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More rotten tomatos on offer 31 July 2007

Posted by marisacat in 2008 Election, Culture of Death, DC Politics, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter, Iraq War, Pakistan, WAR!.
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Pimp, promoter and slap happy princelings…

Pimp:

HH: Mr. Burns, some anti-war critics have begun to attack General Petraeus as being not credible and not trustworthy for a variety of reasons, one he gave me an interview, he’s given other people interviews that they consider to be partisan, whatever. Do you believe he’ll be as trustworthy as anyone else speaking on the war?

JB: I do. I can only speak for my own personal experience, and there definitely was in the, in the Vietnam war, there was a failure of senior generals and the joint chiefs of staff to speak frankly about the Vietnam war early enough.

There has definitely been some Pollyannaish character to the reporting of some of the generals here over the past three or four years, although in my own view, knowing virtually all of those generals, I don’t think that that was out of fealty to the White House or Mr. Rumsfeld. It’s a difficult and complex question which we really don’t have time to discuss here.

But to speak of General Petraeus in particular, General Petraeus is 54 years old. Let’s look at this just simply as a matter of career, beyond the matter of principle on which I think we could also say we could expect him to make a forthright report. At 54, General Petraeus is a young four star general, who could expect to have as much as ten more years in the military. And he has every reason to give a forthright and frank report on this. And he says, and he says this insistently, that he will give a forthright, straightforward report, and if the people in Washington don’t like it, then they can find somebody else who will give his forthright, straightforward report.

He is not without options on a personal basis, General Petraeus, and I think he, from everything I’ve learned from him, sees both a professional, in the first place, and personal imperative to state the truth as he sees it about this war.

So, if we are mean to him he will up and leave and take a greased palm love ‘em or leave ‘em corporate job?  That is what I get off that sell job from John Burns.  Dumb blackmail.  Should work with the Democrats in congress.

   Iraqi mother and family at the morgue

HH: Speaking more broadly now, in the American higher command, is there optimism that the surge, given enough time, will bring the kind of stability to Iraq that we all hope it achieves?

JB: You know, optimism is a word which is rarely used around here. The word they would use is realism. You have to look at what the plan is. The plan is that with the surge, aimed primarily at al Qaeda, who are responsible for most of the spectacular attacks, the major suicide bombings, for example, that have driven the sectarian warfare here, the belief is, or the hope is, that with the surge, they can knock al Qaeda back, they can clear areas which have been virtually sanctuaries for al Qaeda, northeast, south, west and northwest of Baghdad, and in Baghdad itself, and then have Iraqi troops move in behind them. The problem here is time. How much time does the U.S. military have now, according to the American political timetable, to accomplish this? I think most generals would say, indeed have said, most serving current generals here have said that a drawdown, which took American troops from the 160,00 level they’re at now quickly down to 100,000 or 80,000 over the next, shall we say, year to eighteen months, that’s too fast. If you do that, I think they would say, though they don’t put it quite this frankly, that this war will be lost for sure. Given a little bit more time, they think that it is realistic to think that the Iraqi forces can move in behind them, and can take over the principal responsibilities for the war. The problem is, of course, that American generals have been saying this now for four years, and as we know, the Congress is beginning to run out of patience with that.

But I think that they have a good plan now, at least if there is any plan that could save the situation here, any plan that could bring a reasonably successful end to the American enterprise here, it’s probably the plan they have right now.

The Pentagon should send John Burns a check.  It was hard to select an excerpt… there is so much propaganda in the interview.  A few truths near the end of the interview, but squeezed out.

   msnbc photo

Promoter (Ignatius’ Waziristan on September 10 column via RCP):

Crumpton [a former CIA officer who was one of the heroes of the agency’s campaign to destroy al-Qaeda’s safe haven in Afghanistan in late 2001 – those are Ignatius’ words, not mine — Mcat] proposed a detailed plan last year for rolling up these sanctuaries, which he called the “Regional Strategic Initiative.” It would combine economic assistance and paramilitary operations in a broad counterinsurgency campaign.

In Waziristan, U.S. and Pakistani operatives would give tribal warlords guns and money, to be sure, but they would coordinate this covert action with economic aid to help tribal leaders operate their local stone quarries more efficiently, say, or install windmills and solar panels to generate electric power for their remote mountain villages.

oh please.  Don’t strain my credulity quite so forcefully.  We prattle one thing, we wage a sort of low level scorched earth.

Intervening in another Muslim country is risky, to put it mildly. That’s why a successful counterinsurgency program would need Pakistani support, and why its economic and social development components would be critical. The concept should be President Kennedy’s “Alliance for Progress” to counter radicalism in Latin America, rather than “Operation Iraqi Freedom.”

The United States can begin to take action now against al-Qaeda’s new safe haven. Or we can wait, and hope that we don’t get hit again. The biggest danger of waiting is that if retaliation proves necessary later, it could be ill-planned and heavy-handed — precisely what got us in trouble in Iraq.

BTW, Mr Ignatius is smiling a lot these days. Yet another “spy novel” out, set in the ME, with all his ezy squeezy insider-ish knowledge (Tenet gave him a blurb, how close his writing is to the real thing, ooo!) … and I just heard a movie deal too. 

Life is good.  War pays off. The Wapo is clover and Ignatius is a pig in clover.

     photo from In These Times

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… and those slap happy princelings:

[I]t’s no exaggeration to say that the oil-rich states of the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC)—Bahrain, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates—are enjoying a transformational moment, one that could deeply affect the region if not the world. Buoyed by unprecedented oil prices, these states are awash with cash.

In the past five years, they have earned a staggering $1.5 trillion for their petroleum, according to the Institute of International Finance (IIF). And there’s no end in sight: by the close of 2007, the IIF says, the GCC will have picked up an additional $540 billion, more than the combined exports of Brazil, India, Poland and Turkey

All that green has turned the once backward region into the world’s 16th largest economy, according to IIF. And if present trends continue, the GCC zone could become the world’s sixth largest by 2030. What’s most remarkable, however, is how the new money is being spent. The gulf has experienced oil booms before, but rarely managed to capitalize on them; three decades ago an oil windfall helped states modernize infrastructure and health services, but many leaders

blew much of the money on defense or vanity projects, or simply hid profits in Western banks.

Again, straining my credulity.  Things have changed?

Today, by contrast, the gulf’s farsighted, business-minded political leaders are joining with their more mature and innovative private sectors to ensure the money is wisely spent. Led by Dubai, which is fast becoming a modern banking and financial-services hub, cities in the region are embracing reform and charting an ambitious agenda for the future. “A new gulf is dawning,” says Edmund O’Sullivan, the Dubai-based editorial director of the Middle East Economic Digest (MEED). “And it’s moving much faster and smarter than it did in the 1970s.”

Please… it leaks out from time to time, the mini rebellions against the various royal families, rebellions we are all too happy to help put down.  One in Qatar, iirc, just on the eve of our invasion of Iraq.

When the US Corps of Army Engineers was working on the bathrooms of the Kuwaiti royals following GW1 I threw up my hands – and my hands are still up there, in the air.  In disgust.

  Force morgue at Baghdad airport, photo via IraqSlogger
     Force morgue at Baghdad airport  -  photo via IraqSlogger

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PBS really does not like Bill Moyers… I had caught this interview on his show last week with Fawaz Gerges… and wanted it for counterpoint to the sludge above… Plug in “Moyers Journal” to their lousy search engine and you get… nothing.  Plug in “Moyers” and you get a hodge podge of the Wide Angle program.  What a mess we are in.

Nevertheless, here is a snip from the Moyers interview:

FAWAZ A. GERGES: In fact, if you ask any American soldier in Iraq, “Who is the enemy?” he would tell you al Qaeda. And this has done a great deal of damage to relations between the American military and the Iraqi population.

BILL MOYERS: How come?

