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Sunday Afternoon Thread… ;) 29 July 2007

Posted by marisacat in 2008 Election, Germany, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter, Italy.
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I just heard on PBS’s To the Contrary, that Merkel recently went to Riyadh and shook whomever’s hand (whoever is still upright, I would guess) and wore neither scarf nor skirt nor covering.  A pantsuit and bareheaded.

 I am all for it, I hate that western women feel constrained to cover up.

STOP DOING IT.

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Comments»

1. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

Good for her … what’s laughable is that while we supposedly wear scarves out of respect for them, we have no problem dropping tons of bombs on them … better to ignore the head-covering thing, and show respect by not killing them.

I love that pic …. :-)

2. Hair Club for Men - 29 July 2007

They have a knee-jerk reaction, like all ditto heads, to anything that seems even remotely ‘liberal’. It’s the reason why they reacted to Cindy Sheehan the way they did.

I made the same connection. I’ve never totally understood exactly why Cindy Sheehan pushes peoples buttons as effectively as she does.

But I was reading the Pentagon Papers the other day and Chomsky’s interpretation of the “out of control American” the ruling classes were so afraid of during the Vietnam War. He argues that the Pentagon decided not to escalate at the tail end of the Vietnam War because they thought they’d need the troops for “out of control Americans” at home.

It seems to me that Sheehan acts on impulses nobody can really predict or control. It’s personal for her. They killed her son. She’s emotive in person on stage. It’s easy for people at Dkos and LGF to mock it (Oh she’s crazy yada yada) but it also seems to scare them.

In a culture of perfect militarism and comformity, very public female emotion is terrifying to both the right and the “reality based community”. It’s an echo of that “out of control American” Chomsky talks about.

Same with the flash your breasts protest. That seems like another attempt to appeal to the idea that something out of contol, beyond mocking (and it’s hard to humiliate people who have already decided to flash Hillary Clinton in public).

Kos and the people who post there are very much in control. They’re perfectly willing to swallow the war in Iraq or the Patriot Act or anythng else as long is it means a Democrat gets in the White House.

Right now Hillary looks pretty good but what if you have some incident (some Beruit Barracks scale of attack) that sours the American people on the Democrats for supporting the war?

3. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

Photo series from German site.

4. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

good for Merkel, but it’s also an appeal to her country’s right. Anti-muslim sentiment in Germany (mainly aimed at immigrant turks) is very strong.

5. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

“Interview with History” is a wonderful book. I’m trying to think if I can think of an interviewer as devasting in the past 20-30 years. Perhaps it is also because folks in power are also more insulated, and only grant audiences to softballers.

Sorry Orianni got so rabid toward Muslims in her later years.

I read somewhere today that a bunch of Qatar princesses held up an Al Atalia flight because they would not sit near males who were not related to them. Then they were kicked off the plane to the applause of the the rest of the flyers.

The princesses, all traditionally dressed, had been shopping in Milan for the day.

How much of the applause stemmed from xenophobia, and how much stemmed from the recognized absurdity of demanding cultural courtesies for the decadent habits of obscenely rich people, I dunno.

6. supervixen - 29 July 2007

Oh this is outrageously hilarious:

since you don’t believe me… (1.00 / 1)
you really need to read Who Stole Feminism.

Christina Hoff Sommers of the American Enterprise Institute delved into these uncomfortable waters in Who Stole Feminism. The one-in-four statistic, she found, was derived from a survey of 3,000 college women in 1982. Researchers used three questions to determine if respondents had been raped: Have you had sexual intercourse when you didn’t want to because a man gave you alcohol or drugs? Have you had sexual intercourse when you didn’t want to because a man threatened or used some degree of physical force… to make you? And, have you had sexual acts…when you didn’t want to because a man threatened to use some degree of physical force… to make you?
Based on women’s responses, researchers concluded that 15 percent of women surveyed had been raped and 12 percent had experienced an attempted rape. Therefore, 27 percent of women — more than one in four — were either the victims of rape or attempted rape. This is the origin of the one-in-four statistic.

Yet other data from that same survey undercut its conclusion. While alcohol surely plays a part in many rape cases, the survey’s wording invites the label of rape victim to be applied to anyone who has ever drank too much, had a sexual encounter, and then regretted it later. In addition, only 25 percent of the women whom researchers counted as being raped described the incident as rape themselves. The survey found that four in ten of the survey’s rape victims, and one in three victims of attempted rape, chose to have intercourse with their so-called attacker again. The survey researchers scratched their heads as to why these women would return to their attackers, but Sommers asks the obvious question: “Since most women the survey counted as victims didn’t think they had been raped, and since so many went back to their partners, isn’t it reasonable to conclude that many had not been raped to begin with?”

by: thereisnospoon @ Sun Jul 29, 2007 at 13:42:07 PM PDT

Hoff Sommers is a favorite of the right wing.

7. Hair Club for Men - 29 July 2007

I read somewhere today that a bunch of Qatar princesses held up an Al Atalia flight because they would not sit near males who were not related to them. Then they were kicked off the plane to the applause of the the rest of the flyers.

Why not just shuffle a few seats around so they could all sit together?

Seems to me as if there’s a lot of information here that you’d need to make a decision. Where was the flight going? If it was going to the Middle East, haven’t they dealt with this kind of thing before? Haven’t the Qatar princesses dealt with this sort of thing before? Don’t they know how to buy tickets in blocks?

I remember a few years ago during the Northwestern strike when I was flying out of Seattle back to New York. There was an NFL player (I don’t think he was particularly famous) making a fuss that his backup flight bumped him out of first class.

The boarding agents were getting a real thrill out of telling him to go to hell and everybody around me was enjoying it.

But then I realized that this guy was about 6’6″ and about 280 pounds. I’m about 6’1″ and about 190 pounds and I’m miserable on most planes.

So they argued with him for about 45 minutes wasting everybody’s time and in the end agreed to bump him up to first class. But everybody got a populist thrill out of it.

8. marisacat - 29 July 2007

In a culture of perfect militarism and comformity, very public female emotion is terrifying to both the right and the “reality based community”. It’s an echo of that “out of control American” Chomsky talks about. —- HCfM

absolutely. on target.

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good for Merkel, but it’s also an appeal to her country’s right. — MitM

Yes I agree, but I don’t care anymore. I am sick to death of creeping fundamentalism. Wether it is westerners [fake] kowtowing, in a sense, with this silliness of adopting dress demanded by the religious strictures when just visiting or working in a muslim country with religious police… or to be blunt, putting up with it (religious expression – whether crosses, stars of david or supposed modest dress) in public schools and photos on visas.

It all adds up to creeping fundamentalism.

From what i read the Qatari wives were pissed their personal protocol could not be attended to.

it’s a plane. Take off.

9. supervixen - 29 July 2007

In a culture of perfect militarism and comformity, very public female emotion is terrifying to both the right and the “reality based community”. It’s an echo of that “out of control American” Chomsky talks about. —- HCfM

absolutely. on target.

Not just any old emotions, either – ANGER and RAGE. Angry, rageful women who aren’t afraid to express their anger and rage scare the living shit out of certain people.

10. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

the story, FWIW.

http://tinyurl.com/2ek4s2

11. marisacat - 29 July 2007
12. JJB - 29 July 2007

Hair Club,

Why not just shuffle a few seats around so they could all sit together?

If they insist on being so devout, why are they jetting off to Milan to shop? Do they sell really good veils there?

Actually, given the obscene wealth of such people, they could just as easily have flown a private jet.

On the one hand, they want the benefits of 21st century life, on the other, they demand people accommodate their medieval customs. They should just stay home next time.

13. JJB - 29 July 2007

MCat,

Here’s a snippet from the first item in that Google search, from Britain’s Daily Mail:

The women, all relatives of the oil-rich emir of Qatar, Bader Bin Khalifa Al Thani, were booked into business class in a party of eight which included the emir and an entourage of cooks, servants and other staff.

After passengers had fastened their seat-belts and the plane had taxied on to the runway, two male passengers in the entourage got up to protest about where the women were sitting.

According to the customs of Qatar and other Gulf states, women are not allowed to mix with men who are not relatives.

As I say, these people have more than enough money to either charter or buy their own planes for their shopping expeditions.

14. marisacat - 29 July 2007

They had 8 seats and needed to work it out amongst those 8 seats.

As it was from reports I read the flight was held up 4 hours. Geesh.

When they later took an Alitalia flight they were mixed, between business class (for the royals) and steerage for the staff. Somehow that worked ..

well right they can charter a flight or own a plane for shopping trips.

15. JJB - 29 July 2007

Sorry for the duplication, feel free to eliminate the second one.

16. Hair Club for Men - 29 July 2007

They had 8 seats and needed to work it out amongst those 8 seats.

