being tortured in a prison?

Would we, a now docile population – responsible for these acts over countless generations- take greater action?

Tear the motherfucker down.

And build a real egalitarian society.

2. liberalcatnip - 23 May 2007

Gung ho Edwards:

We need a post-Bush, post-9/11, post-Iraq American military that is mission-focused on protecting Americans from 21st century threats, not misused for discredited ideological pursuits. We need to recognize that we have far more powerful weapons available to us than just bombs, and we need to bring them to bear. We need to reengage the world with the full weight of our moral leadership.

New campaign slogan: Morality Via Nukes

Iraq? You can check out any time, but you can never leave:

I believe that once we are out of Iraq, the U.S. must retain sufficient forces in the region to prevent a genocide, deter a regional spillover of the civil war, and prevent an Al Qaeda safe haven. We will most likely need to retain Quick Reaction Forces in Kuwait and in the Persian Gulf. We will also need some presence in Baghdad, inside the Green Zone, to protect the American Embassy and other personnel.

I slipped into a coma reading the rest of it…

3. Kevin Lynch - 23 May 2007

there is no soul
left inside this nation
like that statue in the harbor
it’s cold, metallic, and empty
standing all alone
pretending to light the way
to a new Jerusalem
that was attained through murder
built by the enslaved
fed by the blood of patriots
newly arrived from distant shores
we live without seeing their ghosts
but they drag upon us just the same
war and injustice run in our veins
prideful words fall from our lips
gore drips crimson from our
bright and unsheathed swords
righteousness bursting from our chests
madness burning our minds
and our doom waits quietly in shadow
for we shall stumble
destiny is a bitch

Kevin Earl Lynch (c) 2007

4. marisacat - 23 May 2007

catnip… yes his speech to the Council on For Relations… set me off.. not that it takes much. If I NEVER hear “mismanaged” again for brutal invasion and occupation…

5. liberalcatnip - 23 May 2007

It’s raining dandruff…little, round, white ice pellets…wannabe snow. Why do the weather gods hate me?

6. liberalcatnip - 23 May 2007

The islanders are finally going home to the Diego Garcia area islands. That was one helluva long fight.

An estimated 2,000 Chagossians were driven from their homes between 1967 and 1971 after Britain made a secret deal to lease the island of Diego Garcia to the US for use as an airbase. They were tricked out of their homes, encouraged to leave on temporary trips, and not allowed back.

Later, the islanders were subjected to intimidation. At one point US soldiers rounded up their dogs and gassed them. The departing Chagossians were loaded on to boats, allowed to take only one bag with them, and deposited in Mauritius, where most have lived in poverty ever since. The base has served as a refuelling stop and base for air raids in a succession of wars, most recently in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Give it up already, geez…

The Foreign Office said it was “disappointed” by the ruling, and said it would consider an appeal to the House of Lords. A spokeswoman said, the islanders “in theory” now had a right to go home.
[...]
Chagossians – who are descended from 18th century African and Indian labourers on French coconut plantations – are not seeking to resettle Diego Garcia itself, but other islands in the archipelago, which are from 60 to 100 miles away. US and British officials have argued that raids on the air base could be launched from those other islands, or they could be used to observe the movement of warplanes.

But yesterday’s ruling meant that three British courts have decided, in effect, that security concerns cannot trump the right of the Chagos islanders to return home.

7. Sabrina Ballerina - 23 May 2007

It is Democratic betrayal, whether they vote no or not. No one in the Real World cares about such nuance. They need to go out and LISTEN to what people are saying. The anger is intense. And the Democrats have been identified as the culprits.

The Demcorats are taking the WH frame when they say ‘we are supporting the troops when we provide funding’. BULSHIT! It is lies. They are funding the war and every single person I have talked to, not one ever heard of a blog, is blaming the Democrats. The media is covering it that way and rightly so.

Real people, not pixelated blahgers, know what is happening. They don’t sit around analyzing, they don’t have to. It’s simple, the war rages on, the entire ME is ablaze practically, the daily drumbeat of dead US troops goes on unabated.

Republicans and Democrats alike that I know are infuriated. Gas prices, food prices are sky high everywhere. Some people, elderly, disabled on fixed incomes have lived through the winter without home heating oil!

These blaghers and the politicians they support have no fucking idea what is going on with real people. Have any of them visited a VA hospital eg? Talked to the family members of maimed troops? The real blogs are reporting all of this, military family blogs, real liberal blogs. And the word is getting out.

There are no leaders on these blogs, no one cares about that, just people, still trying to stop the carnage, while all these fools, unprincipled morons like Kos and his band of sychophants can think of is how they can save the betrayers and try to make them look good. Forget about it. They were given a chance, they blew it, now it’s up to the people.

I thought I could never be as angry as I was after the 2002 sellout but I was wrong. Then we could only imagine what that vote meant, but now we have seen the unspeakable horror they gave the green light to and anyone who is not livid to the point of being ready to pitch every stupid, self-serving enabler of the genocide they supported either actively or be excusing those who supported it, into one of their own torture chambers is an unprincipled, enabling prick.

If ever there was a time to disgard the six-year-old gas-bagging garbage that has emanated from the ‘netroots’ it is now. Anyone who now allows themselves to be emotionally manipulated one.more.time, is a lost cause and needs to get out of the way.

Sorry for the rant …. I am speechless regarding the horror of it all, the dead children, the torture, the killing, the bombing, and that refugee was right … the world is responsible, all of us but none more than those who, no matter what they do, no matter that now we are closing in on a MILLION DEAD HUMAN BEINGS, they still sit around analyzing how to save the betrayers! Unfuckingbelievabe. and to add insult to real painful injury, MB tells the rabble that it might take 40 years!!

Yes, it will, if people listen to him and his ilk …. the house is on fire and he’s saying ‘hold the hoses I need to explain how to put out a fire and it will take a little while’. Dishonorable is too kind a word for them.

8. marisacat - 23 May 2007

Al Gore – in the Guardian.

In out In out. Make up your mind.

9. Sabrina Ballerina - 23 May 2007

Kevin, that is a beautiful poem …. thanks for posting it.

Lucid said in the last thread:

I just want to thank all of you guys again for being so on top of the news. And so damned intelligent. And so compassionate towards other ‘vipers’ whose sanity no longer allows them the illusion of ‘fitting in’ to the great high school clique in the sky. And, for actually having, yes, values.

Lucid there are more of us than there are of them … and when you talk to people even people I could not talk to two years ago because of political differences, they ARE waking up despite the media cover-up. The action is not on blogs, certainly not the ‘netroots’ which is WHY the media covers them and nto the real activists because it’s SAFE. They are no threat to the PTBs, it’s so clear.

See how they took MB’s post, but not the comments. The lie that he spoke for anyone but himself. And the sychophants at Firedoglake re-enforced his so tranparent message. And I know they are not fooled, but they can count on him and kos and Bowers and the rest of the minority blowhards to give them what they need to run with. But this war will do them all in …. and they will be overwhelmed as they nearly were yesterday, because they will be more days like yesterday increasingly. It’s inevitable.

Armando is caving also, he wants back in the game or was there all along for all we know, and it is all an act. Whatever. This country does not need these appeasers. It is at a moment in history where it needs courageous people to step forward or it will continue on its current downward slide until the next Superpower emerges. Pat Buchanan was right! And I really hate to have to say that.

I loved Keith Olbermann’s speech, only one bone to pick with him, he mentioned Edwards and Dodd, but not Kucinich. Yet Kucinich, on this issue, the war, is the only Democrat who voted the right way every single time. Edwards surely did not. I am going to email KO.

10. liberalcatnip - 23 May 2007

#7. Amen, SB!

The roof is being redone on the house here and, because of the weather being so crappy, I’ve met some interesting friends of Roofer Guy ™. Yesterday morning, I spent some time talking to a retiree who is originally from Afghanistan and has been in Canada over 20 years now and he sure didn’t need the blogs to tell him what his opinion was on the latest Dem cave. People got the memo – even people who’ve never heard of the word “blog”. They know bullshit political games when they see them. Heck, he was in India before there was a Pakistan so he’s been around the block (and the world) a few times.

Just who do these bloggers think they’re fooling?

11. liberalcatnip - 23 May 2007

I forgot to mention big kudos for your poem, Kevin. So sad.

I put a post up at my place about Diego Garcia if anyone’s interested in more info. Tidbit: the US needed that island [In the 1960's] “to deter Russia from interrupting the flow of oil from the Persian Gulf countries to America and Europe. Politically, this entailed American support of Iran to counter Russian influence in Iraq.” It’s always about oil. The players just change sides.