FAWAZ A. GERGES: The overwhelming number of insurgents or resistance fighters are Iraqis. They are not al Qaeda. al Qaeda is a critical component, is a tiny, small, critical component in the Iraqi equation, less than five percent of all insurgents and resistance fighters. So, while al Qaeda is very lethal, is very deadly, it has carried out some of the devastating attacks in Iraq, in fact, the United States is facing a highly complex and determined resistance or insurgency numbering in the tens of thousands, most of whom have nothing to do with al Qaeda.

BILL MOYERS: Just the other day– the United States launched an offensive about 30 miles north of Baghdad. And helicopter attacks killed– 17 of what the military said– were al Qaeda gunmen. But after the military left, the BBC went in and the villagers told the BBC that these were not any way connected to al Qaeda. They were village guards trying to prevent attacks from the very insurgents he talked about. What do you tell those young men–

[...]

FAWAZ A. GERGES:  It’s one thing to say that we have to prepare our soldiers and officers to fight a highly complex and nuanced war, but when you have the president himself, day after day, time and again, keep saying that this war against al Qaeda, yes, there is al Qaeda. But, in fact, according to American military commanders, the bulk of attacks that are taking place in Iraq are basically carried out by Shiite and Sunni militia in revenge attacks against each other.

Yet the administration keeps telling us it’s al Qaeda, al Qaeda, al Qaeda.

Best thing since global communism.  NO question.

FAWAZ A. GERGES: You know, Bill, the question on the table is not whether al Qaeda in Iraq exists or not. It does exist. It has carried out some of the deadliest, lethal attacks against mainly civilians. I would go further and say based on everything that we have seen, in fact, according to American military commanders up til the last few months, even if al Qaeda in Iraq were to be removed entirely from the Iraq equation, if tomorrow, Bill, we said, “We remove al Qaeda,” the strategic predicament of the United States would not change dramatically.

BILL MOYERS: How so?

FAWAZ A. GERGES: And that’s the question? If our reading of the situation is correct that the United States is facing a complex and a highly determined insurgency or armed resistance, then the question is you’re facing tens of thousands– with probably millions of supporters in terms of families and neighborhoods. And this is why unless we understand that this is basically a political problem and, in fact only Iraqis can defeat al Qaeda. That’s the irony. The president keeps saying we need to stay in Iraq in order to defeat al Qaeda. In fact, the evidence shows that al Qaeda in Iraq can only be defeated by Iraqis, chased out of Iraq by Iraqis. Iraqis are beginning the task now to do it.

And talk about “blowback”:

FAWAZ A. GERGES: As a historian to me, what happened to Britain in 1920, as you know, Britain was in charge of Iraq. And it put Iraq– glued Iraq together in the 1920s. And by the end of this, Britain became really a hostage to local players in Iraq. And in fact the United States is finding itself in the same place as Britain did in the 19– at the mercy– at the mercy of local players initially Shiite political leadership. And now the United States has gone against the wishes of the Iraqi government and trying to arm some Sunni tribes to fight al Qaeda. 

In fact, the American military presence in Iraq, the preponderant American military presence has become a liability, a liability against America’s vested interest.

 The American presence in Iraq, Bill, and for a person like me who lives for long periods of time in the Middle East, is not just–

BILL MOYERS: Born in– in Beirut, right?

FAWAZ A. GERGES: Born in Beirut. And I have spent several years doing field research in the last years.

The way the American mission is perceived in the Muslim world is that this not about democracy. This is not about the fight against– al Qaeda.

This is a fight to subjugate– to subjugate the Arab and Muslim world and control its resources. [looks that way to me --- Mcat]

And that’s why what I find most really alarming, Bill, al Qaeda’s ideological claims basically are finding receptive ears in that part of the world because al Qaeda is telling Muslims the United States is waging a war against Islam and Muslims. And, in fact what the war itself has done, it has radicalized and militarized a tiny segment of mainstream public opinion.

Cannot put it more simply and directly than that…

          photo from Truthout.org

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Comments»

1. Paul - 31 July 2007

A very strong punishment of the Bush administration is necessary for the sake of national security and global security.

If we don’t want our world to come crashing down around us, we have to stand up to the Bush-appeasers now.

We cannot afford not to impeach Bush and Cheney. As a nation, we cannot afford to accept the blame on Bush’s behalf.

2. D. Throat - 31 July 2007

Looks like Kissengers “mission” to Russia has pull Putin back into the reservation. They are now snubbing Iran and Hamas (ie Shias)… wonder if the 20 Billion funneled to Saudi Arabia … has anything to do with the sudden change of heart.

A new crisis in Russia-Iran relations
By Kaveh L Afrasiabi

Moscow’s decision to postpone the completion of a 1,000-megawatt reactor in Bushehr, Iran, has shocked Tehran and is bound to bring Russia-Iran relations to a crisis point, this at a time when neither country can afford to have such a negative impact on their geostrategic considerations.

On August 15, President Mahmud Ahmadinejad is due in Bishkek, Kyrgyzstan, to attend (as an observer) a summit of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO), the regional security organization launched by Russia and China and encompassing the Central Asian states. Iran can potentially contribute to the SCO’s security-related priorities and, certainly, to its anti-terrorism center.

Yet compared with last year when there were lively discussions, particularly in the Russian press, of Iran’s inclusion as a member of SCO, not only is there no such talk this year but, worse, the crisis over Bushehr threatens the wellspring of the entire Iran-Russia relationship.

As usual, the Kremlin has veiled its “playing politics with Bushehr” by hiding behind its private contractors involved with the Bushehr project, who insist their announcement that Bushehr will not go operational this autumn as planned and will at the earliest the following autumn, is purely financial in nature.

3. D. Throat - 31 July 2007

Spamikopita

4. marisacat - 31 July 2007

If we don’t want our world to come crashing down around us, we have to stand up to the Bush-appeasers now. — Paul

Well to be blunt the time, such as it was, was years ago.

You fight for the votes. Wiht everything you have. If you lose or you miscalculate… you come back and you take that presidency away from the likes of Bush – or, to be frank, from the likes of Arnold.

The Democratic party does not fight back. They don’t.

The game, the scam was to let everyhing devolve to horror – a magnum opus version of managing to get the Foley seat but with great struggle (they barely won it) – and let the presidency fall to them.

PARASITES.

5. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

{{{Crying}}} the hugs are for the Iraqi people – I wish we had not failed so miserably …. I know it’s no good to say we’re sorry …. a few years ago, I joined the Interfaith group that made an ad with people of all faiths from here, including Muslims, apologizing to the Iraqi people for Abu Ghraib, because George Bush would not do so. I knew when he could not apologize that he was guilty.

Strange now to think, that that was a horrible realization for me at the time …. I had argued against it with a military spec. ops guy who said as soon as he saw the torture photos, that ‘this came from above, it is not a few bad apples’. I did not believe him. Now I believe they are capable of anything. Nothing would surprise me ….

Marisacat those photos of the women and the little boy …. they are heart-breaking …. how can human beings be responsible for this suffering and profit from it with zero remorse?

********
Paul, I agree but I have all but given up hope that Impeachment could work, not because of Republicans, but because of Democrats …. they could make it work, but they do not want to … the leadership has said so ….. if they did to shut everyone up, I’m afraid they would not do it right …. I don’t trust them anymore. Even Russ Feingold who came to DK to quiet the mobs last week …. even he has no more credibiility . I don’t know what can be done anymore …

6. D. Throat - 31 July 2007

Of course they won’t fight… look at all the chicken hawks in Mike Starks diary… they all had the chest puffed put beating down an old lady (Cindy Sheehan) but the minute there is a chance for a real rough and tumble they start crying like “luscious vaginas”.