As it was from reports I read the flight was held up 4 hours. Geesh.

OK. I would have cheered when they kicked them out too.

17. marisacat - 29 July 2007

Just let one of SuperVixen’s out of spam… so it is upthread.

Sorry!

18. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

Rotten Justice – Ralph Nader

Why don’t these and other Democratic and Republican Senators say plainly what they say privately day after day: that they believe that the Attorney General has lied under oath, and not just once.

Again, they avoid the logical conclusion.

But then the Democrats have been doing this dance of evasion with George W. Bush on a far larger scale for four years. After all, Gonzales’ impeachable offenses are his superiors’. Gonzales took the orders; Bush-Cheney gave the orders. The litany of Bush-Cheney impeachable abuses extends far beyond those associated with Gonzales, foremost among them of course Bush plunging the nation into a bloody, costly war-quagmire on a platform of fabrications, deceptions and cover-ups again and again, year after year. And Gonzales took the orders; Bush-Cheney gave the orders—a more serious basis for a Congressional demand for their resignation or the commencing of impeachment proceedings in the House of Representatives.

Compare the many impeachable offenses of Bush-Cheney with the certain impeachment of President Richard K. Nixon that was rendered moot by his resignation in 1974.

Instead of a sex scandal, as with Clinton, there is a serial constitutional scandal oozing ongoing repeated constitutional crimes. For which alas, there is only one constitutional remedy arranged by the framers — impeachment.

And that remedy the Democrats took “off the table” after they won the Congress last November and before they even took office. Just what the White House recidivists needed to know to keep at it. What a lesson for future generations.

Most Americans do not want their members of Congress to practice rushing to judgment. Nor do they want their members to rush away from judgment. The Democrats, with very few exceptions, are very good at escaping from their constitutional responsibilities.

It is time to hold the Bush-Cheney-Administration responsible for their indefensible acts.

19. Hair Club for Men - 29 July 2007

Not just any old emotions, either – ANGER and RAGE. Angry, rageful women who aren’t afraid to express their anger and rage scare the living shit out of certain people.

Matt Taibbi is a much more clever rich white boy than the Kos cretins.

He was able to take that anger and rage and put it into a very Catholic/Christian framework of pain/sin/suffering and then turn around and use it to attack the idea of a populist utopia.

LINK

In the Sixties, the anti-war movement was part of a cultural revolution: If you opposed Vietnam, you were also rejecting the whole rigid worldview that said life meant going to war, fighting the Commies, then coming back to work for the man, buying two cars and dying with plenty of insurance. That life blueprint was the inflexible expectation of the time, and so ending the war of that era required a visionary movement.

Iraq isn’t like that. Iraq is an insane blunder committed by a bunch of criminal incompetents who have managed so far to avoid the lash and the rack only because the machinery for avoiding reality is so advanced in this country. We don’t watch the fighting, we don’t see the bodies come home and we don’t hear anyone screaming when a house in Baghdad burns down or a child steps on a mine.

The only movement we’re going to need to end this fiasco is a more regular exposure to consequence. It needs to feel its own pain. Cindy Sheehan didn’t bring us folk songs, but she did put pain on the front pages. And along a lonely Texas road late at night, I saw it spread.

20. colleen - 29 July 2007

Hoff Sommers is a favorite of the right wing.

Wow. No kidding. We’re right there in Little Green Footballs/Independent Women’s Forum territory here.

He’s either trying to instigate a very public fight demonstrating what fucking losers Daily Kos participants are just i8n time for the convention or he’s trying for employment as the Heritage Foundation’s fake ‘liberal’ white male, oppressed by old Democratic women but still fighting the good fight for rapists everywhere.

21. Hair Club for Men - 29 July 2007

Pretty interesting film review attacking “Knocked Up” and criticizing the idea that you only have an either/or, “old feminism” or “new feminism” choice.

http://rwor.org/a/097/knocked-up-en.html

But this movie wasn’t made for a conservative Christian audience. It was made for the 20-somethings who are smart and savvy and having one-night stands and embracing porn culture. It was made for those shaped by Sex in the City -style “feminism” where participating in the commodification of sex and women’s bodies is thought to be a form of “liberation.” It is made for a generation that is technically pro-choice, but increasingly becoming convinced that abortion is “irresponsible,” “tragic,” and even “sinful.”

22. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

sv and colleen – stop beating that poor boy with your scary clue spoons. The future of democracy depends on an empty cutlery drawer.

23. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

Shit. Stray bullets kill 4 as Iraqis celebrate Asian Cup triumph. I’ve been hoping not to see this headline all day.

24. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

jesus, it’s just a funny movie.

25. marisacat - 29 July 2007

This part of the film review (just pulled it up) of “Knocked up”… is just propaganda:

It is made for a generation that is technically pro-choice, but increasingly becoming convinced that abortion is “irresponsible,” “tragic,” and even “sinful.”

26. Hair Club for Men - 29 July 2007

The New York Times gets spun by Stormfront.

NYTimes

The injured man had been one of the speakers at the rally, organized by the ProAmerica Society, which urges stricter enforcement of immigration laws.

The Stormfronters themselves are very open about who he is.

link to stormfront.org

27. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

Hair Club for Men – I heard the writer/director and star of the movie interviewed on Fresh Air recently and kind of wondered whether the movie would be as horrible as it sounded. After reading the review in your link, I can see why it came to mind in the context of the spoonfight today.

28. Hair Club for Men - 29 July 2007

I haven’t seen it. I just though that review was interesting.

29. jam.fuse - 29 July 2007

‘Nother OG&P reference from mlw thread under discussion, emphasis mine:

bullshit (7.00 / 2)

find one comment over there [dk] where I said one thing about this site [mlw] that was in the least bit negative.

you won’t, because I don’t.

So if you have a beef with others, that is fine, don’t lump me in with them. That isn’t fair to me, and I don’t deserve that.

Frankly, it is bullshit to do so.

by: clammyc @ Sat Jul 28, 2007 at 15:04:41 PM PDT

Never said you did (10.00 / 6)

I was referring to what you said here

embarrassing (4.00 / 8)

the fact that so much time is wasted, oh sorry, “spent constructively” bashing every thing that goes on over there. What a great community this is. I thought Marisacat already served that purpose.

So, you come over here, accuse us bashing everything at dkos, make a sarcastic comment about the community and then compare us to a site that is almost universally reviled. And you have a problem with being lumped in with the MLW haters, why?

by: billybush @ Sat Jul 28, 2007 at 15:50:29 PM PDT

Almost universally reviled, mind you.

30. marisacat - 29 July 2007

i cannot even follow threads at Wingless, but “almost”

that has me laughing out loud.

Must. work. harder.

The last event from that corner was poor Diane W completely confused as to her own commenting history. And coming here to correct me.

Still laughing.

31. Paul - 29 July 2007

Sabrina Ballerina: … better to ignore the head-covering thing, and show respect by not killing them.

That’s exactly what I said when I saw Pelosi wear the head-scarf. If she’d impeach Bush she wouldn’t feel that guilt compelling her to compensate by wearing that scarf, which is not a part of her culture.

32. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

I laughed my ass off at that movie.

33. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

Paul, I remember when Bush sent one of his women, forget which one, mommy types he keeps around to ‘educate’ the women of the ME. She made a complete fool of herself, when she found herself among educated, intelligent women who had the temerity to ask her if she had any idea how Bush’s wars were affecting Muslim mothers and had no interest in her trite, empty rhetoric.

Oh yes, it was Karen Hughes, a more clueless woman would be hard to find, except maybe on DK (points please for ‘most despised’ title) …. her head was nicely handed to her by women who actually do know what’s going on in the world her ‘president’ is creating for Muslim women and children, and not about to be placated …. I’m sure she wore a scarf, though. Out of respect.

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Rotfl Must. work. harder. Marisacat

I’m disappointed too – and we do try …

Spoonless is so clueless (which is probably a blessing) he really didn’t seem to understand how completely he was evicerated. Normally I have sympathy for those who are in the minority, but he just kept coming back for more … his ignorance, not just on women’s issues, is stunning considering his self-certainty that all the world is wrong and awaiting his words of wisdom.

He helped demonstrate what will happen to all ‘Kosacks’ when they leave the safe environs of DK. They really are not ready for the real world … he is indoctrinated and doesn’t fare well with people who can think for themselves. .

One amusing exchange in the thread was when BC imitated those who complain about DK bashing on MLW – ‘I’m sick of Bill O’Reilly bashing on MLW etc. Poor Spoonless missed the sarcasm. That’s something I noticed when trying to communicate with them on DK. They really don’t get nuance …. they see only black and white. I tried once to explain sarcasm to one of them who was troll-rating a commenter for a JOKE! It was useless, she couldn’t get it! Probably what makes them easy to indoctrinate ….