12. marisacat - 23 May 2007

those people never gave up, not ever. A few months ago I saw an excellent documentary on the removal process. Unbelievably ugly. Brutal. At on e point they shot the pets (dogs) to make the point to the people. Lied to every step of the way.

13. Sabrina Ballerina - 23 May 2007

Catnip, that is a great post on your blog McCain. Left a comment there! I’m trying to catch up on everything. I loved all the song lyrics posted in the last thread ….

********

Lol, Catnip, at most they will fool about a thousand or so die-hard kossacks who are so dependent by now they can no longer think for themselves.

********
Btw, Brinn! That is brilliant! If you need help let us know. As for what to call the blog, I’m thinking about it … braindead right now, it was a long day. We should send it all of them, maybe take out an ad in the NYT or something. Send it to the useless Moveon and see if they have the guts to raise money for an ad.

But it is really very effective …. one thing, I would tag those who voted for the war, or who support with a color, maybe red for blood. Just so all are not painted with the same brush, if they don’t deserve it.

14. moiv - 23 May 2007

brinn and sb –

Btw, Brinn! That is brilliant! If you need help let us know. As for what to call the blog, I’m thinking about it … braindead right now,

Yes, it is a brilliant concept — and “BrainDead” strikes me as a brilliant name for it.

The Lege is just about to wind up here. We beat back two nasty anti-woman bills that were high-priority for the antis, and now I’m beat, too.

15. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Not to get into Lakoff, but he did have a passing thought a couple/three of years ago that the Democrats needed to ram home the dead. Be fearless. he suggested a campaign using something like, extend the war, fund the war = how many more dog tags do you want.

SOmthing like that …

what ever the site or the project is called, it should be brutal and accusatory.

************

Kevin

plaudits for your poem… really beautiful… will check if it is up at your site… ;)

16. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

Lol, Moiv – I truly do feel braindead tonight, but you’re right, that might be a good title – something with ‘dead’ in it. Good news about the bills btw.

Marisacat, Lakoff was right, but the only Dems I’ve heard even mention the dead are Sen. Byrd (who often does so, and did so before the AUMF vote and Kucinich. Durbin attempted to mention the tortured but backed down.

Keith Olbermann got the ‘framing’ right when he said that Bush was holding the troops hostage. Many people online have begged the Dems to use say that. It is so obvious. And so effective, it is short and to the point, what people can grasp, even if they don’t fully know the details. It informs them enough to make them understand what is going on. Dems refuse to do so and instead, use the rightwing talking point themselves! Really, seriously I think they are just stupid! No one can want to lose so badly. Or else, there is something in the water in DC.

I don’t accept this horseshit at ALL. (none / 0) (#8)
by Pneumatikon on Wed May 23, 2007 at 10:58:42 PM EST

And that’s exactly what this is. The Democrats are going to play their little game where the majority of them will vote against this, but not enough to stop it. Then they’ll look all grave and talk more shit.
We’ve been stabbed in the back. Worse, they’ve proven America has collapsed as a constitutional democracy. They needed to give him their bill one more time and then, when he vetoed it, started impeachment proceedings immediately. But they won’t because they’re liars and cowards.

Catnip, that is great news about Diego Garcia. I remember when I first read about that Island, after the Tsunami. I was horrified. It’s a real example of what committed people can accomplish when they are passionate about something.

Someone on TL who gets it … we should be outraged by these games of trying to make the Democrats look good.

I don’t accept this horseshit at ALL. (none / 0) (#8)
by Pneumatikon on Wed May 23, 2007 at 10:58:42 PM EST

And that’s exactly what this is. The Democrats are going to play their little game where the majority of them will vote against this, but not enough to stop it. Then they’ll look all grave and talk more shit.
We’ve been stabbed in the back. Worse, they’ve proven America has collapsed as a constitutional democracy. They needed to give him their bill one more time and then, when he vetoed it, started impeachment proceedings immediately. But they won’t because they’re liars and cowards.

I’m not really interested in any more elections. I’ll never vote again. We as a people need to decide what our next move will be.

How can anyone believe that this is honorable? In my world, people who act badly, even one’s own children, should never be rewarded for it. They should take the consequences of their actions.

What armando is advocating is to ‘save’ the perpetrators, maintaining the failed state we are in. What Pneumatikon says is exactly what they are going to do. An exercise in futility as far as ending this war which is acknowledged. They need to feel the full rath of the American people and get tossed out in the next election as an example to the next politician who asks for the privilege of representing us.

Why should any politician behave like a representative of the people when they always have an out and enablers ready to help them? That is the equivalent of extremely bad parenting. I’d like to have armando for a dad if I were a bratty kid. He’d yell a little but he’d always bail me out … and we know what becomes of those children.

17. wu ming - 24 May 2007

brilliant idea, brinn. the trick will be updating the dead (esp. figuring out the house districts) to keep such a project current, but the idea really cuts to the heart of it.

as for the rest of this crap, i fear that this will be a horrible summer. not like things are peachy now, but it just feels like we’re on the cusp.

18. marisacat - 24 May 2007

SB…

I think conchita (well whoever answered pneumatikon, closed the window, might have been “clio”) had a very good comment as well.

I thought they both saw it as it is.

Imperial nation, wars of invasion. the Democrats, but for a few, don’t oppose ANY of what has happened for years.

And CLinton and his crowd over saw the years of bleeding Iraq.

19. lucidculture - 24 May 2007

Your dead.
Your last best idea.
This is not a collaboration.

The flowers you proposed
fell shorn to desert truth.

And what truth was it?
The limbless child,
A mother’s desperation?

Or a sack and rape
in a very public place
(just to)
Scorn all nations.

Your desert truth
would see a peace
through severed limbs
and white phosphorus.

Burning the hanging gardens,
a wonder
a wonder
of civilization.

Do you ask what new world you create?

Or with the beep, be- beep
Now
do you consign
history
to a shoot ‘em up fantasy.

These are your dead.

This is not a collaboration.

20. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

Marisacat, yes, that is also a great comment:

pneumatikon, on the phone today w/ jerry nadler’s

by conchita on Wed May 23, 2007 at 11:28:28 PM EST

office wanting to set up an appointment for reps from groups from his district to meet with him to discuss impeachment. after this, i can’t see any other alternative. so, we are denied a meeting and i am spoonfed this pablum – congressman nadler agrees that the president has done things that warrant impeachment, but…it would distract from getting other things done, there isn’t enough time. they don’t get it. they have accomplished nothing with regard to the most pressing issue facing this country and the middle east. they are out of step with their constituents, yet they continue to make excuses for doing nothing. the people of this country are crying out for leadership to take a stand they can get behind. i heard jerry nadler speak at an ACT meeting last month where he talked about increasing the majority in congress but at the same time making sure the democratic party does not become too moderate. it’s too late. not only is it too late, but he is part of it. he broke ranks with the progressive and out of iraq caucuses and voted in favor of the house supplemental. it is clear that change is not going to come from our elected leadership. it is up to us. as you said: We as a people need to decide what our next move will be.

Emphasis mine, and I agree with her except that it is not only on the Iraq War that they have accomplished nothing. They have accomplished nothing at all, no legislation from the 100 hours passed, and it will not because Bush will veto all of it. If they should get a veto proof majority, he will simply use a signing statement as he has on almost every bill he didn’t like.

What is so upsetting is that no one even those who oppose what the Dems just did, ie, armando, acknowledges what you just said, that the Dems are on board for this war, at least enough of them to make it impossible for them to vote ‘no’ unless they have been assured that there are enough votes for Bush to win.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Dems are meeting with Republicans right now to see if enough Republicans will vote ‘yes’ so that some embattled war-supporting Democrats can vote ‘no’.

21. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

Lucid, that is a lovely, though very sad poem. Did you write it?

22. lucidculture - 24 May 2007

Yes – just for ya’ll, just now.

23. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

Kucinich trying again to expose what is really behind the games they are playing and the bloodshed in Iraq:

Dennis Kucinich

Washington, May 23 – WASHINGTON, D.C. — Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) will invoke a rarely used House procedure today to discuss the privatization of Iraqi oil on the floor of the U.S. House of Representatives.

Kucinich plans to invoke a point of personal privilege under House Rule IX to respond to published remarks regarding efforts he has made to inform the House Democratic Caucus of the details of the Iraqi Hydrocarbon Act.

Kucinich will have one hour of time on the House floor in which he plans to explain why Congress’ insistence on benchmarks in the supplemental, which includes passage of the Iraqi hydrocarbon act, demands that Iraqis privatize their oil.

To watch Congressman Kucinich’s speech live, visit C-SPAN’s website.

Excerpts from the speech are below:

“The Administration set several benchmarks for the Iraqi government, including passage of the “Hydrocarbon Law” by the Iraqi Parliament.”