7. Miss Devore - 31 July 2007

just deleting old old emails and came across this DFA invitation for live YearlyKos Night School, where professor bowers will teach all of those who have to work or don’t have the mojo to get into the University of Kos:

http://www.dfalink.com/event.php?id=22051

not sure if the link will work, as it is from an april email. but it’s free–unlike secondlife yk.

maybe I’ll try to be teacher’s pet like I always do…

8. marisacat - 31 July 2007

The Pentagon confirmed yesterday that it is working closely with the Turkish government to stop Kurdish guerrillas operating from bases in northern Iraq.

But it refused to comment on a report that the US is planning a covert operation to send special forces into action to try to neutralise the leadership of the Kurdistan Workers party (PKK), which has been mounting attacks inside Turkey.

The US is trying to persuade the Turkish army against taking matters into its own hands by invading northern Iraq, where the Kurds have established an autonomous region. Washington, faced with a myriad of problems in Iraq, does not need a new front opening up in the country.

from the Guardian.

9. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

Well, now spoonless is threatening lawsuits! Rotfl! What a cry-baby. Why don’t they stay on DK where their regressive views are protected? He and all of them live in a bubble over there and when they leave, and get their heads handed to them in a debate, they whine and threaten lawsuits.

The Internet tubes are rough to navigate. Too rough for kossacks as many suspected all along. If you can’t take the heat, I repeat, stay out of the kitchen. If words you speak on the internet are going to embarrass you in the future, don’t type them. It is simple. But DK does its members a dis-service by promoting this garbage:

1)You are not responsible for the words you type or the information you provide about yourself online being used by others. Others are responsible for looking at it and directing others to it.

That advice is naive and stupi. It is implicitly understood when you make information publicly available, that people will use it. He cannot handle the complete rejection of his and has directed his anger at Peeder.

this is the last post I will ever make in response to you (9.00 / 2)
leave me alone. don’t talk to me again. if you choose to post in response to me anywhere on any blog, I will ignore you. you take your harrassment of me in my personal life, and i will get a restraining order. post personal information about me like you did with markos’ confidential information, and I will sue you–i’m not kidding.

whatever issues you have, deal with them with a therapist, and leave me alone. that’s the last thing I will ever say to you.

by: thereisnospoon @ Mon Jul 30, 2007 at 18:17:22 PM CDT

Too thin-skinned for words …. I’ll say this for Armando, I never saw him threaten to sue anyone …. they try to be Armando, many of them, unfortunately only imitating the worst of his behavior …. but at least when he started a fight, he did not threaten law suits …

The rules of DK ( Dad, they called me a name!! They insulted me! Ban them) do not apply in a court of law. Crying to daddy kos is one thing, looking like a watb to a jury and wasting the court’s time is another … the ‘don’t use what I put on the internet’ rules of DK do not apply in court either. A jury would laugh …

Supervixen and Marisacat imo who have been consistently smeared and attacked by these whiney, crybaby boyz for far too long, but I don’t see them whining … really, go home to DK and stay there. I always said, not one of them would survive outside the safe zone of that blog which taught them lessons that do not apply in the real world.

Waving at Ms Xeno … :-)

10. marisacat - 31 July 2007

LOL damage control.

Seems again Feingold was used to tamp down a faction wanting a stronger ethics and lobbying bill.

11. wilfred - 31 July 2007

Ah, that famous photo atop this post.

We quickly learned the “Mission” was the infiltration of every branch of government and the armed services by the Neocons and Fundamentalists.

That mission was “Accomplished” by the time that photo was taken aboard the aircraft carrier.

And there is no chance that apparatus will even be partially dismantled before January ’09 and that is one big, sad fact.

12. marisacat - 31 July 2007

British PM: Troops out of Iraq Regardless of US

TruthOut Link

Andrew Grice, Belfast Telegraph UK, reports:

“Gordon Brown has paved the way for the withdrawal of British troops from Iraq by telling George Bush he would not delay their exit in order to show unity with the United States”

13. Miss Devore - 31 July 2007

things one can only do on vackay….If I write about it at length, it will be along the lines of Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintainence:

Introducing a chihuahua to the concept of an ice-pack… It took about a 1/2 hr. and a slice of swiss cheese. Until he realized I tricked him.

wilfred–the accomplishment absolutely was if they were able to sell this war and find buyers-they knew they could get us so tied down in iraq as to make the conquest of America by the europeans looks like nothing. We rob the cradle of civilization and get away with it!

14. Revisionist - 31 July 2007

they have chopped down the white tree. there. problem solved.

15. supervixen - 31 July 2007

SB: Even Russ Feingold who came to DK to quiet the mobs last week …. even he has no more credibiility . I don’t know what can be done anymore …

I agree. I used to like Feingold.

A German friend of mine who has lived here for 30 years went back to Germany this summer to celebrate her 60th birthday with her old friends and family. She said they were all aghast about what has happened to the US. “What the hell is going on there?” they were asking her. She had no good explanation.

The Empire crumbles.

* * *

My response to MSock’s calling me a “troll”:

BULLSHIT (0.00 / 0)

I am not a troll, and have never been a troll, and never will be a troll. And you fucking KNOW THAT.

The problem is that you can’t handle what I have to say; it threatens you and you can’t respond to it intelligently, so you want to stifle it.
You, just like your creepy friends at DKos, want to silence anyone you don’t like.

Fuck that McCarthyesque shit.

And as for the notion that I want to “fuck with your blog”, oh please, shitcan the ridiculous paranoid act. It’s totally transparent.

by: hunterhawk2 @ Tue Jul 31, 2007 at 15:56:57 PM PDT

They are pitiful over there. They can hardly find anyone interested enough to read the damn thing, much less try to fuck with it.

16. marisacat - 31 July 2007

I feel sorry for pyrrho: he cannot read. And his typing is to whine, bitch or whine again.

He needs to check the previous thread. If he can find it. Or his ass.

His three comments were there and ARE there, had he been able to read… all posted to the thread immediately or within 10 to 15 minutes of posting.

His first entity is a new one, new screen name. It was held in moderation, I have all first comments held. THIS IS A SPAM PREVENTATIVE.

His second comment went right thru. he was too fucking stupid to notice.

His third went to moderation. The filters are fucked up.

If he had brains he would see that Parker answered him in the thread TWICE

He is banned (and his email has been placed on the list again, there is no need for him to post again) and I am happy to post AGAIN a link to the explanation as to why he was banned – He never ever states the truth of the matter EVER, it, my reasons, were made public at the time.

What was not made public at the time, but is now public – and was put in a private email to pyrrho at the time…

I WAS ALSO SICK TO DEATH OF Dkos, Armando and DH SNITCHES.

And the little shit had fucking harrassed me enough!

He had run to Armando with commentary from a private email list (that NYCO held the keys to and it was she who had allowed pyrrho to the list) that came into existence post pie….

The agreed MO for the list was not to repeat off the list what was said on the list. It was for Dkos posters who were women, post pie. Pyrrho begged and whined his way onto the list… he always wants to be “with the women”.

Yeah right.

When we got wind that he was snitching, we abandoned the yahoo elist. NYCO was not around, she had the keys and the confidentiality of the list had been compromised.

The likes of pyrrho and BlogCudge and Martin and Emsick and Del Dem and the lot of them

can kiss my skinny white ass.

17. wilfred - 31 July 2007

NBC saying Rumsfeld will testify Wednesday on Pat Tillman’s death. Maybe he’ll do another one of those “These things happen” bon mots.

18. Miss Devore - 31 July 2007

come on baby light my pyrrho.

19. marisacat - 31 July 2007

War is hard, says Rummy. And messy. Full of the known unknowns.

20. Miss Devore - 31 July 2007

wouldn’t it be interesting if all the blogs, in addition to their blogdrools, listed the people they banned?

21. Miss Devore - 31 July 2007

17–he so misses being arrogant in public!

22. marisacat - 31 July 2007

BlogCudge claims that many have been banned here.

he should make the announcement, I have asked that he do so. Seems he is busy elsewhere.