34. marisacat - 29 July 2007

well… nobody the likes of thereisnospoon (and some others) FPs here.

Not to put too fine a point on it…

8)

and you know, with one voice as ‘the site’ and LOL universally appreciated threads with several voices, the vists today, a slow Sunday in mid summer, is over 2,500.

So……. I am not too worried what the clammycs, thereisnobrain, and billiebushs say about me…

35. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

Almost universally reviled? Damn. We’re obviously not working hard enough on the “vile” thing.

sv and colleen – stop beating that poor boy with your scary clue spoons. The future of democracy depends on an empty cutlery drawer.

I’d like to buy a fork.

As for Sheehan, the attitude of some of her detractors towards her absolutely echoes Coulter’s disdain for the 9/11 widows. People are pissed off that she lost her son and that, as so-called fucking “progressives”, that doesn’t allow them to go absolutely beserk (although some definitely have) on Sheehan. I really have sensed that underlying frustration throughout this entire controversy at dkos coming from many who would gladly throw her off the bus completely but feel that they can’t because they have to maintain their lefty image. It’s just hypocrisy of the worst kind.

And worse, of course, are the ones who have trashed her and don’t give a shit that she lost her son or who think she should “get over it” while this bloody war continues day after day and more sons and daughters are lost – each one reopening that wound.

As for the emotion she displays, it’s much more symbolic of the very public grief expressed in the ME and Asia etc. – where there isn’t a fear of being seen overwhelmed completely by pain. Afaic, that is emotional freedom and it sure doesn’t sell well in the anal-retentive, conservative west. No wonder we’re so heavily medicated. We can’t stand ourselves.

36. marisacat - 29 July 2007

the thing with Cindy, it was always going to be her own trajectory. If it intersected, fine, if people liked it or disliked it, whatever, That was a far far far second, or maybe even a no show in the line up.

So many people at the beginning felt her journey, crusade, mission, series of events that occured, whatever the words, that it had to be this or that, or another “thing”.

It was just going to be what ever it was. So many never could see that.

37. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

I think the thing w/ Cindy is related to the thing Raimondo wrote about in the link someone posted here.

I think she breaks the heroic narrative. She isn’t the brave grieving mother in the movies, dropping to the floor in grief, hugging the flag, then GOING AWAY until she’s needed for the next ritual. She isn’t playing along w/ the accepted narrative, repeating the proper script.

The men and women we send off to murder and to die for us are supposed to be warrior priests, and their mothers are supposed to be Mary at the foot of the cross, willingly sacrificing their Son, waiting to clean the body and willing to suffer in silence.

Cindy and so many of the other mothers (and fathers) won’t reinforce the fairy tale, and boy do Americans want/need/treasure that fairy tale, the one where we’re the virtuous Knights and saviors of the world … and the Knights who fall in battle are Templars fighting for our WAY OF LIFE™.

The bitch is breaking the rules, and that is unforgivable.

38. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

With no apologies to Howard Dean:

Not only are we going to be reviled in America, we’re going to revile them in Togo, Turkmenistan, Algeria, Tuvulu, Lichtenstein, Morocco, Norway, the Congo, New Zealand and then we’re going to go to Canada and take on the Canadians! YEARRGH!

39. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

It was just going to be what ever it was. So many never could see that.

True and very reflective of dkos types who like to think they can control everything and everyone. I doubt very many of them colour outside of the lines there.

40. marisacat - 29 July 2007

I’d like to buy a fork

That just makes me laugh over and over. Pat and Vanna, I’d like to buy a vowel please… ;)

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SInce I am not reviled quite enough, here is a tip for all cat keepers.

Baby is rejecting the new Sheba line. I was so delighted, something new (the best thing to do for Baby, I keep switching her food so she does not get bored) and when I saw they had “Tuna and Mussels”… I thought … hot damn, something absolutely new, mussels.

Does not like their chicken, nor their tuna nor their tuna iwth mussels. I don’t pay full freight (1.20 for 2.8 oz) I waited til it was on sale and then bought some.

These cats. Always something up their sleeves.

41. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

Charges pit free speech against highway safety

Jeff Zurawski, 39, of Downers Grove and Sarah M. Hartfield, 45, of Naperville were initially charged with disorderly conduct for displaying a banner that read “Impeach Bush and Cheney – LIARS” on May 6 on the Great Western Trail above Interstate 355.

But more charges were brought against the two war protesters last week in DuPage County Circuit Court in Wheaton: reckless conduct and unauthorized display of a sign in viewing of a highway, both misdemeanors.

The new charges each carry a penalty of up to one year imprisonment, while the original charge was up to a three-month sentence in the county jail.

“This is political prosecution,” said environmental rights attorney Shawn Collins, who has taken on Zurawski and Hartfield’s case pro bono. [snip]

Opposing ideologies

The trouble allegedly began when three DuPage County sheriff’s deputies arrived on the scene as Zurawski and Hartfield were packing up their signs.

One of the deputies said a call was received that items were being thrown from the bridge, which both Zurawski and Hartfield deny.

“That would be senseless endangerment and destruction of innocent lives,” Hartfield said. “I’m a peace activist, and anyone who knows me knows I would never throw anything over the overpass, endangering someone’s life.”

During their conversation with the deputies, one deputy allegedly took personal offense at the protest, citing his war veteran status and that of his son, who is serving in Afghanistan.

After providing their personal information to the deputies, Zurawski and Hartfield left without a citation. It was three weeks later that arrest warrants were issued for each on the charge of disorderly conduct.

Now, a month later, the charges have been upgraded.

42. marisacat - 29 July 2007

They better BAN cell phones in cars. Reckless conduct. Forget regulations on how one may speak on a cell phone. They probably should ban passengers, esp children.

Only the driver, completely unimpeded from a straight line.

43. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

priorities

WASHINGTON, July 29 — June was a busy month for Senator Charles E. Schumer. On the phone, at large parties and small gatherings around the nation, he raised more than $1 million from the booming private equity and hedge fund industries for the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, of which he is chairman.

But Mr. Schumer has been busy with hedge fund and private equity managers, an important part of his constituency in New York, in another way as well. He has been reassuring them that he will resist an effort led by members of his own party to single out the industry with a plan that would more than double the taxes on the enormous profits reaped by its executives.

Mr. Schumer has considerable say on the issue. In addition to being the third-ranking Democrat in the Senate leadership, he is the only Democrat serving on both of the major committees, Banking and Finance, that have jurisdiction in the matter.

He has long been a pro-business Democrat and a fund-raising machine for the party, as well as a vociferous supporter of Wall Street issues in Washington, much the way Michigan lawmakers defend the auto industry and Iowa politicians work on behalf of corn farmers.

Okay, can we STOP calling crooked politicians in the pockets of the very wealthy, of hucksters and war profiteers and industries that make profit off of human pain and misery “pro-business”? The kind of people who Schumer and the rest help are no more deserving of help than the family down the road that owns a small business, or an innovator who can’t compete because established corporations are so heavily subsidized. HE’S PRO CAPITAL, not “pro-business”, and NO, they AREN’T the same thing.

So sick of this crap. ANYBODY who votes for these fuckers is voting for more exploitation and division and death and injustice.

44. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

Well, the pattern couldn’t be more clear …. those with whom they ‘lose patience’ are always peace activists, writers like Greg Palast, liberal blogs like Truthout, and anyone who is critical of Israel’s policies towards the Palestinians. People they do not lose patience with are Blue Dog Dems who vote with the Repubs. I remember saying once that I was going to call one of the Dem Sens. about one of the war bills and let them know what I thought of them.

One of the troll kops descended on the comment and told me I better not call him as I was not a constituent. Of course that ensured I absolutely would call and get others to call also. We all have email lists …. went back and reported on the call ….

Re Cindy, she came along at a time when no one had the nerve to challenge this administration. Anyone who tried, was smeared. Most of those who tried, airc, were Republicans …. Cynthia McKinney was the first to call them on the lies they told. She was smeared, but later proven to be right. Lies were told about what she actually said also on the floor of Congress …. early on McKinney did have support, but that was before the BBB got involved. Cindy was perfect, they saw her as unassailable being a grieving mother, and they used her …

Cynthia and she opened the door a crack …. they forget how tightly shut it was back then …. Joe Wilson helped also, and then it became easier … now they do not need her and claim she is ‘an embarrassment’. That is the rightwing word for ‘uppity women’! Used for Cynthia McKinney also … we don’t need the rightwing, DK et al do the job for them. But for some reason, they are frantic that it is understood that Cindy was not banned. Even though they were screaming for her to be banned. I don’t know why it is so important what people think. She was driven off, she left because she had better things to do, as have so many others ….