“The fact is that except for three scant lines, the entire 33 page “Hydrocarbon Law,” is about creating a complex legal structure to facilitate the privatization of Iraqi oil.”

“And many inside the beltway are contemplating linking funding for the war in Iraq to the completion of these benchmarks, including passage of the “Hydrocarbon Law” by the Iraqi Parliament.”

“The war in Iraq is a stain on American history. Let us not further besmirch our nation by participating in the outrageous exploitation of a nation which is in shambles due to U.S. intervention.”

24. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

You all are so talented. It is beautiful, Lucid, thank you.

Btw, if you are still here – do you have a link to your band? I have a friend who has so many electronic toys, I don’t know when he gets time to play with them all. He just got a laptop that I really want! His cell phone is a virtual entertainment center with a computer also, and now he bought another toy, a mini computer that he says he can use ‘in the woods’ Lol! Not to mention motor-bikes, cars etc.

Anyway, I’m going to get to play with the laptop this weekend and I tried to link to your band tonight, but couldn’t find the link. I know it’s somewhere in another thread, but can’t remember which one.

25. lucidculture - 24 May 2007

I am liking that idea – maybe a bit more rhyme at the end…

gotta bolt to bed.

Love your scales to the dashboard vipes.

26. supervixen - 24 May 2007

really nice poetry, guys. Thanks.

A little puzzle: who is “Jake’s Guilt” on MLW? He is running rampant in this thread, desperately trying to put down any criticism of DKos. He’s obviously “someone” at DKos but I can’t figure out who. His style reminds me of Luscious Vagina but more verbose.

27. supervixen - 24 May 2007

#23: thanks SB for the info on Kucinich. I was wondering about the status of Iraqi oil. It’s something NOBODY has talked about since the run-up to the war, when we were told “Oh the invasion won’t cost us anything – the Iraqis will pay us back with the proceeds from oil sales.” And since then, not a peep.

28. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 May 2007

not pictures of the dead around those “ghost” protesters necks …

black dog tags.

Perhaps each person could remember one of the dead’s name and they could repeat them in turn. Not loud, solemnly.

Off to work. Be well all.

29. supervixen - 24 May 2007

Kind of a walking Vietnam War memorial….

30. NYCee - 24 May 2007

It’s a shame! It’s a pity!

We cant live in New York City!

What do we want?

Affordable housing!

When do we want it?

Now!

Etc.

That was us, marching up 14th Street to Union Square yesterday – a coalition of political groups, like Village Independent Democrats, Acorn, United Federation of Teachers, Good Old Lower East Side and MET Council tenant groups, Working Families, et al… plus odd and sundry individuals, like myself.

Marching to protest for the nonrich and nonfamous people who dare to still believe they have a place in New York City…

Trump is building yet another giant cock (condo-hotel) to himself in SoHo… against the zoning laws for height, but, by golly, he got himself an ‘exception’ under the hotel exception… That is just a tiny (big) example of the bulldozing/cheap tricks going on to get us out… (Oh rich people, I speak not to you. It is to get you in, oh deserving ones…) It just popped into consciousness. Kinda snapshots the PROrich pickle we NONrich are in here.

And, of course, anyone with a sense of aesthetics and the more varied and unique way it was – oh woe onto you! A pox on your city – of Big Box chain stores and an instaquik peppering of restaurantBAR look-alike watering holes for the perpetual spring break-lite hordes that descend upon us. (These BARS now cleverly graft on restaurants, like crapshite afterthoughts, so they can get around the laws instituted when neighborhoods cried BASTA to the proliferation of bars.)

Well, these Big Boxes and bars CAN make the rent. The more they can, the more others CANT. In for a dollar, out of a soul. Hey, the Market Rules! (If you’re IN the market for a Porsche, that is.)

31. NYCee - 24 May 2007

I think I just got bumped into spam…

Sabrina,

We noticed the Kucinich omission, too. My boyfriend and I both uttered “Kucinich” at the same moment during Olbermann’s fingerwag to the Dems. What about Kucinich? Dodd is the ONLY one in Congress to vote NO? This is how the media reinforces that the Dodds of the world and on the Hill are the best ANTI voices weve got – might as well focus on, listen to, vote for, go for them. Kucinich dont exist.

I got an email alert from FAIR a while back, after the first Republican debate, which followed the first Dem debate. In it, FAIR noted how the media, via various examples given, tended to stroke the GOP lower tier candidates, gave them kudos and compliments for the role they played, the issues they brought, the way X said Y, etc., whereas, by contrast, they tend to express irritation that far Left candidates, such as Gravel or Kucinich, dared to be in the mix at all. Why are they wasting our time? Why are they taking up space when no one should be taking them seriously. That sort of thing.

32. missdevore - 24 May 2007

I noticed at Goodlings testimony yesterday that she had a new ‘do. I’d been accustomed to that one pic of her that showed a rather non-descript hairstyle-bit of crimp at the edges. As if to say “running for class president.” The testimony hairdo was far more sophisticated, and I started wondering the role of legal counsel in setting up a new hairstyle. Or if there are salons in the Beltway that specialize in that sort of thing: “Congressional Hair-ings”?

33. missdevore - 24 May 2007

from the bbc:

“Fast-food giant McDonald’s has launched a petition to get the dictionary definition of a McJob changed.

The Oxford English Dictionary currently describes a McJob as “an unstimulating low-paid job with few prospects”.

actually, watching the goodling testimony yesterday, I think a term a new term is needed for the DOJ hirings in this admin: McDOJ.

34. colleen - 24 May 2007

What is so upsetting is that no one even those who oppose what the Dems just did, ie, armando, acknowledges what you just said, that the Dems are on board for this war, at least enough of them to make it impossible for them to vote ‘no’ unless they have been assured that there are enough votes for Bush to win.

I wouldn’t be too upset by what Armando does. He first appeared on DK as a rabid and disruptive and dishonest Clark supporter and then collaborated with Dana Houle when Dana was openly advocating for ‘leadership’ and control of DK with techniques of public shaming and humiliation.
Even if Armando recognises that the Dems are onboard for the war he’s not about to publically acknowledge that fact. Armando has a lot more in common politically with Tacitus and Kos than with folks like us.

35. supervixen - 24 May 2007

Miss D: excellent question. It sounds to me like it has potential for a political musical – a combination of Hairspray, The Stepford Wives and All The President’s Men. With a dash of The Manchurian Candidate thrown in for spice.

Today’s Musical Interlude, thanks to YouTube: What pop music would be like if Hitler had won the war

36. missdevore - 24 May 2007

svix-that is hilarious–looks as if the costumes came from the back pages of Simplicity, under the misc. tab. And what the hell does the pianist have on his shoulder–a dead cat?

37. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Hey Marisa.

I posted about our affordable housing protest in Manhattan yesterday, before the post that did show up (#29). Can you find it somewhere in the detour realm?

38. Tuston - 24 May 2007

I’d support Gore for pretzldent if he quit the dems and ran as a green…otherwise I’m writing in Yoda next year.

39. AlanSmithee - 24 May 2007

Luke! Vote for Green Party you will!

40. Tuston - 24 May 2007

Global Research has a great (and long) article up. Check out the link for the “new map” of the ME.

According to Hersh, Cheney’s covert plan involves massive US financial backing for militant Sunni groups that are known to be inimical to the Shia militias of the Badr Brigades, the Mahdi Army, Hamas and Hezbollah all of whom support the revolutionary government of Iran. snip
The Israeli right and a rogue faction of the royal family of Saud who are loyal to Prince Bandar bin Sultan are backing Cheney’s covert plan. The ultimate objective of Cheney’s redirection of US strategy in the region is to redraw the national boundaries of the Middle East and to give an explosive multiple birth to a sprawling litter of new cantons, colonies, domains, enclaves, protectorates, statelets and territories all pledged to American and Israeli dominance of the region and its precious oil, gas and energy reserves.

For starters, Lebanon is to be dismembered so as to form a chain of new semi-autonomous and religiously segregated cantons: one Sunni, one Christian, one Alawi and one Shia. Iraq will suffer the worst and most disfiguring surgery. Baghdad will become a City State and poised perilously on the border between the new Arabic Sunni and Arabic Shia states. The southern borders of the Arabic Shia State will straddle Kuwait and extend down south to include the oil-fields of southern Iran on the east and an oil-rich strip of Saudi Arabia on the west. A new state of Free Kurdistan will be separated from the Sunni and Shia enclaves of Iraq. A Greater Jordan will be carved out of Saudi Arabia to provide more space for the relocation of Palestinians, and a Free Baluchistan that will include Helmand province and Kandahar will be severed from Afghanistan. Perhaps, most controversially, an Islamic Sacred State that will include the holy cities of Mecca and Medina in the Hejaz will be surgically separated from the rest of Saudi Arabia.

41. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Just let several out of moderation and spam.

including Meteor…

who I guess posted to the thread previous (I don’t see him upthread). IIRC he was addressing MissDevore… at least initially.

**************

NYCee

if one is missing from yesterday ugh… because I check moderation and spam several times an hour and try to catch everything.

WP did hiccup a few times yesterday (I lost part of a post, auto save was not working among other things)

It’s possible the comment was ‘eaten’ during a hiccup…

if one went missing from yesterday .. by now it would have been rescued

Really sorry that a comment was lost..

42. Tuston - 24 May 2007

I’ve got to find out about local greens. Tucson is rife with them ( they have a party headquarters and run state and local level candidates regularly) However my home in Santa Cruz county seems to be devoid of their organized presence. We are a “machine” (dumbocratic variety) county and nearly every elected official is a Dem. Except for my sonofabitch County Supe who is a very “red” Independant…I keep fantasizing about running against him but I’m too busy (puppies and kittens and woodworking and Bar remodeling, oh my!) and won’t cut my hair or shave my beard.

43. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

Miss Devore, that camel picture in the last thread is hilarious! A Fashionable Camel Poor Bhhm will swoon when he sees it.

Speaking of the wildly popular clitlicker shoes I was just thinking of the role of shoes in politics. In the last election, eg, Flip-Flops played a prominent role as a very effective symbol. I wonder if there might not be some profit to be made by promoting our ‘clitlicker’ line to symbolize Hillary’s and Nancy’s male sychophants and maybe introducing a line of ‘cocksuckers’ for their female counterparts?

Just tossing out a few thoughts on the marketing of our ‘brand’! It’s the thing to do after all, is it not? Lol! Politics, isn’t all about the ‘Brand’ and profiting from it? Not much else that I can see.

As far as yesterday’s hairy testimony, I haven’t seen it – but with so many crooked politicians likely to be giving testimony in one hearing or another since corruptiion is so in style in DC, I imagine ‘Congressional Hairings’ will become more in demand in DC beauty salons.

Edwards’ hairy doings still has the rightwing in a state of apoplexy eg, playing offense of course with Dems as usual in their comfortable role of playing defense.

And who can forget the obsession with Clinton’s locks, almost exceeding the blow-job madness which nearly brought down a government? So it would seem only proper for Salons to cash in on the fascination with the hairdoings of top DC officials as you suggest with election season coming up and all.

I have said it before and I will say it again, someone needs to hire you for their marketing department … and I know this may sound like indulgent self-promotion, but what the hell, if Bowers et al can do it, why not Vags, but where would anyone find a more superior marketing team to back you up, than right here on this A+ listed political blog? Lol!

44. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

I keep fantasizing about running against him but I’m too busy (puppies and kittens and woodworking and Bar remodeling, oh my!) and won’t cut my hair or shave my beard. Tuston

Lol, as discussed above, the role of Hair in politics should not be under-estimated. On a scale of one to ten, I would say that the media places it somewhere around 8-10 re important issues to cover as opposed to eg, the truth about the war in Iraq, which appears to not even register on the scale. So, as usual, Miss D has identified a potential goldmine as far as the priorities of DC politicians and the media that covers them.

45. NYCee - 24 May 2007

No, Marisa. It is from this morning, just before the post that made it thru. It was about yesterday… a march for affordable housing, against unfair practices, to change laws to more pro-tenant, etc. And a little rant-a-rola re some unwelcome changes in our Manhattanscape. Trump was mentioned.

Did you check today’s booted booty?

Thankee.

46. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Oh, I see it’s been retrieved, Marisa, now at #30.

Merci.

47. Tuston - 24 May 2007

SB- There is no doubt that the right haircut is of supreme importance in determining electability. Last year I became very involved with opposing the developers effforts to incorporate the Tubac area and actually had a former deputy state AG ask me if I would consider “cleaning up” to run for Supe. She’s a rethuglican and I guess my bumperstickers (“stop new taxes now, no incorporation”) had her confused…

48. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Kevin, I agree w/others. Just read your stirring poem. But we created “destiny,” didnt we? I guess, for all intents and purposes, we can say it is a kind of destiny now. We are destined to reap the toxic wind. Inherit it. Whether we invested in it or not.

Speaking of toxic wind, I heard on the news today that the first death due to toxic ground zero air has been officially declared by the NYC medical examiner. Death of a woman, a lawyer, who fled the attack zone. She died less than a year after, iirc.

God, that shit smelled bad. And got into your throat like a chemical cocktail. Permeated my apartment one day soon after, when the winds were just right. Like the walls were inhaling it.

49. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

NYCee, check post #30 – it is about the march in NY. Very excellent post, btw.

50. marisacat - 24 May 2007

God, that shit smelled bad. And got into your throat like a chemical cocktail. Permeated my apartment one day soon after, when the winds were just right. Like the walls were inhaling it. — NYCee

(I am listening to Bush in the Rose Garden, first question up pushes Iran War, nothing nothing nothing “has been learned”, because we are intent to do wht we want)

I am so sick of how this country hides things, subverts, criminally circumvents. Nothing new, Bush is just flagrant, rococco about it. He and his knew how broken the political systems were and they TOOK OVER. For years I have said we are Post Coup (that is the Republicans) and Post Collapse (the other party).

When Cockburn ran a slam on the Left (as if there is much of it, other than public interest lawyers who do pro bono work from prisons to Gitmo to Iraq and frankly Earth Firsters, and liberation of animals from research labs) becuase of conspiracy theorizing.. I nearly swung from the chandelier.

had the country ever been honest EVER, but esp about assassinations — lying afterward AND carrying them out — there would not be rampant CT. Which is not and never has been the pure province of “The Left”.

it is a reaction to blatant bald faced lying and deception.

51. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Did anyone call their Congress Critters re the House Iraq supplemental vote?

I called Maloney, who had voted for the IWR. (Three outta three for me… Way to go, reps!) So, when I call, I never fail to remind her minions or answering machine how little I appreciate that. Then I say, dont vote for this supplemental, dont vote for that craptastic bill to prolong this craptastic war/occupation, etc. Unfortunately, I feel mechanical at this point. Just doing my duty.

Marching up 14th in Manhattan yesterday, to protest our abysmal housing situation in NYC, I was sadly reminded of the many rallies and marches against the war that I attended since before it started, specifically the one on Feb 15th, 2003, along with the rest of the world (when Bloomberg penned us in… but we turned out in big numbers anyway).

I had such a searing passion then. We did. (The 30 percenters… or was it 25?) To PREVENT preventive war. To prevent cluster bombs from making cluster fuck.

Before it started I emailed every nation’s ambassador in the UN Security Council, the permanents along with Mexico, Chile, Guinea, etc., begging them to VOTE NO to the second resolution. I signed a petition at the 11th hour that I saw on the Guardian talkboard, in utter desperation, some whackassed fantastical idea to get the Pope to agree to be flown into Baghdad! (Surely Bush wouldnt bomb the Holy fucking See, see? I proudly signed it. Who cares if it was legit or not. I dont know to this day and I dont care. You do what you can.)

And there was such fresh outrage when we had another huge march a month later, in March, right after it started.

And each year that followed, it faded just a bit, as the nation increasingly joined our minority.

Now I feel disengaged, uninspired.. blah. I still push myself to make calls and get out, but it feels so fucking Too Late. I feel I must not stop in pushing for the clean up crew to do their thing and then exit the crime scene, but it is so Too Late to prevent the the crime, the mad clusterfuck. And it wont be called a crime. Its Too Late for that.

I hear the pols blah blah blah about how wrong this war IS now, but where were they, where were the voices of outrage, when Bush went ahead and started it up? I hear Chris Matthews call it a “War of Aggression” and “maybe even a war crime” … NOW. People like Biden and Kerry, et al, protest now… that Bush didnt follow the rules of the war authorization res then, for which they infamously voted yes. Well, if it was a crime (and it is), and they were “outraged” when they saw Bush committing it (if they were, they sure didnt show it), against their authorizing wishes (they now like to claim), why the hell didnt they yell like hell about it then? That would be yelling in righteous outrage, anger, in an effort to prevent it and then maintain a consistent position against it in the face of it. That would be authentic outrage. The time to yell. The sanctified yell.

This stuff they voice now, well, they make the faces, they attempt to make the right faces, but when it’s Too Late it’s just blah blah blah to me.

Blah.

(Since we were the scorned and ignored and ‘embarrassing’ minority in 2002/03, since then the tables have turned. Why is it that the Too Late crowd is always so much larger? I take no pleasure in this majority.)

52. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Just FYI

I get an email every time a comment goes to Moderation.. and every time I check Moderation I automatically check Spam — about 2 – 4 times an hour.