I banned David Byron (without ever allowing a comment from that quarter) and pyrrho. Pyrrho was allowed to drool and whine here for several months. Too LONG.

Donkey tale is a snide little shite, and I send him away, he likes to hijack threads.

If anyone knows of others, you’ll have to post it.

All Blogging Curmudgeon posted here was snool and drool against Emsock. It was boring, much like what Donkeytale likes to do…. I told him, BlogCudge, to leave. He is not banned, who gives a shit. He acts like an old queen of some sort, with none of the courage and guts of old queens. All peevish pleasures and whines.

People who decided they did nto like me, from Arminius to SPit to super to whomever are not banned. And i am very happy to dig up their comments and the threads they were in…

If they wish to post and not HIJACK threads, fine.

23. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

My God I’m sick of fighting with the stupid local New Jersey press over the Morristown hate rally.

This is the stupidest one yet.

http://blog.nj.com/njv_paul_mulshine/2007/07/bush_stands_on_the_wrong_side.html

He’s a very vehement Ron Paul supporter. Blah. David Niewert was right.

24. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

Wilfred, speaking of infiltration:

The University of Illinois is investigating potential conflicts of interest involving the director of the school’s prestigious police-training institute and Blackwater U.S.A., the military contractor.

The institute’s director, Tom Dempsey, signed an agreement in May allowing the state facility and private contractor to exchange staff and students and share facilities. The pact could give Blackwater a foothold in training candidates for sworn law-enforcement positions in Illinois.

Even as he represented the institute, Dempsey has also been working as a Blackwater consultant in his spare time, top university officials confirmed Monday in response to questions from the Tribune. On July 19, two months after Dempsey signed the institute’s partnership agreement with Blackwater, he submitted a written request for time off to consult for Blackwater.

University administrators who were unaware of the partnership agreement agreed to the 30-day leave of absence, which Dempsey requested so he could travel to Afghanistan to work for the North Carolina-based company in anti-drug-trafficking and police training of Afghan forces, according to university provost Linda Katehi.

Dempsey, 58, a former Marine and director of the institute since 2002, did not respond to several Tribune requests for comment last week and Monday. He is paid $118,178 annually by the university.

Sources at the university, who believe Dempsey is currently in Afghanistan, said he has corresponded with the university by e-mail in recent days. Officials plan to speak with him by phone this week about the potential conflict of interest.

The university’s conflict policy requires employees to disclose whether, through an outside venture, they are receiving $10,000 or more from a company doing business with the university.

Katehi said that in most cases, if an individual notes a potential conflict on disclosure forms, those forms are not accepted without a thorough investigation.

She said the university is now trying to find out whether Dempsey was employed by Blackwater when he signed the partnership, and why any work he is doing for Blackwater is not spelled out in the partnership agreement.

The probe comes as Blackwater, a security firm whose most-publicized business is providing private paramilitary personnel for America’s war on terror, is already facing controversy surrounding a training facility opened last spring in far northwestern Illinois.

The university’s institute, located in Champaign, is one of the largest in the nation. It trains would-be law-enforcement and corrections officers.

Every fascist state needs to build it’s very own Waffen SS/Stasi …

25. colleen - 31 July 2007

white trash?!?!? wtf is wrong with you guys? why do you go to such bigotries, what can that serve a liberal?

pyrrho,

Even in the worst prisons (although apparently not on emsock’s fetid swamp of a blog) apologists for rape and child molestation considered the worst sort of scum. On emsocks blog apologists for rape and child molestation are admins and your blog mommy uprates him. white trash is an understatement.

26. colleen - 31 July 2007

If anyone knows of others, you’ll have to post it.

lol
You banned MB for a few days untill he apologised for comparing us to the Columbine shooters.

That’s about it.

These people lie constantly, it’s like breathing for them.

27. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

LOL spyin’ cats:

When Electronic Frontier Foundation privacy lawyer Kevin Bankston announced that he was locking his office door to “prevent pranks” by this summer’s crop of interns, the interns took it as a personal challenge. They figured out how to get into his office (they had the universal key!), took some pix, and then made a snappy little LOLCats animation commemorating the event.

Direct link to the resulting prank here.

28. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

I think I’m a spamalamadingdong!

29. Miss Devore - 31 July 2007

MITM-having read Scahill’s “Blackwater”, this is precisely how they market themselves—bringing police forces into the 21st century “GWOT realities”

30. marisacat - 31 July 2007

I forget he/MB exists. I banned him over the slams about Columbine killers.

He drooled out a half apology (his family adivsed him to apologise… cannot think for himself) so I unbanned him.

Poor pyrrho. Patheto.

I sent him the thread showing his comments and the replies from parker.

31. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

didn’t you ban all males who weren’t your subservient toadies? I think I read that somwherez on teh internetz … and you ban teh sex, teh violenz and teh demoratz. Oh, and apple pie, too.

32. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

Oh, I can’t WAIT to read THIS.

I’ll pay for the fucking hardcover.

33. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

ooop, not spam, just delayed by the magic of the wordprezzzzz internetz.

34. frtitzcat - 31 July 2007

Mcat–can I kiss your skinny white ass too?

{:o)

35. Miss Devore - 31 July 2007

31–no–they just leave their genitals on the doormat–oh goddess, I wish I could remember the exact quote. was it from Nonparticle?

36. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

Marisacat, looks like there is no list. We are still waiting the list of lies from BarbinMd also. So far, nothing. . I see people like Meteor Blades posting here. Did he stand up for you and other progressives when they were banned from DK? I’ve never seen him do that for any progressive in fact I’ve seen uprate the hunters of progressive voices on DK ….. yet, he is able to post here ….

Since all of them have been given ample opportunity to back up what they say, yet have not, the answer is clear …. I hate to put it this way, but it looks they lied ….

***********

Hair Club, it looks like they are going make immigration the wedge issue of the next election. There always has to be someone to scapegoat – if there are criminals there, then treat them as they would any criminal. Why do they need more laws?

Supervixen, no, neither you nor any other human being is a ‘troll’. People are people and it is not very Liberal to label people with the intention of de-humanizing them. It conjures up some very disturbing history ….. sad to see it on so-called Liberal sites. She owes you an apology.

37. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

those cowardly Americans, take 793..

Hard to believe that we’re descendents of people who crossed oceans and continents, some of us in chains, born of women who were born of women who risked death to bring us into the world.

38. Intermittent Bystander - 31 July 2007

Watching this week’s Wide Angle now.

WIDE ANGLE goes behind the scenes at Arab television channel MBC in Cairo for an inside look at the hit all-female talk show, KALAM NAWAEM. The film provides a nuanced portrait of four Arab women harnessing the power of transnational satellite TV to boldly and effectively push social reform. With exclusive access to both the private and the professional lives of the hosts and producers, the cameras capture censorship discussions, tension and camaraderie in the dressing room, and viewer reactions on the Arab street.

We see so few programs here exploring lifestyle issues in the Arab world (too busy stomping Arab lives to shit, I guess), so it’s interesting to see various topics explored by the Cairo equivalent of The View.

39. Intermittent Bystander - 31 July 2007

Interest fact (or factoid, don’t know), related to swimming in chadors, just noted by one of the Cairo TV hostesses: Out of 500 million Muslim women worldwide, only about only about 30 million wear the veil.

40. marisacat - 31 July 2007

that one guy that’s not banned, mostly | micronopoly@hotmail.com | IP: 66.75.111.118

marisacat, actually, I did notice, and UPDATED my diary before you posted your screed here… my assumption was not based on reading but based on the fact that at first all the comments post for the poster, but they don’t show up later.

You have less experience being banned here than I.