DK is now all about Bill O’Reilly … and Yrly kos. Btw, what did they accomplish at Yrlykos last year?

This made me laugh … and they think this kind of cynicism is fine and we should all want to help Kos … hilarious, they are not getting much support outside of DK and they don’t understand why …. peopel tried to explain to clueless – some people do have principles.

Cf. (7.00 / 3)

Ann Coulter Boycott Considered Suicidal
Sigh.

by: peeder @ Sat Jul 28, 2007 at 16:50:22 PM CDT
[ Reply ]

*************

i don’t agree (7.00 / 2)

the more the blogs fight with Fox News, the more attention we get. It may be an off-season for blog ads, but it’s just a blip. More and more eyeballs are going to the blogs, and fewer and fewer are going to fox and their ilk.

by: thereisnospoon @ Sat Jul 28, 2007 at 16:57:20 PM CDT
[ Parent | Reply ]

Dream on … the only extra eyeballs are O’Reilly fans although it does make it seem like there is an uptick in page views. But they won’t be buying anything from advertisers … and O’Reilly’s audience has been declining for the past few years, but he is still the most popular cable talk show host … I don’t think this fake fight will do anything to his numbers.

As for the Lowes ads, they stopped in January … then slowly came back … but it’s about ‘attention’. All phony, with clueless verifying it pracctically …

45. jam.fuse - 29 July 2007

kitty sleeves… mine will eat only Iams dry cat food, which she loves.

46. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

Oops, I forgot that Darksyde, not-a-democrat, Reagan lover, administrator of ‘Partisan Democratic Blog’ was so excited about O’Reilly fans visiting, he posted a welcome diary to them! Lol! Really, I think DK is a test …. to see how stupid people really are!

Catnip, you may have encreased our chances for ‘most vile blog’ award with that ‘I’d like a fork’ remark!

and you know, with one voice as ‘the site’ and LOL universally appreciated threads with several voices, the vists today, a slow Sunday in mid summer, is over 2,500.

Damn, and I thought we were just a ‘cul-de-sac’ [h/t to Meteor Blades] or as Miss D said, ‘cull de nutsacks’! And to think you are NOT LINKED! Well, not to the bbbs anyway. I have noticed this blog is linked to by many of the best independent blogs ….

47. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

Madman – That story about Schumer and his private equity and hedge fund promise-parties makes my blood boil. Just another series of pot(of gold)luck suppers on the Senate Banking & Finance campaign stump.

I hear the mafia is very pro-concrete-footwear. (Remember, America, we must support the building trades!)

I watched Borat in chunks (so to speak) on DVD this week, and laughed my ass off at that. I was just a tad worried about the comedic plotline of Knocked Up, given the current state of the gynopolitical nation, when I heard the interview. One wonders how much nutritional value (vs. reinforcement of prevailing agitprop) people really retain from absurdist or satirical humor when they’re (as) desperate (as they are right now) for laughs laughs laughs, god help us, laughs laughs laughs and laughs alone. Be that as it may, I’m as certain as certain can be that laughs laughs laughs alone are overwhelmingly beneficial to public health.

A society’s gotta breathe, too, don’t it?

48. BooHooHooMan - 29 July 2007

Of Nazis on the Podium and “Surveyors” in the Fields.

New Jersey, “the Garden State”.The berries and melons in her downstate fields are now ripe for the pickings in the traditional manner with legions of migrant workers brought in for the task. The sticky humid air and the rich soil of her southern coastal plains produce the sweetest summer corn you can imagine. Many of the smaller operations still hand pick corn, while farm hands operate machinery or perform necessary grunt work elsewhere.

Prized fruits, tomatoes included, are picked by hand. The surreally engorged Jersey “beefsteak” tomatoes are hawked easily by the vendors in Philly’s Italian Market and off of fresh produce trucks driven through city neighborhoods from Wilmington, Delaware to Camden, Trenton, and Newark (“N’ork”) on the Jersey side.

An outsider expecting to listen in on what’s going on in the broiling fields east of Camden, itself the poorest city in the richest nation in the world… the sound of crickets is all they will here.

49. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

New herb*-generated post: The New Cold War

*That’d be catnip, not the other “herb”.

50. marisacat - 29 July 2007

LOL Don’t think so:

Hm, and your Cat Lady blog is a marvel of free speech (0.00 / 0)

The list of people who are banned from posting there, or who have had their comments “moderated” (deleted without ever seeing the light of day) is longer than the list of regular commentators.

Thanks for the good laugh, though . I needed one today.

Once again, I’m at the mercy of someone I wouldn’t let pick my nose!–John Lithgow, “Third Rock from the Sun”

——————————————————————————–

by: The BloggingCurmudgeon @ Sun Jul 29, 2007 at 11:33:48 AM CDT
[ Parent | Reply ]

BlogCudge was asked to take his trashing of Msoc elsewhere. As was donkeytale… I have posted those comments of his (BC’S) several times.

LOL he (BC) is welcome to announce the list of who is banned here.

Since he is so knowledgeable about Mcat…

8)

51. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

Catnip, you may have encreased our chances for ‘most vile blog’ award with that ‘I’d like a fork’ remark!

Just contributing to the cause. ;)

52. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

40-oh perhaps Baby prefers mussels steamed in white wine….

___
I’ve looked at it twice, but cannot make much sense of it yet–kid oakland has some post about “Blog Unity” pins and blogsunited.org at dk….come pick them up and yk2…come join the blogroll,etc.

not sure where it will show up on the blogosphere genealogy tree.

it would be more fun if svix went on clammyc blogtv.

53. BooHooHooMan - 29 July 2007

#37 is Madman at his best. Jesus, you can write, sir.

54. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

53 – Agreed, but let’s leave Jesus out of things for once, since Sheehan has been kind enough (I think?) to do the same.

55. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

well worth the read in the New Yorker “A Zionist politician loses faith in the future”
by David Remnick

http://tinyurl.com/2y97ng

56. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

it would be more fun if svix went on clammyc blogtv.

Great idea!

sv – Go, girl!

Marisacat – have you tried tempting Baby with the hard-working, multimedia flavor of clammyc?

57. BooHooHooMan - 29 July 2007

rolling eyeballs

58. Tuston - 29 July 2007

Booger (one of four kitties) just deposited a headless and gutless mouse carcass on the doorstep for the dogs to finnish (he knows how we feel about bringing vermin inside). The baby bunnies seem to be in short supply while los Chubascos are kickin’…

59. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

Yearly Kos is going Old Testament, it seems to me.

It keeps begetting new entities that beget more, with every page.

60. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

58-will pass on ratatouille references.

61. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

Sorry, BHHM. But I do count it among her virtues, I think.

62. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

it would be more fun if svix went on clammyc blogtv.

They are not that inclusive. The ‘people powered movement’ doesn’t include most of the people …. but if they really wanted to get listeners, if they dared, it sure would be fun.

Bhhm, Mitm sure can write … he is one of the best …

Catnip, keep up the good work. You and ms xeno make me laugh … she pulls no punches. Remember that piece she wrote after the Amanda episode? That was a classic. She sure can write also …

I dare the ‘people-powered net-roots’ to interview ms x! Even I would tune in for that …

Blog Unity! Rotfl …. Is he Kid ding?

63. marisacat - 29 July 2007

if clammyc can fake being flaked fish with shrimp (the current fav from Fancy Feast) LOL she might go for it.

For years she was like jam.fuse’s, who eats only dry Iams… Baby ate FF chunky chicken. I could buy 5 flats of it at PetCo… and 2 flats assorted, beef or fish/tuna/etc. And be set for a few months…

Then things got hairy about 5 years ago. There had to be a selection, a smorgasbord.

I think the Sheba (new version) is too ‘cleaned up’. It has almost no odor. Close to none. And the “sauce” is a nearly clear glaze of some sort.

Too ”cleansed”, for the human’s palate, nto for a raring tearing blind nearly crippled old gato…

8)

64. Revisionist - 29 July 2007

Bloggers. United. Will never be divided.
Bloggers. United. Will never be divided.
Bloggers. United. Will never be divided.
come on y’all join in
Bloggers. United. Will never be divided.

65. jam.fuse - 29 July 2007

If the Kids Are United (1978)

by Sham 69

For once in my life I’ve got something to say
I wanna say it now for now is today
A love has been given so why not enjoy
So let’s all grab and let’s all enjoy

If the kids are united then we’ll never be divided

Just take a look around you
What do you see
Kids with feelings like you and me
Understand him, he’ll understand you
For you are him, and he is you

If the kids are united then we’ll never be divided

I don’t want to be rejected
I don’t want to be denied
Then its not my misfortune
That I’ve opened up your eyes

Freedom is given
Speak how you feel
I have no freedom
How do you feel
They can lie to my face
But not to my heart
If we stand together
It will just be the start

If the kids are united then we’ll never be divided

66. Tuston - 29 July 2007

I keep telling madman he should be in print, but the truth is that his amazing talent for weaving relevant hyperlinks into his text couldn’t translate into “old media,” and it would be like asking a world class marathoner to run in doc martins.