“StGermainDog” a Kos FPer (imo) who spammed me for days last summer, long ago threatened to put a “spam bot” on me, so I would get hundreds of spam a day.

It seems, for months now that he did. I get masses of spam.

I am watching spam in the Rose Garden… strangely the birds are singing.

They too should leave and nto give him cover.

53. Tuston - 24 May 2007

not be rampant CT. Which is not and never has been the pure province of “The Left”.

Word. A huge amount of the CT stuff, from even before the internetz, is pure neo-nazi white supremacist crap…

I gotta run off for the rest of the day,

Hasta la vista, Vipers…

54. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Raddatz is up now, in the Rose Garden.

55. jam.fuse - 24 May 2007

My political platform

A. Legalize all drugs and prostitution

B. Close all foreign US military bases

C. Savings cap of $100 million USD per person

D. Maximum housing footprint of 6000 sq. ft. per family

vote fer meeee

I am 47 today
thanks for this great site marisa
so’s I know how fucked things really are!

56. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Bottom line from Spam in the Garden:

We cannot leave Iraq. It will enbolden AQ and they will say they ran us out of a part of the world..

Again, what gifts, of allegiance and recognition of the deal between them, do the Bushes and bin Ladens exchange.

It’s a partnership.

57. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Bush said that “August will be a tough month”. The AQ in Iraq will kill many innocents to prevent success in September.

we are so trapped. And the Democrats agree. With Spam in the RoseGarden (where they signed off on AUMF with Gephardt and Daschle in fawning attendance, and with Oliphant in the Boston Globe to write fawningly of it all).

58. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Bush says Americans want to know:

When are you going to win?

He says when Iraq is strong enough to ve an ally in the WoT.

God help us.

He has something right tho, he says it is an area of common ground with the Democrats. except for their Out Now group (which is next to useless as they stay in the party).

BINGO!!

59. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

Happy Birthday! Jam.fuse! And thank you for your enlighening contributions to all of us especially the musical ones! Btw, thanks for the post in Kos’ thread! Lol! I have a feeling it went right over his head. We’ll start winning when there’s profit in telling the truth. But I won’t hold my breath.

Just read Meteor Blade’s response to Miss D in the previous thread. What he left out was how he attacked those who are rightfully incensed at the betrayal of their party. As Marisacat put it so plainly, the enablers really have no option left but to appear to be against the party during a safe period, then when the Party comes through as we ALL predicted they would and appear to cave (it is not caving, it is collusion, they are as much the war party as the Republicans) the enablers push the notion that the leadership needs sympathy because it’s so hard to do the right thing with all those nasty, under-investigation, low-poll-rated Republicans who have so much power whether in the minority or the majority.

When I see an honest post on the FP of DK, not slamming and ridiculing the only Democrat who has been right on the war from day one, while excusing and sympathizing with the perpetrators, I might be willing to listen. But hell will freeze over before that happens.

As for the appearance of the presidential candidates at Yrly kos, Lol! Predictable also. They know where they are safe from having their phony messages challenged. They wouldn’t dare come to Yrly Vag where they would receive no appeasement for their collusion with the warmongers. I hope they understand that we all are voters and are watching every move they make. Appearing at Yrly Kos is definitely not a good move.

60. jam.fuse - 24 May 2007

Thanks Sabrina!

Yearly Vag

hilarious, but sounds like my sex life…

61. marisacat - 24 May 2007

I am 47 today

jam.fuse

Happy Birthday!!

62. marisacat - 24 May 2007

News Conf over. Strange guy.

63. jam.fuse - 24 May 2007

marisa queen of feline viperines

muchos garcias!

rock on

full respect

64. missdevore - 24 May 2007

Happy birthday jam.fuse..it is Dylan’s bd, too. Will try to hunt up a Betty Crackwhore cyber cake for you at my lunch hour today..

65. jam.fuse - 24 May 2007

Thanks miss d!

I think I met Betty in Montreal last year

66. marisacat - 24 May 2007

All you can do is laugh:

[H]aving a President who’s really really smart is such a break from Bush that this one simple fact could override all other considerations by the base. So many people – especially young women – are blown away by her poise that they will support her.

Because of the blurring of the candidates, personality could be the way that the Democratic Party is going to choose its nominee, picking an unrepenting hawk who is also an incredibly smart rock star.

The challenge of her opponents is not to denigrate that personality, but to point out that voters should choose based on different ideas about the country and not different cults of personality.

After all, a serious mistake would be to assume that criticism of her principles implies criticism of her personal abilities. Because of the right-wing smear machine of the 1990s, Clinton is considered not only calculating, but she is expected to be cold, mean, and dismissive. She’s not. She’s really quite brilliant and comes across exceptionally well. If you don’t believe that, as many of you don’t, prepare to be blown away when you do see her in person. The public has low expectations for Clinton. We shouldn’t. She’s amazing.

Update [2007-5-24 10:22:20 by Matt Stoller]: A lot of people are interpreting this as me being in the tank for Clinton. Not so. It’s just obvious that she’s very brilliant, and you’re not going to beat her by pretending she’s not.

LOL Wait til the tapes of all her amazing, amazing bloops, big ones (I particularly remember the one about Gandhi… that was nearly racist, frnkly), start getting released.

No wonder people think he is in the tank.

67. Sabrina Ballerina - 24 May 2007

Yearly Vag
hilarious, but sounds like my sex life…
jam.fuse

Lol, reminds me of the joke where a pastor asks his flock how many times a year they engage in intercourse with their spouses. One smiling man raised his hand, and said ‘Once a year’. ‘So why are you smiling’? asked the pastor. ‘Because this is the day’! he responded.

I know, lame joke but couldn’t help myself — have a great birthday, jam.fuse

68. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Thanks, Sabrina.

I do feel it, walking around town. Unfortunately.

Marisa:

Cockburn can be very cavalier about so-called conspiracy, as I recall. I think about global warming, too. He is reckless sometimes. Exactly what the rap is on CTists, ironically.

Perhaps he feels a burnishing of his cockily ‘independent’ wings at such times.

And yes, the cover ups … they lend to the utter hypocrisy, which is rampant from our pols/media’s storytelling (which I was feeling, although it wasnt stated outright, as I read Kevin’s poem… ) These hypocrisies scream to be outted. As much as the crimes they attempt to keep in, our history of might makes right, ownership to the strongest and richest, we can do it (injustice) because we can… and then we can pretend we didnt, later on. And be the best. A few stains? Put thru the spin cycle.

On that score, I was pissed off (but not shocked) to notice a glaring omission in the oft-replayed clip of Ron Paul v Rudy, Fox debate. Rudy to Ron: How dare you … worst 9/11 bullshit Ive ever heard, blaming us for blowback! (Im thinking particulary of that Politico arse: Wow! Look at Rudy tear into Ron! Zowee! He cleverly seized the moment! Big win goes to America’s Mayor.)

When I actually saw the debate I realized Paul also cited how our govt overthrew Iran’s elected leader and installed the Shah, which then led to the hostage crisis. That no one showed that portion is so typical, so in line with the cover up/hypocrisy habit for which we are world reknowned (although perhaps not so much in house). Our enmity, our very history, with Iran begins with the hostage crisis. They started it! They are the bad guys. We are the good guys.

They need to FINALLY get onto the advanced track, democratic, like us. (Never mind the Mossadegh.)

Oh, and PS – who, in the whole wide world, ever used NUKES?

Yet, again, we are so good we might possibly have to use nukes to stop Iran from acquiring nukes.

Because, history be damned, we are not just the good guys – we are the BEST.

Makes me sick.

69. NYCee - 24 May 2007

St Germain… I know Ive been there… a lovely place, as I recall… murkily.

That’s too bad about the ongoing spam infusion, courtesy St Germain Dawg, perhaps, Marisa. You are so seamlessly octopusish in dealing, though. What the fuck is in your oj? :-)

70. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Unfortunately, Stoller may be right about her ability to win over the flocks. Her “brilliant” burnishing is what the crowd gives onto Hillary, though. She is not the source. Unfortunately, what is perceived as her brilliance, or star brightness, could be a big wow factor with our public.

You know, one of the oft-used GOP talking points re the Iraq war, to take the pressure off BushCo, is the one that goes: But EVERYONE said he had WMD, even France, even Clinton (Bill)! That could be easily refuted, ie, the ‘brilliance’ of starting a war over that thought, if only Clinton (Billary) hadnt fudged away any spot to stand on later on by being deliberately fudgy on the war. And when the winds were at the back of WAR, the fudge ran that-a-way, from Camp Clinton.

Not so, er, say France. So when Chirac was dealt the same BushCo “we aint to blame, you thought so too!” he could and did say, “But we didnt think it right to kick out inspectors and start a war as a first resort, on a suspicion. So we said a definitive NO to this war.”