Jul 31, 6:45 PM — — More rotten tomatos on offer

Here is his update:

UPDATE: Ok, I was able to get a fact correction through Marisacat’s comments, to tell parker that parker is not banned here. Well that’s nice… mabye she hasn’t noticed and will delete them as I admit it’s me… BUT parker got the message so factually it will remain correct that I got the correction through.

pyrrho, I pay close attention and I knew your first post was you. You forget you keep using the same email? Micronopoly? Shall I pull up all of your comments so you can see?

Need a new set of diaper pins, too?

All three comments of yours are still in the thread.

You posted your diary at Emsock at 13:28 PDT

your first comment here was posted at 1:11 pm PDT (13:11) and was unmoderated within minutes. I am constantly cleaning out Moderation and Spam, the filters are fucked up.

that one guy that’s not banned, mostly | micronopoly@hotmail.com | IP: 66.75.111.118

parker is not banned

Jul 31, 1:11 PM — ] — Have a thread… ;)

Your second comment was posted at 3:48 PDT and went thru immediately, it was not held in any way. I am not researching times on your third post nor on both of Parker’s replies.

GET A LIFE.

Go away snitch bitch. I long ago said you needed a mother and suggested you be the online front for Emsock. I am sure you remember. A fine place for apologists (as you defend thereisnospoon) and abusers.

41. Intermittent Bystander - 31 July 2007

If MSOC treated her dog like she treats her blog, the Animal Precinct crew would be in her front yard filming the collar (as it were) right now.

42. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

Adolf Guiliani pisses on universal healthcare, using that all-purpose boogieman, Michael Moore:

“The American way is not single-payer, government-controlled anything,” Giuliani said. “That’s a European way of doing something. That’s a, frankly, a Socialist way of doing something.”

“If single-payer systems are cracking all over the world, why would we do it in America. Michael Moore wants to take you to Cuba for your health care. Anyone want to sign up? I didn’t think so. Maybe the Democrats will sign up.”

Cracking up?

Michael Moore responds.

43. bayprairie - 31 July 2007

He had run to Armando with commentary from a private email list (that NYCO held the keys to and it was she who had allowed pyrrho to the list) that came into existence post pie….

The agreed MO for the list was not to repeat off the list what was said on the list. It was for Dkos posters who were women, post pie. Pyrrho begged and whined his way onto the list… he always wants to be “with the women”.

marisa, i didn’t know you could paint! an excellent illustration of the meaning of “low rent”.

44. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

How Much Time Should She Do

Finally, what about if we’re deciding between an embryo and a born child — who wins out? Lots of feminists have asked this question before and we’ve never gotten a straight answer, so let me try again. Take this hypothetical, adapted from a great many abortion-related conversations: There’s a fire in a fertility clinic. Inside the clinic there’s a three-year-old boy who you’ve never met and have absolutely no connection to. There are also 100 embryos in a box, none of which you have any connection to. You only have time to run into the clinic one time. You cannot carry the boy and the box at the same time. What do you do? Do you save 100, or do you save one?

Those who want to see abortion criminalized need to think long and hard about the consequences of their ideal policies. They need to think long and hard about their true beliefs when it comes to fetal personhood. Because this post is long and I know all your time is valuable, I’ll even let busy “pro-life” readers off the hook with this one. If you don’t have time to address all the above-raised points, just answer this one: How much time should she do?

Link to the Anna Quindlen piece she references, link to the You Tube vid that Quindlen links to.

45. colleen - 31 July 2007

How much time should she do?

There was a guy on DK once, a friend of ihlin’s who was willing to partly answer that question. It was murder so quite a lot of time….

He was of the opinion that jail time should also be “on the table” for women who miscarry, particularly if it could be demonstrated that the woman in question had exercised too strenuously or had done something else to encourage a misscarriage. Ihlin LOVED him! She also loved the typical white male DK user who told me to shut up because he wanted to talk to this guy and I was interfering with his conversation.

Such fine Christians in Pastor Damning’s flock. Note that none of them object to rape and child molestation advocates. Who wouldn’t want them as neighbors and political allies?

46. marisacat - 31 July 2007

I blame the Democrats for this fucked “criminalisation” shit being loose in the land.

It was all over threads in the Kaine run. The theme being pushed at Dkos was “at least he is not for criminalisation”.

Neat… the snitches and operatives and the sick little nag boyz were all over it. It went down well, like medicine mixed iwth chocolate sauce.

And Quindlen.. well, half and half. her readership, largely, the base of it, is Catholic women. I doubt they can be moved from whatever their spot is… whether agaisnt it (criminalisation of either doctors or women) and pro choice or the mean bitches of the pro life circuits and the pro life clubs at the small fucked parishes.

The Mrs Robertses of this earth.

But again, it gets pushed around. Look where we are, discussing how long to incarcerate women.

Fillipovic is being disingenous here, the pro lifers know EXACTLY what they plan. As do many of their DP cohorts.

One goal of the anti-choice movement is to outlaw abortion. But, as Anna Quindlen points out, anti-choice activists are almost never able to identify what the legal consequences should be for women who terminate their pregnancies. So, pro-lifers, tell me: What should the penalty be? How much time in jail should a woman face for abortion?

The US will model itself on Colombia or Nicaragua. Banana frond prison land. How fast the “conversation” has advanced. So called liberals help the hard core to articulat what it is they plan.

How dumb can it get.

47. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

The US will model itself on Colombia or Nicaragua.

Abortion is already a felony in El Salvador.

There are women serving up to 30 years in jail for it.

48. marisacat - 31 July 2007

I remember the NYT spread in the magazine last year, on Salvador, iirc.

49. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

My “friend” Paul Mulshine at the Star Ledger who defended the Morristown hate rally wants the USA to become *more like El Salvador* and he’s open about it.

In his article he writes:

Morristown Mayor Don Cresitello has a problem: Because of MS-13, he needs 287(g) Got that? Maybe not. I’ll explain. “MS-13″ stands for “Mara Salvatrucha,” which is generally referred to as a Salvadoran gang, though that designation grossly libels the proud people of El Salvador, a country that ranks among my favorite places. MS-13 was in fact founded in California, no doubt by hoodlums whom the Salvadorans in their wisdom booted out of the country.

I wrote him to say:

Do you consider 30 year jail sentences for abortion
something that the mainstream voter in New Jersey is
in favor of?

And here’s how the little turd answered me.

You’re right. You don’t want to get into an argument about El Salvador. I spent lots of time there when the war was on. You, meanwhile, haven’t the vaguest clue about it. There was no “terrorist war.” The great mass of Salvos were well to the right of Reagan. And they beat back the Marxists.

50. colleen - 31 July 2007

The US will model itself on Colombia or Nicaragua

yep and what a boon to the privitized prison system that will be. Women are so much more tractable as a source of slave labor.

Where are the New Feminists on this?

51. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

Where are the New Feminists on this?

they’ll wear tiger-striped thongs while they break rocks and clean the commandant’s kitchen?

52. marisacat - 31 July 2007

ugh.

I read the Fillipovic to the end but not yet the Quindlen…

Somebody NEEDS to write that the pro lifers have this all charted out. Not ask what do they intend. Just say they intend to constantly move the conversation.

But that it is not politically viable RIGHT NOW to advocate for imprisoning women. They need to keep conditioning the country…

I have real problems with the standard push back on this. Or the device of saying that the hard right think women are too stupid or too frail or too weak… They think nothing of the kind..

They just want to control women to the last breath of life.

53. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

So I’ve been reading these threads about “thereisnospoon” and his friends and their attitudes about feminism.

I’m guessing the argument people here are making is:

“Their support for Casey in PA and Kayne in VA and willingness to compromise on abortion isn’t pragmatism. It’s reflective of their actual views on women and legal abortion”.

Part of the reason Atrios banned my IP from his site (I could have gotten around it easily enough but I chose to respect his wishes) was that I kept bitching about Casey’s anti-abortion politics. His only response was to accuse me of not giving money to Pennacchio. That was his answer.