Of course we know he could do it, and better than most hacks who have fulltime employment in the Nooze and Con-mentary press…

****
LOL Mz. D, but I still think he prefers wittle wabbits to a free mouse-keeters…

****

Damn, just started “blogging” and Princess Katterfly is requesting my presence in the boudouir. Well, I know better than to make her wait.

Hasta Luego, viboras…

67. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

Sabrina–when it comes down to it–who is going to tune into that self-selected circle if they are promoting the voices of the exact same people pastordamning started nominating when I was just a tadpole at dk? the popularity contest stuff was never good for the site, nor even the popular writers. the quick adulation reinforced their weaknesses.

much more people would tune in for a BBB-er vs. a VAG, I think.

68. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

ko’s message: “unity, diversity and hope”

What “diversity”? Hello?

69. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

Question for thereisnomoney. How was that ‘New Feminism’ thingy re women using sex to ‘tie men up in strings’ or whatever, supposed to work?

Great diary and great candidate! (12+ / 0-)

I can’t toss in anything at the moment, but I will as soon as I’m able.

I touched the Universe — And back it slid — and I alone — A Speck upon a Ball — Went out upon Circumference — Beyond the Dip of Bell —

by Elise on Sun Jul 29, 2007 at 06:18:33 PM PDT

I thought shaking those boobies was supposed to pay ….

*********

Miss D, that is a good article … looks like the Israeli press is way more free re the Israeli situation than it is here …

In this atmosphere of post-traumatic gloom, Avraham Burg, a former Speaker of the Knesset, managed to inflame the Israeli public (left, right, and center) with little more than an interview in the liberal daily Ha’aretz, promoting his recent book, “Defeating Hitler.” Short of being Prime Minister, Burg could not be higher in the Zionist establishment. His father was a Cabinet minister for nearly four decades, serving under Prime Ministers from David Ben-Gurion to Shimon Peres. In addition to a decade-long career in the Knesset, including four years as Speaker, Burg had also been leader of the World Zionist Organization and the Jewish Agency for Israel. And yet he did not obey the commands of pedigree. “Defeating Hitler” and an earlier book, “God Is Back,” are, in combination, a despairing look at the Israeli condition. Burg warns that an increasingly large and ardent sector of Israeli society disdains political democracy. He describes the country in its current state as Holocaust-obsessed, militaristic, xenophobic, and, like Germany in the nineteen-thirties, vulnerable to an extremist minority.

He would be troll-rated to oblivion if he dared to talk like that on dk.

70. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

MissD – clearly we’ll need to set up a PAC to support svix’s candidacy for an interview on blogTV. Let’s get lawyered up!

71. BooHooHooMan - 29 July 2007

Regardless of the more frothy posts about Marcos ie speculation of CIA sponsorship —isn’t it enough to recognize frauds in plain view???.

Talk about kool aid drinkers.

Some Progressive

tip o the iceberg.

72. jam.fuse - 29 July 2007

wrt yada yada…almost universally reviled… yada yada

to state the obvious — dk and mlw and the dwindling bootrib are not the universe

73. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

IB–if they understand the nature of any media, I think one would simply have to ask.

74. Madman in the Marketplace - 29 July 2007

thanks for the kind words guys. Sweet dreams all.

75. Miss Devore - 29 July 2007

night, MITM.

76. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10725803@N06/946736839/

Another one without a clue.

dk and mlw and the dwindling bootrib are not the universe

Blasphemy!

77. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

Jam-fuse, nice lyrics … and it makes me sad because when I first went online, people were united. The divisiveness seems to have started when the ‘establishment’ blogs appeared on the scene and began the purges. Iow, they stopped the growing movement, at least temorarily.

Miss D,

Sabrina–when it comes down to it–who is going to tune into that self-selected circle if they are promoting the voices of the exact same people pastordamning started nominating when I was just a tadpole at dk? the popularity contest stuff was never good for the site, nor even the popular writers. the quick adulation reinforced their weaknesses.

much more people would tune in for a BBB-er vs. a VAG, I think.

So true, Miss D – more and more I lose interest in even reading them. Their links are boring as they link back and forth from one to the other. The subject matter is never about issues, it’s about politics. From MYDD, Digby, DK back to MYDD and throw in the NYT or the WAPO. They talk about pundits, what this pundit said about that one. Pundits punditting about other pundits. They are now like the old rightwing blogs who got their talking points each day and never strayed from them. They also lost the ability to think outside the memos.

much more people would tune in for a BBB-er vs. a VAG, I think Yes, they would … that would be hit!

But it will never happen, because they have purged from the movement anyone who has an original thought. Before they would ever talk to the base of the party, they will talk to Trevino from Red State, or any other Repub. For some reason they feel more threatened by anyone even slightly to the left of Reagan than they do by Republicans. We are their conscience, and they sold out! It’s hard to face that …

Btw, for all the words typed by them, I have no idea what any of them think about Lebanon (Billmon was the only one and he was ‘admonished’ for it). Kos never mentioned it, Armando had nothing to say about it, nothing on the FP of DK …. now they are silent on Pakistan and Gaza …. either they have no opinion on some of the most important issues facing the world today or they are not allowed to talk about them. That is not what the internet was supposed to do, silence people.

Anyway, I think you are right, they would make MONEY if they dared to speak to Vags! Lol!

78. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

Via the IHT:

JAKARTA, Indonesia: Younis Mahmoud’s victory celebrations were tempered by reality.

Mahmoud scored the winning goal in Iraq’s 1-0 Asian Cup final win over Saudi Arabia on Sunday, yet he feared for his life if he went home to celebrate the stunning victory, and said he would not be returning to the war-torn country.

“I don’t want the Iraqi people to be angry with me,” he said. But, “If I go back with the team, anybody could kill me or try to hurt me.

“One of my closest friends, they (the authorities) came to arrest him, and for one year neither me nor his family knew where he is.”

The Sunni Muslim Iraqi captain — who like the rest of the team wore a black arm band to remember the dozens killed by carbombers following the side’s semifinal victory over South Korea on Wednesday — said the American presence in his homeland was a “problem.”

“I want America to go out,” he said. “Today, tomorrow, or the day after tomorrow, but out. I wish the American people didn’t invade Iraq and hopefully it will be over soon.”
[…]
The team’s players do not live in Iraq and work for clubs across the Middle East — Mahmoud works for Qatar club Al Gharafa and was leading scorer in the domestic league last season.

A bittersweet victory, obviously.

79. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

If they understand the nature of any media, I think one would simply have to ask.

There’s a percentage in that?

Bon soir from the East Coast, too. Thanks for all the laughs laughs laughs.

80. Intermittent Bystander - 29 July 2007

Thanks for the soccer update, too, LC.

81. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

Pundits punditting about other pundits.

Can they be any more obsessed with David Broder and Joe Klein?? The minute I see a blog post with “David Broder wrote…”, I move on.

82. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

to state the obvious — dk and mlw and the dwindling bootrib are not the universe Jam-fuse

Shhhh – we are not in the business of shattering dreams!

Catnip, whose photo bucket is that? Funny screen cap though …

Goodnight, Mitm and Tuston …

83. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

I’m watching the documentary The Ground Truth. Sigh…

THE GROUND TRUTH: After the Killing Ends, takes an unflinching look at the training and dehumanization of US soldiers, and how they struggle to come to terms with it when they come back home.

This film overrides familiar images of heroic soldiers in battle, and overjoyed returning faces, reunited with their families with one effortless stroke. Instead, we see a scenario that can include illness, amputation and injury, depression and post-traumatic stress disorders (PTSD), of which Iraq has become a fertile breeding ground. While America’s poor treatment of veterans is not news to most, The Ground Truth makes it so personal and real, it is impossible to dismiss its characters simply as war statistics.

The film gives us glimpses into a Marine Corps boot camp that allows us to comprehend how a man or woman can kill as part of their job. We get hit with more understanding of our soldiers’ dehumanization by seeing Iraq combat footage that shows routine indiscriminate killing. Their jobs over, the confusion, guilt and shame that comes home with these “killers” is the tip of the iceberg. Left with few resources and families that cannot understand what they have seen or done, their anguish only intensifies. Foulkrod’s graphic footage and still-photographs of the ground conflict in Iraq, should forever shatter the sanitized images found on the nightly news and provide a much needed wake-up call for all of us.

What a nightmare.

84. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007

Catnip, whose photo bucket is that? Funny screen cap though …

I don’t know. I copied it from BHHM’s comment above.

85. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

MissD – clearly we’ll need to set up a PAC to support svix’s candidacy for an interview on blogTV. Let’s get lawyered up!IP

Or take out an ad on the FP – challenging them to a virtual duel … money they will take … well they took it from Chevron.

Goodnight, IP …. funny stuff from you today …. :-)

86. Sabrina Ballerina - 29 July 2007

Lol, Catnip – okay, Bhhm, whose photo bucket is that? I couldn’t find any pics … or is it a secret?

87. BooHooHooMan - 29 July 2007

Nightprowlkitty’s I think

88. liberalcatnip - 29 July 2007
89. marisacat - 29 July 2007

duranta has a good diary at BMT… I am just getting htere for the first time in days, so if the diary is old, apologies…

still a good one.. 8)

90. marisacat - 30 July 2007

LOL they hate to step down…

Governing Party Suffers Defeat in Japan

By NORIMITSU ONISHI

The opposition party seized control of the upper house in a landslide, but Prime Minister Shinzo Abe said he would not step down.

LINK

91. Paul - 30 July 2007

Nice full moon tonight…

92. liberalcatnip - 30 July 2007

Nice full moon tonight…

That’s my excuse anyway. ;) Bonsoir!

93. liberalcatnip - 30 July 2007

Ooops – one more thing. Pesky civilians getting in the way of the bombs you’re dropping? How about trying smaller bombs? Yeah. That’s the ticket.

94. D. Throat - 30 July 2007

The ranting of Thereisnobrain is why fools like Elise are so dangerous… these women give cover to these right wing reactionaries by co opting misogyny as contorted “feminismsjism” tool.

Thereisnobrain raised by a right winged lout and Elise raised by a mother who dressed her in revealing clothes as a child to make her look sexy… These two want to become “progressive” political leaders…. they are a nightmare for all women.

This is proof that the “Big Tent” ideal is over sold… it would be much better if these people would just stay in the GOP. All that is happening now is that conservatives is both parties have taken over and have pushed out moderates and libruls and inserting these idiot bots.

And yes I would prefer Chafee than that cretin Langevin that Schumer was trying to horn in… now Schumer is crying the the Supreme Court is too conservative… go to hell. He roamed the country looking for the most conservative reactionary tools he could find to run with a microscopic “d” behind their names…

95. wu ming - 30 July 2007

although the official subject matter is foreign blogs as psyops, i thought this seemed rather familiar:

In this regard, information strategists can consider clandestinely recruiting or hiring prominent bloggers or other persons of prominence already within the target nation, group or community to pass the U.S. message. . . . Sometimes numbers can be effective; hiring a block of bloggers to verbally attack a specific person or promote a specific message may be worth considering. On the other hand, such operations can have a blowback effect, as witnessed by the public reaction following revelations that the U.S. military had paid journalists to publish stories in the Iraqi press under their own names. People do not like to be deceived, and the price of being exposed is lost credibility and trust.

An alternative strategy is to “make” a blog and blogger. The process of boosting the blog to a position of influence could take some time, however. . . .

96. Madman in the Marketplace - 30 July 2007

hey wu, you linky is broken. That’s really interesting, what’s it from?

97. JJB - 30 July 2007

Ingmar Bergman is dead.

I could go on about his greatness, about the extraordinary number of cinematic masterpieces he created, about the magnificent performers he helped bring to the attention of the world who would otherwise have been known only in Scandanavia, but I’ll limit myself to drawing your attention to the film that stands out among all his other creations as his finest (as surely as Hamlet, Lear, and Othello stand out in the Shakespearean canon): Skammen, or Shame as we Anglophones call it. Set in the border region of a unnamed nation that is going through a low-intensity civil war that suddenly erupts into a full-scale conflagration when a neighboring country invades to aid the rebels, Bergman manages to provide a shattering portrait of how war warps and distorts life, and turns even the gentlest people into feral beasts concerned only with their own survival. Both Max von Sydow and Liv Ullman are superb.

I wish I could say more, but his work says so much, and says it so much better than I could.

98. JJB - 30 July 2007
99. JJB - 30 July 2007

MCat,

Re the Japanese PM not stepping down, according to the BBC World News program I saw this AM, it’s largely because his party has become so unpopular during his tenure that no one is willing to step up and replace him. Not unlike our own dillema, the war is a failure and the public wants it ended, but no one is willing to be seen as having “lost” the war that was lost the moment we commenced it. This is also a great deal like the end of WWI for the Germans. They all knew they were in Endgame and defeat was inevitable, but no one was willing to surrender to the Allies until the sailors of the High Seas Fleet mutinied, and revolution broke out.

100. Revisionist - 30 July 2007

I ahvent seen this getting coverage. Iraqi soccer captain:

“I want America to go out,” he said. “Today, tomorrow, or the day after tomorrow, but out. I wish the American people didn’t invade Iraq and hopefully it will be over soon.”

101. Paul - 30 July 2007

Sabrina Ballerina:

Karen Hughes is one of what I like to call “American Monsters of Narcissism”.

Also, is it not abundantly clear now that the Repukes are colonizing the Democratic party through DailyKos?

DailyKos seemed like a gift in the beginning, but it was really only the software and some good people who gravitated toward a banner of Democracy and the user-moderated forum, which is egalitarian if you don’t keep banning the most popular people that the users like the most.

Kos is running DailyKos as a Kos-moderated forum. He bans everyone who gets in the way of his REPUBLICAN agenda.

Whether he knows it or not, Markos Moulitsas is still a Republican. I think he knows it.

102. colleen - 30 July 2007

now Schumer is crying the the Supreme Court is too conservative… go to hell. He roamed the country looking for the most conservative reactionary tools he could find to run with a microscopic “d” behind their names…

Precisely my reaction when I heard Schumer’s insincere whine about being taken in by Robert’s ‘charm’. What charm?
I can only imagine that Chuck is reacting to a congressional approval rating rapidly heading towards a single digit. Fuck him.
Perhaps Chuck should be having talks with his New Senator from PA about how conservative SCOTUS is.

103. jam.fuse - 30 July 2007

Corporate Swine, interesting educational site, linked to by someone on eurotrib.

104. marisacat - 30 July 2007

Shumer… ugh.

Jonathan Turley was really interesting to read, esp during Roberts, as the media was all trolling this fiction he was such a great guy. Reid in particular had a real affinity with Roberts and Miers.

Turley cannot stand Reid… and wrote that Roberts had been “hydroponically raised” for the process he was about to undergo.

Obviously tapped long ago… and nurtured for that moment.

Up to his neck in Opus Dei imo, but clean hands. The Robertses “parish priest” Msgr Vaghi is a close friend of … ugh forget his name, but the priest who runs the DC Opus Dei HQ, the one who has made all these high profile conversions from Novak to Brownback. Think iirc that Kate O’Beirne is god mother to both (ew). Vaghi has been present (assisted) for some of these high profile baptisms. The Bishop of DC separated the OD priest and Vaghi, sending Vaghi to some small parish in the burbs. The Robertses followed him…

Mrs Roberts, aside from everything else, is a Director of the Carroll Society… a high powered Catholic group that organises the yearly “Red Mass” that opens the SCOTUS season.

We are so fucking skrewed.

105. supervixen - 30 July 2007

94, DT:

Thereisnobrain raised by a right winged lout and Elise raised by a mother who dressed her in revealing clothes as a child to make her look sexy… These two want to become “progressive” political leaders…. they are a nightmare for all women.

You got that right.

If they were Republicans, I could understand it – but they’re posing as progressives! It’s fucking mindboggling.

I don’t remember what thereisnospoon/hekebolos said during the Pie Wars, but I can guess.

106. jam.fuse - 30 July 2007

Thereisnobrain raised by a right winged lout and Elise raised by a mother who dressed her in revealing clothes as a child to make her look sexy… These two want to become “progressive” political leaders…. they are a nightmare for all women.

These two might or might not be ‘a nightmare for all women’, I wouldn’t venture to say, poisonally… me being of the male species and all.

However, typing as one who grew up severely emotionally neglected, and who, I like to think, has triumphed (knock wood) over his abject beginnings — its a bit unfair to tar the children with the sins of the parents, especially if all we know about said moms and dads are from the keyboards of the parties involved. With all respect, an obvious point (?), not to minimize any moronic drivel they themselves may have written.

107. colleen - 30 July 2007

However, typing as one who grew up severely emotionally neglected, and who, I like to think, has triumphed (knock wood) over his abject beginnings

First I am genuinely sorry about your parents.
But I don’t believe that pointing out that neither Elise or the Atkins boys have managed to triumph over their beginnings; indeed they don’t appear to have even started andf probably never will.