But Clinton cant do that. Because Billary never said so.

It isnt brilliance. But it is the sort of shiny fudge product that Americans still are willing to buy.

71. cad - 24 May 2007

do the prez potentials going to yearlykos understand at all that kos speaks for about 25 people?

72. marisacat - 24 May 2007

NYCee

exactly re the Republican debate. he tracked it back to Mossadegh, I think. It is decades of oil and geopolitical policy.

Fundie freaks on both sides are just actors, imo.

My most favorite political discussion/interview of all time, at least of what made it to radio (pacifica) and then to text on the netteries.

Frankly, they needed 9/11 to reinforce the national security state, to enable even greater world domination (if they can bring it off) and to solidify a crumbling political system. And of course, the all the time game: steal from everybody especially the poor (Green Arnold wants to whack nearly a half billion from the poor out here).

Pretty damn clear.

And tiny bought pipettes, such as inhabit the rotted groves of A’Listers, are just the tiniest sucking insects on the rotted vegetation.

73. marisacat - 24 May 2007

NYCee

oh I think she has an excellent chance to win the nom… exactly what next not sure. It seems time to change the reins. Much can be accomplished. Voter/voting issues diminsish… and the party is not interested, hardly at all.

Wars become presented differently… Obama for ne has had Samantha Powers on staff from day one. She will sell ‘feeding missions’ til she is an old woman. The Democrats love that, so easy to sell sell sell.

We best look to ourselves about genocide… and not look to the Hutu and Tutsis — as though we ever meant to help anyone. Always about acquisition. Always. That damned movie, Hotel Rwanda (just becuase the movie is good, in some senses, does not preclude it being very useful propaganda) will be used to sell our wars of acquisition imo. Perfect liberal sop.

People quote Smedley Butler frm his later writings, but he got it at age 19, I think it was 1910… as a marine he was off loaded to wade ashore at Nicaraqua, he knew, in a letter home to his parents, all for international corps.

Stoller can be accurate and still be a shill. The netteries will be brought to heel for whomever the nom is.

74. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Hey, speaking of Stoller!

Airing out a rant here from the recent past. I wrote this after seeing a Stoller bit, on your blog a while back, and then copied into writing program to tidy up for later. I forgot it, it languished there. Youve reminded me.

First, the quote that inspired (He had just shared a stage with Tom Friedman, both guest speakers at some event, and he lamented that he neglected to lance that engorged boil upon the Grey Lady’s arse, aka, Friedman):

============

Oh, lawdy.

Here’s a chance! Lance the self-adoring windbag full of noxious gases. Lance him dead center!

More from the Stoller link, #36:

Yesterday, I did reasonably. [What the hell does that mean? Reasonably what? Awful?] What frustrated me is that I wanted to go after Tom Friedman aggressively, but I did not. He said in his speech that the biggest competitive challenge in the future will be between you and your imagination, and so I wanted to make a joke about him sounding like an Epcot ride. I sort of flubbed it. What I should have said is that Friedman holds a special place in my development. I took a class from him at college on ‘globalization’, and read most of his books. In 2002, he and Ken Pollack were the two people that I relied on for guidance with regards to Iraq. I trusted him. I believed in him. And he got it one hundred percent wrong. And while honest people tend to admit their mistakes, and when the mistake is particularly soaked in blood, do a lot of soul-searching and apologizing, he never has. My mistake in looking at the Iraq war still pains me, and though I was a 24 year old kid with no experience in foreign policy or politics, my gullibility and the betrayal from my former guides still colors my thinking. For someone like Friedman, who should know better and occupies the most valuable opinion space in the world, it’s stunningly immoral to pretend to having no responsibility in this quagmire. All of us are responsible, and the first step is to admit error. Maybe if I said this he finally would have understood where we come from, though I doubt it. But I didn’t say it.

I was really tired because I had been up since 3:30 in the morning working on my speech, and so I didn’t have the composure to say what I should have said with him in the audience. I hadn’t prepared for it, and my preparation takes a lot of time and effort. But I wish I had figured it out anyway. I guess what I’m saying is that I am not a shy person, and I tend to be a no-bullshit type. I don’t mind criticizing powerful people, in person, to their face. I’ve done it before, to Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, Mark Halperin, and John Cornyn, though I’ve learned to be respectful about it or else they know to ignore you. But I didn’t seize this opportunity when I could have. People make mistakes. I know I do. And I’m pretty hard on other when they err. But know that I believe that criticism, including self-criticism, is actually a spur to achievement and not destructive. And so that’s the spirit in which I hope all of us can learn to debate, with an open mind, a civil tone, a tolerance for error, but a withering contempt for bad faith.

75. liberalcatnip - 24 May 2007

I am so tempted to comment Buck up, kos! (along with SYFPH). Pottery Barn rule: You broke it (by supporting blue dogs) – you own it.

Happy bday jam.fuse!

76. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Crickey! Why do we have so many inadequate “kidz” speaking for the Left?

I mean, Jayzuz K-riste, when you know youve got Tom fucking-always-gets-off-the-hook Friedman there, you prepare, Prepare, PREPARE to skewer him at the heart of his fatally flawed Medicine for the Mideast, his Bombs (Preventive WAR!) followed by a palate-pleasing democKracy chaser (Occupation!), or, simply, a criminally insane and criminal nasty arsed ideaR.

Oh dear.

I have no hate in my heart for Stoller or anyone, but damn, why is he sitting on Cspan’s WJ of a morning, or sharing a stage with Friedman? He still needs to get his shite together, dont he? Needs to marinate. And even then, will he ever have the PASSION punch?

Alas alack, the puffed to bursting buffoon gets off again…

Because entrance stage left is armed with a blogospherial pop gun that cant even shoot straight, a pea shooter filled with mushy peas, a heart lacking in passion and an uninformed or unformed (or both) head full of a search for killer ammo in the way of more and better “anecdotes” instead of historical lessons and international laws against wars of aggression, borne of those lesson’s instruction (nuremburg, geneva, UN Charter) borne of consequences most foul, found atop mountains of bones, if one would only cast a glance a short distance backward.

Lessons that should be shouted out are playing out, unidentified, in all their unlearned devastation, center stage in the REAL middle east, not the one that existed in Tom Friedman’s fevered imagination. Playing out in bloody opulence, thanks to the utter idiots who’ve ignored them. Like Friedman. And our peanut gallery on the left.

And this was where he thinks he did “reasonably,” as opposed to badly botching the radio spot?

Hook, please! EXIT!

77. NYCee - 24 May 2007

that should have read “EXIT!

78. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Oh, it keeps getting lost, my EXIT STAGE LEFT, with arrows pointing left. I dont know why – I keep trying to type it different ways, but it disappears.

I truly have no animosity toward Stoller. I just wish these folk who speak for the Left, the youngbloods with thin blood, armed with mics, as they are, would at least get armed with a passion infusion, if not a Chomskyesque arsenal of facts. I can even forgive him his fatally flawed following of the horrendous Pollack/Packer sorts on the war, let him blame it on his mistaken, unformed and uninformed youth, but he should be even more outraged then, having “awakened” … as he claims. Awakened to what and to what degree, I wonder.

Geeze Louise. Get Rosie out there, fer cryin out loud. At least she manages some passion, and she aint nearly so young.

79. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Thanks for the Pacifica Gore Vidal interview, Marisa.

Skimmed for now, but will save to soak up later.

80. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Btw, Sy Hersh was interviewed on DN this am. Couldnt listen then. But…

Transcript ici!

Seymour Hersh: U.S. Indirectly Backed Islamist Militants Fighting Lebanese Army

Islamist militants entrenched in a Palestinian refugee camp in Lebanon are facing an ultimatum to surrender or face further military action. The Lebanese government accuses Fatah al-Islam of having ties with al-Qaeda and the Syrian government. Investigative journalist Seymour Hersh joins us to talk about another theory of who is backing the militant group – the Lebanese government itself, along with the United States. Last March, Hersh reported the U.S. and Saudi governments are covertly backing militant Sunni groups like Fatah al-Islam as part of an overarching foreign policy against Iran and growing Shia influence. [includes rush transcript]

Why am I reminded of the nurturing/strengthening of Hamas, in its infancy, by Israel, in order to use it to weaken their main enemy, AT THE TIME, the PLO?

Why am I reminded of Careful What You Wish For?

Tangled Web, anyone?

Nah, we dont blunder our way into blowback.

(Right On, Rudy! Rudeee! Rudeee!)

81. marisacat - 24 May 2007

if you use those little arrows they activate as HTML prompts or codes or whatever the word is.

Sometimes they can erase everything that came before or after.

82. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Ba’ath party was a CIA construct.

Etc.

83. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Jewish Voice for Peace.

Very nice group.

I wrote to ask and then again to nudge that they highlight the upcoming protest against the occupation – Israel’s, that is. In DC on the 10th of June. United for Peace is sponsoring it. Jewish Voice will have a contingent there.

Got very nice responses, and they corrected what was just an oversight. Check it out, on their website. They often have actions to take online on the I/P issue as well.

Link

84. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Kennedy had murder lists for Iraq’s commie profs, et al. Handed off to CIA. The Routine. Eisenhower runoff.

85. supervixen - 24 May 2007

#36, Miss D: LOL about “Simplicity” – yes, particularly the pantsuit. I kinda liked Agnetha’s silver go-go boots but the outfit that Bjorn (the guitarist) has on is stunning, in a bad way. He must have been trying for some sort of gladiator look.

#48, NYCee: maybe you (and lucid, and anyone else who was in NYC on 9/11) can tell me: what did the WTC collapse sound like? Those of us who weren’t there only saw the soundless TV coverage. I’ve asked people who were in town on that day, and they’ve given me blank looks and said that all they can remember was the sirens of the emergency vehicles. One woman, who was working in a building nearby, remembered the beeping of the firefighters’ emergency alarms under the rubble, but she doesn’t remember the sound of the actual collapse. This is strange to me because I know it must have sounded like the crack of doom. I lived for 25 years in NYC and I know how sound carries through those canyons.

It’s as if people had never heard anything like it before and so their minds didn’t process it.

86. marisacat - 24 May 2007

More from Hersh at DemocracyNow!

So I think the story that we have is that there was a crime, and they were chasing people into one of the Palestinian camps, which are always hotbeds.

God knows the Palestinians are the end of the stick, not only for the West, but also for the Arab world. Nobody pays much attention to them and those places. I’ve been to Tripoli and been into the camps, and they are seething, as they should be. You know, rational people don’t like being mistreated.

And in any case, so what you have is, what seems to me, just a series — the word you could use is “unintended consequences.” I don’t think anybody in the Siniora government anticipated that the people they were covertly supporting to some degree —

I got an email the other day, and I have not checked this out, from somebody who was in the community, in the intelligence community and still consults with the community, he says,

“Why don’t we ask more about the American arms that the fighters of Fatah al-Islam have, are brandishing?” I don’t know if that’s true or not, but I did get that email. And so, that could be true. Both Saudi money and American money, not directly, but indirectly, was fed into these groups.

And what is the laugh riot and the reason I’m actually talking to you guys about this — I usually don’t like to do interviews unless I have a story in The New Yorker — the reason I’m talking about it is because the American government keeps on putting out this story that Syria is behind the Fatah group, which is just beyond belief. There’s no way — it may be possible, but the chances of it are very slight, simply because Syria is a very big supporter, obviously, of Nasrallah, and Bashar al-Assad has told me that he’s in awe of Nasrallah, that he worships at his feet and has great respect for him. The idea that the Syrians would be sponsoring Sunni jihadist groups whose sole mission are to kill the apostates — that is, anybody who doesn’t support their view, the Wahhabi or Salafist view of Sunni religion — that includes the Shia — anybody who doesn’t believe — support these guys’ religions are apostates and are killable, that’s basically one of the crazy aspects of all this, and it’s just inconceivable. Nothing can be ruled out, but that doesn’t make much case, and I noticed that in the papers today there’s fewer and fewer references to this. The newspapers in America are beginning to wise up, that this can’t be — this isn’t very logical. The White House is putting it out hot and heavy as part of the anti-Syria campaign, but it’s not flying, because it doesn’t make sense. So there we are. It’s another mess.

Bingo: it’s another mess

87. cad - 24 May 2007

in kos land only webb and tester escape condemnation because kos pimped them the most. and kos is never wrong nor does he ever look back. plus, kos wants to be the baby of the webb-tester bear family.

at what point do the dems abandon this phony chevron-pimping arnold-voting phony? by his site’s own pathetic standards of electing only democrats, kos has broken the policy.

88. supervixen - 24 May 2007

cad – yeah, it’s pretty hilarious to see Kos try to deflect blame from Webb and Tester. Nice try, little guy.

Re: Stoller: of course he thinks Hillary is “brilliant”. Those are his standards. I agree with you, NYCee – a callow youth. There are people who are very wise in spite of being very young, but he’s not one of them.

89. marisacat - 24 May 2007

frankly I think all the Blahgers want a white daddy.

Even if white themselves. Or some hunk hero rising from those amber waves of grain… nodding in the setting American sun.

Not to forget Lucius typing iwth one hand over some amber waves hunkette, calling him “McDreamy”.

Does it get more frou frou and 12 years old than that?

90. NYCee - 24 May 2007

supervixen

re: WTC collapse sound.

I didnt hear of any large sound later on, either. Funny, I never wondered about that.

I remember sight and smell.

My experience of the day:

I was scheduled to be right by the WTC, where I worked at the time, a short block and a half away, but as I checked NY1 for the weather before leaving, I caught the first building with plane in it, burning, and then, after talking to workplace, sensibly decided not to go. So I was at home, at the northern edge of lower Manhattan, when the buildings came down. I was inside, glued to the TV. I ran downstairs to get something at the store on the corner. The grocerette had it on TV, the second bldg was coming down on their TV. I heard nothing when outside.

I live a few miles away from the site, but not too far. Actually, at the outer edge of the guarded zone that got temporarily roped off for a few days by the military, state police, city police, you name it. (There was a cordon a few yards outside my door. We had to have ID to get back into our house if we went out of the protected zone, cars were searched before entering.)

We went out walking early in the day to go give blood, and I remember the day as quiet shock, actually, except for NATO planes buzzing overhead, and the like. First Ave was only for buses and emergency vehicles because lots of hospitals are off it – life was all shaken up, but the backdrop was strangely hushed. Lots of other people were rather silently walking toward the hospitals too, north of 14th St. It remained amazingly blue sky and sunny, a temperate, gorgeous day, but just look eastward and it was hell – grey mountains of smoke and dust high and wide.

91. outofwater - 24 May 2007

SV-Jake is likely Armando. They have very similar usage and vocabulary.

92. NYCee - 24 May 2007

There goes my impaired directionality, again. I meant, just look SOUTHward, not eastward, to see the hellish sky.

I do catch myself, thank god, or Id never arrive home again. :-)

93. missdevore - 24 May 2007

an embarassment of kerrying favor–Kerry is quoting kos in his reclist diary today.

but who amongst us does not love to quote kos?

94. Revisionist - 24 May 2007

Someone help me out here…..

Miniumum wage was attached to the Fake Bill that Will Be Vetoed.

Didnt the donkles pass min wage in their 100 hours dog and pony show…

Lol… quick can anyone remeber what they actually did during that PR gimmick.

95. JJB - 24 May 2007

NYCee,

If you go into the previous thread, I posted a link to an interview of Hersh by CNN where he made those claims as well. There was also a piece at Counterpunch yesterday that I linked to even the thread before that one.

Speaking of CounterP, Cockburn (whose stuff I’ve been reading for over 30 years now, from the days when he was quite clearly a fan of the USSR and squiring Lally Weymouth during her Flaming Red days before George Will stole her from him and turned her politics around) believes that investigating so-called conspiracy theories has prevented leftists from performing the sort of work they should be doing with regards to changing the political and economic system. That’s what he says anyway. My own feeling is that like a number of lefties back in the mid-60s, he was scared to death that there might actually be some link found between Oswald and either the KGB or Castro’s security services, and that this would lead to an invasion of Cuba or WWIII. I.F. Stone was not one normally to accept the government’s word about matters such as political assassinations, coups d’etat, etc., but he authored (along with Dwight MacDonald) a defense of the Warren Commission Report. Actually, the controversy over the Kennedy Assassination probably did more to make US citizens skeptical of their government and the Military-Industrial Complex than any amount of leftist organizing would have. As to his views on global warming (which he doesn’t deny is taking place he merely believes humans and their habits aren’t responsible), I put them down to the grumblings of an Anglo-Irish crank. Although he’s not, strictly speaking, Anglo-Irish, his parentage and place of upbringing have probably worked the same sort of lunatic magic on him that it did on the genuine articles. Someone who helped get him his job at The Village Voice many years ago once labeled him “an admiral in the British sponge fleet,” which I count as the most devastating and funny putdown I’ve ever heard.

96. lucidculture - 24 May 2007

Jam.fuse – happy b-day mate. You’re not alone – my sex life is currently at the yearly vag level as well.

SB – our main page is here. But if you wait until tomorrow, I’ll have new material up on our sonic bids site. Also for all those in NYC, we’re playing tomorrow night at The Mean Fiddler at 266 W 47th Street. We go on at 10. Come out if you like.