54. marisacat - 31 July 2007

I have n ot read Atrios other than the odd post in about 3 years… and the threads are just too massive for me to undertake.

hmmm he gave the standard gibberish they pushed oout online to shut people up.

I think the Dems ran Casey, aside from the huge message it sent to the Church and the rightie Dems and pro lifers, they ran him to break people, to break the base and break Democratic voting women..

If they could get away with Casey, they can shovel a lot of shit sandwishes. And people will pay for the joy of that luncheon item.

55. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Interestingly enough the same people who support Casey also refuse to support Kucinich because he changed his position from anti to pro choice in 2003.

I’ve always thought that the majority of the “inner circle” on the DK were essentially “soft neocons” (as opposed to the batshit crazy extreme neocons at places like LGF). They’re fanatically pro Israel. They’re anti-communist, anti-populist really, anti anybody not from the elites participating in politics. They’re pro-military and in the end pro Iraq occupation.

But the part about “thereisnospoon” quoting the AEI institute just confirmed it.

Atrios was a good site for awhile in 2003/early 2004 (especially when they used to have “talk like Bill O’Reilly day”). But he got lazy and his comments were taken over by a very closed sort of clique and quickly become unreadable and unbearable.

56. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

well, I think bringing up criminalizing women is a bit of an inoculation against that movement to demonize/criminalize women.

57. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

For anyone who’s interested, I did transfer that MLW thread to email. So, anyone who wants it let me know …. SV’s posts are there I think that’s what was deleted.

Hair Club, what an arrogant jerk that guy is …. good for you for asking him the question though …

Atrios, I never got into his blog … seems like another arrogant prick. Why is it that all these ‘liberal’ bloggers are such jerks? I have little interest in any of them …. thank the gods there are others like Arthur Silbur who is a way better writer, and the Unapologetic Mexican and Scruggs et al, who are not jerks and whose writing is far superior imo …

58. Intermittent Bystander - 31 July 2007

Eschaton was the first place I made remarks online, in 2003.

As Strunk and Supervixen have said: Omit needless words

Like MB, Atrios was a better catalyst anonymous. IMHO and all that.

59. marisacat - 31 July 2007

well the problem is the pro lifers are doing quite well.

I have no problem discussing their intentions. But there is a reason they hold off advocating for prison time for women. And it is nto that they are confused about what to do.

It is tactical.

And I think posing it as, what do you intend to do, are you all clear on where this leads? Is there some reason, as in she is too lame weak stupid, you all don’t seek t criminalise women.

It strikes me as the wrong argument. It means the so called opposition is asking for help. For things to be made clear. I just dsilike the device. It is passive inquiry.

When the pro lifers just got a medical procedure banned. A federal ban.

Just always strikes me as lame. But I have not read Quindlen yet…

One thing I never forget is how, right out of the box as DNC chair on his first vist to Papa Timmy, when asked if the old panels should be brought back, who should decide about abortion, HOWARD allowed as how maybe panels would be brought back.

Well currently they, those old medical panels to permit “therapeutic” abortions, are UNCONSTITUTIONAL. NOt just dispensed with in the face of Roe but unconstitutional.

And Howard knows that. But he played along. Just as Tmmy did. Moving the country to the hard right.

Both parties are and have been for years reaching agreement. Doing deals, partitioning rights off.

But we face years of columns askign the pro lifers, what do you mean? help us out here.

I just cannot stand it anymore.

60. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Hair Club, what an arrogant jerk that guy is …. good for you for asking him the question though

Here’s his column.

http://www.nj.com/starledger/stories/index.ssf?/base/columns-0/1185857868112830.xml&coll=1

Too bad the guy absolutely detests Rush Limbaugh and Bush. He also supports Ron Paul.

These paleocons really confuse me.

Paul Craig Roberts is anti Iraq occupation and criticizes Israel. He’s also written columns supporting Pinochet.

I don’t know what to make of Justin Raimondo or the whole antiwar.com crowd. They get it right on some things but every once in awhile they go off the deep end.

Mulshine’s just a local version of Pat Buchanan. He’s fine on the war in Iraq, fine on Israel, fine on Bush. But on everything else, he’s a Nazi.

61. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Like MB, Atrios was a better catalyst anonymous. IMHO and all that.

You know how I found Atrios? In the fall of 2002, John Podhoretz was constantly giving him plugs in the NY Post about the Trent Lott affair. The neocons loved him back then as a “good leftist”.

62. Intermittent Bystander - 31 July 2007

Well, there was constant incestuous flirtation among right and left boy blogs back then, no doubt about it.

What snoo?

Christ (apologies, BHHM), they’re still giving gratuitous airtime to Bill O’Ruckin Feilly and David Brooks. Gag me with a (anyone got one?) bloody spoon.

63. Intermittent Bystander - 31 July 2007

PS: Lott was Eschaton’s founding breakthrough media triumph, IIRC.

64. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

It’s the sportsfan approach to politics. The crowd that posts at Atrios and Kos know they’re not going to have any real political influence through the elites and they’re not willing to do the hard work of grassroots organizing or risk humiliation and personal attacks (like Cindy Sheehan) so, in the end, chosing a “side” and rooting for it makes you feel good.

It’s the Steve Gilliard “Fuck the Fucking Yankees” school of politics. Really, the Mets vs. the Yankees? One group of millionaire athletes vs. another?

Same with the Republicans vs. the Democrats.

65. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

I actually half like Steve Gilliard. He was an overbearing prick sometimes and was capable of saying some incredibly stupid things but he did take some unpopular positions in white blogland (like defending Al Sharpton) and he did allow open debate on the Israel/Palestine issue.

66. Intermittent Bystander - 31 July 2007

Thank heavens they finally got off the topic of Andrew Sullivan.

67. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

of course it’s tactical, and of course the leaders of that movement hate women and hate humanity.

It’s little wonder I retreat into my depression and curl up in the bottom of the closest bottle.

68. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

That photo of Pam Atlas Shrugged woman giving Cindy Sheehan the finger. Notice how the usual crowd who’s obsessed wtih humiliating her (Tbogg, Atrios, Wolcott, Jesus General) have been silent about this.

I don’t know what’s worse. The usual neocon attacks on Sheehan or her erstwhile liberal friends (friends when she was going after Bush not the Democrats) completely abandonning her.

Makes me sick.

69. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

I meant to say to Miss D. I loved her versification from early this morning – oh, and yes, Armando did like to accuse people of hating him .. seemed to make him feel all warm and fuzzy!

Also, Paul, meant to comment on his post on the I/P situation a couple of threads back – I pretty much agree with what he said, but with the current situation in the world it seems pretty hopeless that anything positive can happen there unless the people force it, here and elsewhere. I read the other day that Olmert’s approval ratings were at 2%! Lol! It’s as though the people don’t matter, anywhere.

Meant to respond to StupidAsshole also, agree that jhritz and slouise are very similar. But I didn’t mean to imply they were the same person, just the same MO.

70. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Apologies to James Wolcott. He does address it.

71. lucid - 31 July 2007

Hair club – paleocons are a funny breed. They definitely have a certain frontierism to them – pull yourself up by your own bootstraps, get the government off my back, entrepreneurial capitalists, etc., etc. They’re really no different from Barry Goldwater. With the end of the cold war, they see no reason for American interventionism because the ‘threat’ of communism is over. However, though they might have the ‘right’ approach to foreign policy now it is not for the ‘right’ reasons – they are still all militarists to the core & should any power threaten capitalism they’d be quick to return to their cold war idiocies.

I find it odd when I have positions in common with Pat Buchanan [like the anti-globalization movement for instance], but it is easy to recognize that the reasons we share positions are themselves diametrically opposed.

72. colleen - 31 July 2007

Their support for Casey in PA and Kayne in VA and willingness to compromise on abortion isn’t pragmatism. It’s reflective of their actual views on women and legal abortion”.