108. colleen - 30 July 2007

Sorry I keep doing this. I meant to say

But I don’t believe that pointing out that neither Elise or the Atkins boys have managed to triumph over their beginnings is inappropriate or dishonest.

109. Sabrina Ballerina - 30 July 2007

I don’t remember what thereisnospoon/hekebolos said during the Pie Wars, but I can guess.

Well, since he doesn’t seem to know what they were about, it’s hard to imagine what they said. He thinks they were about the ad. But that’s because people like him were raised to believe that if you think all people, including women, deserve to be treated equally in all aspects of a democratic society, it means the following:

1) You hate sex
2) You hate men
3) You are ugly
4) You are old
5) You are a radical dirty hippie

If you are face to face with liars who perpetrate these wingnut talking points and none of them obviously apply, then you ‘hate America’ and are making stuff up since we are the ‘best country in the world’ and you should ‘love it or leave it’ and see how you like being ‘a woman in Saudi Arabia.’ (I suspect rightwing kossacks also believe this but refrain from saying it, using only the sexist garbage which they believe is easier to get away with).

The rightwing framed the attacks on anyone who dared to ask that all Americans be treated equally. Rather than argue against such a radical suggestion, they sought out what they thought in this culture might make such advocates for equal rights, the least attractive to the lowest common denominator.

That none of it was true, did not matter to the Rush Limbaugh audience to whom it was initially fed. I would be willing to bet that Rush was one of spoonless’ father’s favorite talkshow hosts.

His lame attacks are all Republican talking points. That he adapts them so easily is evidence, not only of his ignorance, but of the kind of hatred he was exposed to, which is at the bottom of the neocon agenda, towards the 60s which they are still fighting even against people who were not born at the time.

It’s really quite pathological and has been passed on from one generation to another. Spoonless suffers from this affliction, it is apparent in his melt-downs and his desire to recreate the ‘Father Knows Best’ image of America and of women.

When I first encountered it, I did not understand it all. We would be talking about Iraq or gay rights or something that is current and without fail, some rightwingnut would bring up the sixties ‘you’re a hippie who hates America’. I asked them what the sixties had to do with now. They really had no answers, just that the greatest enemies of this country were hippies from the sixties.

After a while, I just expected it from rightwingnuts. I was shocked to see it on DK … it still makes no sense to me, but I have read that Reagan et al had a fierce hatred and fear of what happened in the sixties and set about making sure it never happened again.

Opol’s diaries on the sixtieis met with the fiercest attacks from the troll patrols’ and from kos himself, who took the trouble to go into the diaries and let everyone know he thought Opol was an ‘idiot’. Looks like not too many care about his idiotic opinion, whether they cared about the sixties or not, the viscious vitriol was a complete turn-off to most people there, including me … it was out of proportion, the rage they exhibited. Still would like to know why …

110. D. Throat - 30 July 2007

Yeah that murderous bastard was also baptized in the Catholic church the day after he stepped down as Prime Minister… Blair

111. Sabrina Ballerina - 30 July 2007

its a bit unfair to tar the children with the sins of the parents

Jam-fuse, I agree but my opinion of the thugs on DK, which include elise and to a lesser extent thereisnospine and the rest of them, is based on the way they act themselves on that site. She has lied about decent people there, smeared them and set out to bully people she disagrees with.

The rest of what people know of her, mostly because she talks incessently about herself, I don’t care about. If it was real life, most people would be rolling their eyes ‘there she goes again, turning everything into ‘look at me’.

When people do take a look, as The Ghost of Frank Zappo did, and offer their opinions, they did not like his observations. Sorry, but if you shove your personal life in everyone’s face on a regular basis, fine. Don’t be surprised though if people are not impressed and let you know it.

Troll-rating and driving off the board, those who give an honest assessment of the info YOU provide, is again, typical of DK. She is part of a disgusting, authoritarian culture whose main goal is to silence the very people who they claim to represent.

I do care about the harm she has done to decent people, and that it has been covered up and excused by the ironically named ‘administration’, and approved of by the owner of the site.

112. D. Throat - 30 July 2007

Tony Blair will declare himself a Roman Catholic on leaving Downing Street, according to a priest close to him.

Father Michael Seed, who is known for bringing high-profile politicians and aristocrats into the Catholic fold and who says Mass for the Blairs in Downing Street each week when they are in London, made the prediction to friends at a recent memorial service.

Last night, when contacted by The Times, he did not deny his comments, but said he did not know if Mr Blair would ever be received “formally” into the Roman Catholic Church.

To do so he would have to take part in a ceremony called the rite of Christian initiation for adults, followed by confirmation and taking the sacrament of Holy Communion.

113. Sabrina Ballerina - 30 July 2007

Paul #101 (lol, does that # give your post special credibility?)

I agree about Karen Hughes. She lies with impunity and without shame, even when presented with facts. Another disgusting member of this entirely criminal administration ….

Kos is running DailyKos as a Kos-moderated forum. He bans everyone who gets in the way of his REPUBLICAN agenda.

Whether he knows it or not, Markos Moulitsas is still a Republican. I think he knows it.

True, and I think he knows he’s a Republican at heart. He certainly lets his hatred of Democrats like Kucinich be known and his love for Repubs like Schwartzenegger, and btw, for Ron Paul which is ironic considering the attitude towards Paul on the site now. I beleive he said he would welcome Paul into his ‘big tent’.

114. wu ming - 30 July 2007

oops, hope this time it works, madman:

tom ricks’ inbox, from the WaPo.

115. Sabrina Ballerina - 30 July 2007

An alternative strategy is to “make” a blog and blogger. The process of boosting the blog to a position of influence could take some time, however. . . .

Lol, about two years maybe …. 2002 – 2004

Don’t know, but the sudden rise of DK was pretty impressive, not to mention the living it provided for its owner …. unprecedented in the world of blogging and by someone with no real history of business successes. Interesting choice he made, re a guaranteed career with relative financial security with the CIA starting as an undercover agent in DC, or a fly-by-night blogger in his jammies in a tiny apartment with little guarantee it might succeed – or not …. what to do -especially if you love the institution that is doing so much good in the world, and is so ‘liberal’ …..

116. supervixen - 30 July 2007

Being curious, I went and checked out some of spoonyspoon’s comments over at DKos (I Am Curious…. Orange?) and came up with this gem:

troll? (0.33 / 3)
I suggest you see my record on DKos to prove otherwise, or check out my site at getoutnow.org

The extreme feminist left is increasingly irrelevant and increasingly screechy in an increasingly sexualized and eroticized world.

There’s the right-wing backlash and the feminist backlash, and both are destined for the dustbin of history, and good riddance.

I just don’t want liberalism tainted with that irrelevance and anti-naturalism.

by thereisnospoon on Thu Jun 09, 2005 at 07:32:32 PM PDT

117. marisacat - 30 July 2007

Oh I think Blair has been secretly baptised. It was reported a month or so ago that he has privately received Holy Communion from, iirc, the pope. I thought then, he is baptised.

And in that last meeting with the pope (just recently, at the same time I read of the private HC service) the head of the Church of England was present.

One of the bigger gets the Catholic Church has engineered.

Wonder what the pay off is. Higher heaven? Lavish hand tooled Italian made jewels and jewelry for the Catholic at his side, Mrs Blair? Some Buccelati bibelots?

I mean, these people do not do things for free.

118. Paul - 30 July 2007

Sabrina Ballerina:

Kos’ list of offenses against the base of the Democratic Party is so long, it defies comprehension how he has passed himself off as some kind of “Che” of the blogs for so long.

I think this charade is coming to an end, but it has consolidated our resources and wasted lots of our precious time.

I just joined the Free Software Foundation.

I’m planning to join the Electronic Frontier Foundation very soon as well.

Social software will facilitate online communities (Fully Democratic) of unprecedented interactivity and scalability.

If the political-class found DailyKos frustrating, wait until we launch an actual online Democracy with a Bill of Rights and an elected administrator they can’t buy off. We’ll have term-limits and everything.

Why the hell not abstract our government from the boundaries of our nations? We have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

119. marisacat - 30 July 2007

Well there is TPM and Josh Marshall – a self proclaimed Zionist. WTF.. His ad rates are higher than Dkos… and he was rising all the time Kos was, as well. Then John at AmericaBlog… former R and already a DC operative, he had been an aide to I forget who… and let’s not forget Media Matters… another former R. One I never cottoned to. Just too dirty in his past life. Waht says he gave it up? And his fingers are long, from Atrios to Oliver Willis (antoher fucked lib hawk).. and so on.