SV – I was about a mile away when it collapsed. I honestly don’t remember what it sounded like. It shook the floor of my office though – and sent a huge electrical spike that killed all of our ethernet cards [which I spent the rest of the day replacing - eerily like fixing rivets in "Heart of Darkness"].

NYCee – I was at the demo on Feb. 15. The phone lines for UFPJ had been deliberately cut by NYPD that morning to prevent any communication by the organizers. That march was a disaster. I took me 4 hours to walk 20 blocks up 3rd Ave. I finally left when I started seeing horses trample people and cops pepper spraying the crowd about 10 feet in front of me. If you know of any more marches like the one you went to the other day, let me know – I’ll come.

And as for CT’s. Well, I’m a CTist. If one observes what our intelligence agencies have done the world over, from Iran to Latin America, it is not a far stretch to think elements of our government are responsible not just for assasinations, but terrorism as well.

97. liberalcatnip - 24 May 2007

Biden:

“I believe as long as we have troops in the front line, we’re going to have to protect them,” said Sen. Joseph Biden (news, bio, voting record), D-Del. “We’re going to have to fund them.”

Biden was alone among the potential Democratic candidates in immediately pledging his support for the bill.

Quel surprise.

98. marisacat - 24 May 2007

JJB

and

lucid

just bailed out of Moderation, so they are upthread.

**********************

I jsut got my FNNIEST ever spam (and I have had over 100K in spam)

A penile enlargement PATCH.

LOL man alive.

I will be posting it as a “need a laugh” in the next post…

99. outofwater - 24 May 2007

Has the House voted on the Capitulation Bill yet? I turned C-Span on a little bit ago and they were debating ethics, most were opposed.

I contacted my blue dogs about the Iraq vote, they wouldn’t fess up on their plans, as if I didn’t know. Cowards.

100. jam.fuse - 24 May 2007

thanks lucid — I was just being modest…

I’ll check out your outfit manana if I can swing it

101. brinn - 24 May 2007

re#38 — heh, Tuston, count me in. Have Yoda for prezeldent, we will! ;)

Oh, and ya’ll? thanks for all of the kudos about the ‘death tags” thing, but remember that it was stringbean’s idea, I just did something about it.

By the by, does anyone know where I can find a real accurate congressional district map for the 50 states? I am thinking of doing individual state pages for my little project….

The hard part at this point is thinking up the best backend for updates…damn, I hate thinking about that.

102. marisacat - 24 May 2007

Oh there is stress in the land. Early days, they can play with opposing the party.

Months to reel them in. And plenty will be voting for Hillary+Whomever.

Gotta stop voting for them and ESP stop voting for Blooooooooooooo Dogs and New Dems and DLC.

Yes I am laughing at the Blahgers.

******************

I see MB is again commenting.

In agnostic prayer. I just let him out of Moderation.

103. brinn - 24 May 2007

oh, and Kevin, lucid? You both reminded me why I fucking love poetry — in a big way. Thanks for sharing ‘em!

104. brinn - 24 May 2007

re#14 and moiv:

lady, you are an inspiration to me! You kick ass! When next you find yourself down Austin-way, I had better get to buy you lunch….don’t make me come up there! ;)

105. marisacat - 24 May 2007

JJB

‘Admiral in the British sponge fleet’ is just top notch.

Like the sailor boys (and a GIRL! we are modern!)in the waters off Al faw, squiring Japanese cars thru the straits… till Iran nabbed them.

Wars for commerce and acquisition.

Wht a laugh.

106. lucidculture - 24 May 2007

Cool Jam.fuse. My bro’s coming to town for it too.

Thanks Brinn. I always try to please.

107. NYCee - 24 May 2007

Oh, off now, but will look at it later, JJB.

I got your gist on the squeamishness re conspiracy… delve more later.

Lucid, sure thing, will do. Village Independent Democrats emailed me re the march. They are the ones who supported Tasini bigtime, gave him their space as HQ, etc.

108. brinn - 24 May 2007

#48 — damn, NYC, Inherit the Toxic Wind — I feel another masterwork coming on for this group.

I love hanging out here — so many brilliant, talented, creative, PASSIONATE people.

109. liberalcatnip - 24 May 2007

they were debating ethics, most were opposed.

lol…what can you say? ;)

110. brinn - 24 May 2007

gots to go for a bit….have a great afternoon!

111. Useful Idiot - 24 May 2007

Re:

http://marisacat.wordpress.com/2007/05/23/the-mismanaged-war/#comment-57080

He used the contraction “who’s” instead of “whose.”

I am frequently amazed at how bad a writer he is, not only in terms of bad writing, but also sheer ignorance of spelling, grammar and punctuation.

112. cad - 24 May 2007

and funny how yesterday the kos meme was “stop crying and play ball” and today kos is outraged!

picture a waifish bully lover holding his finger in the wind…

113. marisacat - 24 May 2007

hmm just received this as an anonymous email…

Now everyone is talking dirty to the congress-persons who dare to
write on dailykos.

So is the early revolt really that strong over there?

Because I am rather unimpressed. Timing is on the Dems side here… long way to actual primaries long way to the convention long way to election.

Lotta time to reel in the ever faithful.

I have heard Hamsher (on AAR with someone from FAIR) and Ed Schultz and Thom Hartmann.. all railing but iwth little dodges built in (hartmann even used Lieberman: remember the pooooor Dems are held hostage by Lieberman! Who will, horrors, LEAVE! Remember the ALAMO! This is the party that never got mad at Zell, only Jimmy publically addressed the issue and rebuked him).

They know they have time.

Not to be a downer, but it just happens sooo dmaned much.

Maaaaybe iwth a big tragedy on the ground… and Bush already Warned! It will Get Bloody as They they they try to drive us out.

Or 6 dollar gas.

114. marisacat - 24 May 2007

ever weakening having no strength to do other than what they believe.
AAR saying Nancy “may” vote “against part of the bill”..

I see tables with nothing on them!

WHAMBULANCES!!

whaaaaaambulance for democracy (such as it was, let’s not weep TOO much). Whambulance for any domestic agenda. whambulance for the future!

115. cad - 24 May 2007

hey kids buck up!

there’s still 3 to go down in the 5th with bases loaded!

sports people power!

and please a leave a check on your way out.

116. liberalcatnip - 24 May 2007

The house is now debating the Iraq war funding – 5:15 pm ET. Obey’s up first.

117. marisacat - 24 May 2007

A caller to Ed Schultz said Reid should step down.

Oh Ed squashed one quick. He said it was “too much trouble”.

LOL

They should step down, if we are to believe the election. But let’s get real.

They just shift the talk to pat the electorate down.

118. missdevore - 24 May 2007

oh i see it is ShutYourFuckingCongressionalPieholeToday at dk! Oh well, Luscious is doing another preachy “let us not become blahblah blah ..”

119. marisacat - 24 May 2007

New thread:

Nutsacks on the move!

LOL listening to Ed Schultz… he had Stupak on, who is pro-life (very pro life, think he serves on the board at Democrats for Life). He says he voted agaisnt the war in 2002 but he does not know how he will vote today.

His “closest advisors” are split. He says his district is still split 50/50 on the war… He pulled out the old “support the troops” and we “need more Dems in congress” so we can override Bush.

Oh you just have to laugh. They all sound alike!

Cue the chorus!

120. liberalcatnip - 24 May 2007

Murtha just spoke in favour of the bill (?) and now he’s having a tantrum on the floor in response to Shays.

My intertubes are clogged today. Dang snow.

(Jerry Lewis looks suspiciously like Peter Graves.)

121. aemd - 24 May 2007

“I am watching spam in the Rose Garden… strangely the birds are singing.

They too should leave and nto give him cover.”

Oh no, the birds must stay and keep covering him. :-D

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2007/05/bush_in_line_of_1.html

122. BooHooHooMan - 24 May 2007

aemd, Fucking Hilarious! Olberman just showed it too. As for catnips #5, maybe a bird poo front is moving in on the East Coast..

123. BooHooHooMan - 24 May 2007

re: (retro?) MB A bit back, no?

Are the boylovers inker chiefs in need of remedial scouting?
Why in the hell do they wander over to the campfiregirls mid-roast? How embarrassing to lecture resourceful women alongside their blaze, Blades, on the finer points of making fire only to find yourself the subject of YOUR OWN personal weenie roast. I’m not sure what was more misguided —a DK Scoutmaster making steam with two soggy schticks or, when trying to quell giggles, he damn near ignited his own index fingers in that tsk tsk tsk fashion of his..

Chevron and spontaneous combustion: not a good mix for angry boys when they meet their matches.


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