Yes, this is abundantly clear. and it’s not a compromise. They live in such a bubble they believe there will be no blowback, not personally or politically.

73. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Yes, it’s our old familiar sea-weeded she-creature, Shamela of Atlas Shrugs, flipping the middle finger in a two-shot with Cindy Sheehan at a recent, humid antiwar rally. Note that it is Sheehan, the supposed nutball peacenik, who is being genial, outgoing, and a good sport in the photograph, unaware that her good nature is being exploited by the rude, smirky host of a website recently pruned from the Pajamas Media blogroll.

When we see pictures of high schoolers flipping the bird in the pages of high-school yearbook, we assume that such behavior is immature and juvenile, a minor infraction but–jerky. So how much jerkier and juvenile is it when a middle-aged mother of daughters behaves this way not once but twice with Sheehan, and shows her contempt for other women at the sparsely attended ragtag event by posing with her with finger erect? (The full scroll of her pictorial pranks can be found at the Atlas Shrugs site along with the rest of her poorly composed shots; no link.) Is this how she wants her kids to behave, like some overgrown, undersocialized, camera-hoggy Lindsay Lohan? Is this someone whom Republican candidates like Duncan Hunter really want to be associated with?

74. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

I find it odd when I have positions in common with Pat Buchanan [like the anti-globalization movement for instance], but it is easy to recognize that the reasons we share positions are themselves diametrically opposed.

Buchanan’s actually taken to defending the occupation of Iraq. Raimondo doesn’t but I know a lot of leftist anti-zionist Jews who utterly detest Raimondo. I’m not Jewish so I’m not qualified to judge whether or not he’s anti-semitic but the people I’m talking about hate Raimondo AND Israel. So it’s not like they object to his criticism of zionism.

I haven’t been able to get the Mulshine prick or anybody to explain why Ron Paul supporters are in favor of putting local cops under the federal government. It makes me distrust Ron Paul. Is he just against repression in the form of the Patriot Act because he has a much better form of repression himself?

75. marisacat - 31 July 2007

well when I lost it was the break between what Scott Lemieux wrote at his own blog on abortion (many excellent postings, highly detailed and incisive, twice iirc he had ema from Well Time Period on hand to be precise on medical issues) and then at TAPPED I think I read 5 posts from him (and there are probably more as I don’t get to TAPPED too often anymore, it’s BORRING), the Big Question, do the Pro Lifers think women are too stupid to be charged.

OK once or twice. But it gets to be easy diversion.

But I know I won’t be getting columns on the collusion between the parties to reverse abortion, make it illegal, turn it back to the states and then move on birth control – just to get to Griswold, at least that is what I suspect is coming…. BC, Which I suppose some Dems, like Hilarious and soccerette Mom, Patty Murray, will noisily “save” for us, til the stakes get to be too big…

It is all so dying swan. No real fight.

76. lucid - 31 July 2007

btw – SB, I meant to ask, did my little vignette last night qualify for the maleismssszs series? I kinda felt like I’d been temporarily been possessed by Elise right after I posted it…

77. colleen - 31 July 2007

Is he just against repression in the form of the Patriot Act because he has a much better form of repression himself?

yes indeedy. Ron Paul is a conservative pro-life prick. He wants to be selective about who he oppresses. He’s a great candidate if you’re opposed to the Iraq invasion and believe that white males are entitled to dominion over everyone else.

78. colleen - 31 July 2007

I kinda felt like I’d been temporarily been possessed by Elise right after I posted it…

Did you catch yourself starting in admiration at your breasts?

79. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

It pretty much leaves Kucinich as the only legitimate anti-war candidate in the race.

I’m not wild about Gravel’s ideas about a VAT tax for Americans or his support of English as the “official language”.

80. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Hypothetical question about Kos.

If by some miracle Kucinich got the Democratic nomination a la George McGovern and Giuliani the Republican, who would most Kos supporters back?

Most of them did back Bloomberg against Ferrer in 2005.

81. lucid - 31 July 2007

Did you catch yourself starting in admiration at your breasts?

I do that every chance I get. ;)

82. colleen - 31 July 2007

It pretty much leaves Kucinich as the only legitimate anti-war candidate in the race.

Kucinich is not a legitimate candidate.

83. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Kucinich is not a legitimate candidate.

What do you find objectionable about him?

84. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

So how much jerkier and juvenile is it when a middle-aged mother of daughters behaves this way not once but twice with Sheehan, and shows her contempt for other women at the sparsely attended ragtag event by posing with her with finger erect?

Hair Club, this pic should be taken and used against them. The caption should be something along the lines of ‘is this how Republicans show repect for our dead soldiers, to treat their mothers this way?’ Post it all over the Internet on blogs. Really shame them … most people see Cindy Sheehan only as the mother of a dead soldier, which really is what she is in the end. They will not appreciate this kind of thing, and will not understand it. But it should be seen with an appropriate caption ….

Colleen, I think at least from what I see of the bbbs, they are Republican lite, so have no problem with right-leaning candidates. This is why I will not support anyone they promote ….

I saw a diary promoting a candidate (Tx I think) on DK being promoted yesterday, eg. One commenter said to be careful before donating as this candidate was anti-abortion and there was a pro-choice candidate running also. She was attacked for injecting her opinion into the thread which was for a particular candidate. But she persisted. But what if she had not, many people would have donated to an anti-choice candidate without realizing it …

I think people should be very careful of candidates who are being promoted on DK ….

85. lucid - 31 July 2007

If by some miracle Kucinich got the Democratic nomination a la George McGovern and Giuliani the Republican, who would most Kos supporters back?

I think they’d commit suicide.

86. liberalcatnip - 31 July 2007

Some links and quotes of interest in my new Random News & Views Roundup. I’d post a few here but I’m exhausted.

Off to catch up on the rest of the thread here now.

If anyone wants to e-mail thereisnoclue’s collective comments for my post at MBM, that would be appreciated. Have to take one of the beasts to the vet’s tomorrow so I’ll be afk for a while – and then I’ll need a nap, of course.

llamg88 at hotmail.com

(I’m not in need of Viagra, thanks.)

87. marisacat - 31 July 2007

Just let SB out of moderation, sorry! There was a bit of a delay on that one…

88. marisacat - 31 July 2007

catnip

SB emailed it (comments) to me but I cannot get it to open.

I will try ot forward it to you if Sabrina is not around…

89. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

Are you kidding? They would have no problem supporting Giuliani – Kucinich, never, not on DK ….

btw – SB, I meant to ask, did my little vignette last night qualify for the maleismssszs series? I kinda felt like I’d been temporarily been possessed by Elise right after I posted it…

Lol, Lucid, sure, it was way more interesting to us (women) than the feminissms cartoon series for boys. It was supposed to be for women, but really it’s for boyz. We want equal time! Hey, they might invite you to do a men’s series on DK. DK, the Jerry Springer version of political blogs.

Btw, Lucid, I have a girl-friend (ahem!att.thereisnogirlfiend) who is in the city – she went to NYU, I think she may be finished there now … anyhow, she’s from Slovakia, really smart, in her early 20s. She doesn’t know too many people mainly because of work and school .. I’ll be talking to her this week and if she has more free time than in the past , maybe I could tell her about you guys and the music scene in NYC. Just a thought, SV’s visit to the city made me think of it ….

Have to go to sleep, I am such a night-owl, but have to be up super early tomorrow … so g’night, sweet dreams!

90. lucid - 31 July 2007

(I’m not in need of Viagra, thanks.)

Oh, sorry catnip. I needed to make a few extra bucks this month so I was probably the one spamming your in box with viagra deals. I’ll make sure to take you off my list. ;)

91. Hair Club for Men - 31 July 2007

Hair Club, this pic should be taken and used against them. The caption should be something along the lines of ‘is this how Republicans show repect for our dead soldiers, to treat their mothers this way?’ Post it all over the Internet on blogs.