Ariana, another former R and iirc tinspoon was just trilling her attributes (in that thread at WIngless this past weekend), saying he would be a knight at her side in a heart beat. And that her rep was so clean. WEll since the 5 mil in VC money, I find that her voice is greatly moderated from the 03/04 season. And let’s not forget HuffPo “senior editor” Melinda Henneberger of the hideous Catholic progaganda just recently in the NYT.

AFAIC: ALL OPERATIvES.

Not a clean nose in the bunch.

120. Paul - 30 July 2007

The Catholic Church is so creepy.

Tony Blair is definitely a “Monster of Narcissism”.

That’s a match made in hell.

121. D. Throat - 30 July 2007

If you want to know the depths of the Fucked Up Brothers Grimm… you gotta read this thread…

Here is just a tiny sample:

these parents (0.00 / 0)
are letting their children dress and behave the way they do regardless of age of consent laws.

And quite honestly, I have absolutely no problem with 16-year-olds having relationships with people in their twenties or thirties.

Most importantly, we have a teenage culture where these people feel they have permission to do whatever they like, but don’t have to take responsibility for their decisions because they’re just “kids”.

They feel they should be able to drink and smoke and drive because they’re old enough to handle it, and to work a job if they want, and to have sex if they want, and do any number of other things.

But they don’t feel they should be expected to be responsible for any of those things. The period between 15 and 18 is currently a liminal stage where everything is permitted from a practical level if not a legal one, yet nothing is ever expected. That’s a recipe for disaster, and it’s highly unnatural.
by: thereisnospoon @ Sun May 20, 2007 at 16:32:49 PM CDT
[ Parent | Reply ]

and understand this, it’s not about the sex (0.00 / 0)
my interest in this is not from a prurient sexual standpoint. It’s about a wide range of issues, including and especially labor.

I started working when I was 16. I had a girlfriend significantly older than myself when I was under 18; I had a girlfriend younger than myself at 21; I wore business casual most days to school because I had a 30-hour-a-week job to go to afterwards.

I never gave myself the luxury of “adolescence”, and neither did my parents. My parents expected me to behave like an adult from the time I was 15, and I did just that. And my behavior, grades, work ethic and income were a damn sight better than anyone else’s I came close to knowing.

“Adolescence” is BS.
by: thereisnospoon @ Mon May 21, 2007 at 05:11:11 AM CDT
[ Parent | Reply ]

and finally (0.00 / 0)
my own father and mother were 27 and 18, respectively, when they got married. He was her university TA. They stayed married for over 25 years and managed quite well, thank you.

Keep an open mind, for fucks sake, before telling me what’s moral and immoral. In your narrow, provincial little world, my own mother and father’s relationship is nothing short of abominable.

Get a clue: the entire world ain’t filled to the brim with career-obsessed, get-a-college-education-at-all-costs, don’t have kids before you’re 27, marry someone within 5 years of yourself yuppies. I happen to be one, but I’m not so provincial as to believe that’s the only way it should be, or even historically or demographically normal. Because it isn’t.
by: thereisnospoon @ Mon May 21, 2007 at 05:34:02 AM CDT
[ Parent | Reply ]

don’t think you quite understand the ethic (9.00 / 1)
there are MANY families out there (you’ll just have to take my word on this one–I know more than three, and the families don’t know each other…) where sexual abuse of children happened, and most of them KNOW it. Even the friends of the families know. But everyone involved, including the kids themselves, figure it’s in the best interests not just of the victims/perps themselves, but of society itself to keep the entire business under wraps, rather than expose the seedy underbelly of family honor and human nature.

These people ask God for forgiveness for the children involved; forgivness for the perpetrators; and forgiveness for mankind.

They assume this shit is happening in a lot other families, too.

It’s like the Catholic church and its flock. You think they all didn’t KNOW that the molestations were happening? Of course they did–it’s the oldest story since Bocaccio’s Decameron. But everyone involved–and i do mean everyone felt it for the best to deal with those demons internally rather than expose them to the harsh light of day.

I’m telling you–it’s about getting CAUGHT, and not keeping the ugliness under wraps.
by: thereisnospoon @ Sun May 20, 2007 at 03:49:03 AM CDT

lol, you have no idea (0.00 / 0)
you take too much for granted. I have exremely personal experience with it, if you get my drift. And there are histories of sexual abuse in my family and those of my friends.

I don’t have to read about–though I have. I’ve lived it.

Most sexual abuse occurs inside the home by someone close to the victim. In most cases, the victim would never want to see the perpetrator put in jail, however much they might deserve it.

The number of offenses by strangers or authority figures is extremely low, actually–though it does cause a lot of public hysteria. DUI perps cause far more damage to society and to lives than stranger/authority figure pedophiles, mostly due to the sheer numbers of fatalities involved.

As long as we’re into cruel and unusual punishments, i’ll take the DUIs.
by: thereisnospoon @ Mon May 21, 2007 at 05:17:57 AM CDT
[ Parent | Reply ]

..

122. D. Throat - 30 July 2007

Spamathon

123. colleen - 30 July 2007

The extreme feminist left is increasingly irrelevant and increasingly screechy in an increasingly sexualized and eroticized world.

This is a very confused boy.

124. marisacat - 30 July 2007

New Thread

LINK

125. marisacat - 30 July 2007

Sorry!

Let D Throat out of spam!

126. Paul - 30 July 2007

Regarding Zionism:

I know Zionism has come to be associated in many people’s minds with abuse of Palestinians and not much else.

One thing that helps to understand Zionism is the political climate of Europe leading up to the holocaust.

Zionists were among the earliest European Jews to notice the storm on the horizon, so they got out the earliest.

Holocaust victims who moved to Israel were understood to be refugees, not colonists, as the early Zionists were perceived to be.

Since European antisemitism, sponsored in large part by the Church of the Holy Roman Empire, is what created the refugee crisis of European Jews fleeing Europe, and this resulted in the secondary, and on-going refugee crisis in Palestinian territories, reparations are due.

My opinion is that the United States, the Europe Union, specifically Germany and Austria, should finance the development of Palestinian Territories until they’ve been brought up to a middle-class lifestyle.

Next, the holiest sites in and around Jerusalem should be declared “World Heritage Sites” or something equivalent.

Access to these temples and holy sites should be time-shared among the various branches of Abrahamic faith which are concerned.

The water issues must be addressed. People can’t be dehydrated and starved.

Last point – all discussion of Palestinian statehood seems to be starting off on the wrong foot.

How can any people living on any land be declared to be not a state and not part of any state?

If the “Palestinian Territories” are not considered part of Syria, Jordan and Egypt, and not part of Israel, implicitly, they’re their state – Palestine.

In that case, each Israeli raid into the Palestinian refugee camps is done in defiance of international law, violating the sovereignty of a neighboring state.

I admire Yuri Avnery

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uri_Avnery

and Gush Shalom:

http://gush-shalom.org/

These are just my views on Israel Palestine at the present time, but I’m always trying to factor in more historical and cultural awareness for a more sensible approach to the situation.

127. supervixen - 30 July 2007

DT, thanks for the quotes….

my own father and mother were 27 and 18, respectively, when they got married. He was her university TA. They stayed married for over 25 years and managed quite well, thank you.

Taken in conjunction with the revelatory “feminism was a dirty word in our household” post that hekebolos unwisely shared with the world, there is quite a lot wrong with the power dynamics in this guy’s family. I’m not surprised there was child abuse involved. But the dear boy doesn’t appear to get it.

Sad.

128. jam.fuse - 30 July 2007

colleen —

First I am genuinely sorry about your parents.

Don’t be sorry — My parents were/are good/great people in their own way, just not much good at raising kids, to say the least. I only brought them up to make a point. So don’t talk about them! (half) joking…

But I don’t believe that pointing out that neither Elise or the Atkins boys have managed to triumph over their beginnings is inappropriate or dishonest.

That puts a finer point on the argument — its just that dragging your opponents’ parents into a dispute, seems ethically and logically questionable to me, as originally stated by DT.

Sabrina —

its a bit unfair to tar the children with the sins of the parents

Jam-fuse, I agree but my opinion of the thugs on DK, which include elise and to a lesser extent thereisnospine and the rest of them, is based on the way they act themselves on that site. She has lied about decent people there, smeared them and set out to bully people she disagrees with.

We are in complete agreement on this, I was in no way trying to defend any of those whatever-you-want-to-call-‘ems.

jeeziz all this thimking is making my head hurt…

129. Madman in the Marketplace - 30 July 2007

Thanks Wu!

130. colleen - 30 July 2007

its just that dragging your opponents’ parents into a dispute, seems ethically and logically questionable to me

You seem confused also.In the 10 or more years I’ve been involved in political discussion forums I don’t believe I’ve spoken about my childhood or parents once.
You brought up your upbringing and described yourself as emotionally abused. Spoonless talks about his parents and family often. Who is doing the dragging?


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