The whole right wing school of bad photography is amusing. It shows off their narcissism. However I see the world is how the world is.

So if you sneak up on some anti-war protesters with a digicam and take a shaky, ultra high contrast shot at midday with no fill flash and it looks like shit, well, this means those anti-war protesters are as bad as your photo.

The contrast between the blond Sheehan and the dark sneaky looking Pam (which is accentuated by the bad photography) almost invites a racist/anti-semitic response. If I were Pam I’d be pissed as hell that someone shot me with a digicam and no flash at midday in the Summer against a woman with skin three shades lighter than mine. It makes her look like a snake and Sheehan like the innocent about to eat the apple.

92. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

Marisacat, it won’t open? I sent is as an attachment because when I tried it the other way, it came back or didn’t go … the one I sent myself, opened up fine. Tomorrow when I’m more awake, I’ll try to break it up and send it in two parts … or just sort out the deleted comments ….

93. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

well, I’d like to talk to Lemeiux about how one makes that compromise. Would I like to be paid for what I write? Sure. Would I compromise what I write, HOW I write, for that check?

I’d like to say no. I feel pretty confident to saying “no”.

Given that, no one is gonna listen to me. After the bannings and denial of service attacks and banishments from connected blogrolls … no one reads me anymore. I used to get linked out of Daou Report and Blogometer and get tons of links and hits… but those days are done, so not only am I ranting in the village square, but it’s the square of an abandoned city.

I’m pretty certain that my basic take on things is right. I’ve given it all a lot of thought. I can marshall arguments, gather cool links, carefully choose pics out of the vast netteries … I might as well be shouting into a gale. I’m bad at mixing in groups of people in the meat world, so I’m not terribly surprised or disappointed that the interweb is pretty much the same, but I’d allowed myself to hope …

In those past discussions of AA and depression and such … well. What’s to say? My mom says I was born telling the doctor off. I’ve been in fights with teachers and coaches and Scout leaders my whole life. I used to sit in a barn on the lot of the farm house my parents rented and talk to my imaginary friend about how cruel and messed up people were. I watched the news when I was five and six, the riots and war and assassinations and retreat to the barn, to commune with that made-up friend, wondering at the horror, and retreat into Asimov and Clarke and eventually Marvel Comics and Harlan Ellison and Michael Moorcock, and yet even then I hoped that the cynical disgust was wrong, that there was hope.

I can’t imagine submitting to a church or a 12-step group or anything else … I couldn’t imagine pretending that the very real horror my rational mind observes is to be avoided. I look at the wasted potential and the lies and the self-righteous avoidance that Americans wrap themselves in and I shudder. I’m so depressed, but as someone wrote in an earlier thread, it’s a depression based in reality. I’ve been depressed as long as I could comprehend the world. I crawl into the bottom of a bottle sometimes for a vacation from it, but it’s painfully clear that it’s not going away. It’s not an escape, it’s a vacation, a short vacation. I’ve also felt the frisson of chi rushing through my body when I’ve gotten a stance right in Tai Chi, felt the calm in the Baha’i Temple north of Chicago, sat at the top of Mt. Baldy at Philmont Ranch in NM and watched the sun rise … I know that we’re a small part of a bigger whole, though I have no need of gods or cosmic muffins to make that true. I also know that most people don’t bother to experience anything like that, and swallow the lies of preachers and conmen, here in this country where Tammy Fay is celebrated upon her death, worthless piece-of-shit concubine that she was.

Furthermore, I’m the man I am because of the women I’ve known. I’ve been informed by the men I’ve read, and the music recorded by other men, but so many women have taught me, taken time with me, shown me that there is so much potential in the world. Female teachers and singers and writers and friends and lovers have shown me art and music and philosophy and poetry and prose and nature … I’m who I am because I was willing to listen to women. I look at what is happening to them in this country, in this world, and my heart breaks. I read crap like posts from thereisnodecency and my soul is wounded. I’m not saying that women are better or higher or … I’m just saying that humanity, WESTERN humanity, for all of its high words and proclaimed standards betrays half the human race, and thus betrays ALL the human race.

I’m ranting, and depressed, and … shit … I shouldn’t be posting this stuff, but I have no confessionals or lodges or anywhere else, so why not? I pour out what I’ve read and understood to friends, family and aquaintances, and I get that blank-faced “what the fuck” face in response.

You people humor me, and damn, so you get to “enjoy” rants like this, but I just wish I had another beer.

94. marisacat - 31 July 2007

SB

It would not let me open the attachement after I downloaded it… but then I forwarded the email to my gmail acct

and when ir arrived the entire page had opened inside the forwarded email.

Text sides and comments…. ;)

I sent it to catnip just now…

I will never figure out computers.

95. moiv - 31 July 2007

SB –

I saw a diary promoting a candidate (Tx I think) on DK being promoted yesterday, eg. One commenter said to be careful before donating as this candidate was anti-abortion and there was a pro-choice candidate running also. She was attacked for injecting her opinion into the thread which was for a particular candidate. But she persisted. But what if she had not, many people would have donated to an anti-choice candidate without realizing it …

I think people should be very careful of candidates who are being promoted on DK ….

That probably was in the thread of a diary that I also saw re: Rick Noriega, who is pro-choice and a declared candidate in the Dem primary for Cornyn’s US Senate seat. His big-money opposition is Mikal Watts, who’s anti-abortion right down to the wire.

I believe I also saw a pro-Noriega post on the FP at Kos a few days ago, but as Watts is putting big piles of his own chips on the table, he has state party backing and will be hard to beat.

The Texas Bob Casey.

96. marisacat - 31 July 2007

madman…

I understand.

97. Madman in the Marketplace - 31 July 2007

Thanks.

I wish I didn’t like stories so much. I want to hang around, watch, see how horribly it all turns out. It’s the only thing that keeps me around.

How fucking sad is that? I persist in order to see the ending of a bad movie …

98. moiv - 31 July 2007

Yes, Madman, me too.

Any sentient being who doesn’t feel the occasional need to drain the dregs of despair inhabits a better world than ours.

99. Sabrina Ballerina - 31 July 2007

Wow, {[[Mitm}}} as always you have a way of saying things – I was just about to go to sleep when I saw your post and could not leave without responding.

Why do you think the rightwingers on DK wanted you silenced? Because people listen to people who have passion and believe what they write … seems to me that something was going on back then that no one really understood, just sensed, until it was too late.

So, not as many people get to read you as did back then. But that can be fixed. It’s the reason I was asking about a central blog which would get more readers for all the great writers, like you, on independent blogs. Because it’s a shame they are not more widely read, like Arthur Silber and others …. as for being paid and compromising, why would have to compromise.

I mentioned to Catnip the other day, and Ms xeno I think, you can write aritcled and submit them to thousands of local newspapers across the country. Even if only a few publish them, you get paid. You just need a list of publications and inspiration every once in a while … no compromises they take it or leave it. Local papers need material … also magazines. Just something to think about.

As for being depressed, I was the opposite of you … always happy and optimistic. Thought everyone was good or could be etc. etc. That led to not paying much attention to what was really happening in the world. So, when I woke up, starting in 2000 or so, it was a rude awakening and a hard to accept reality … not what I thought. I think this is what is happening to many people.

As for whether you should be posting this, I”m glad you did … you know if we were not depressed right now, that would be something to worry about. I do worry about my friends who seem oblivious, but then remember that’s how I used to be and sometimes I was I still was …

The human race is not very nice, as I once thought …. but there are nice people in it, a lot. Maybe more good than bad so that keeps me hopeful. We are so primitive still … I wonder will we ever evolve into a enlightened species where people can reach their full potential. I hope so ..

One thing, Mitm, you may be depressed but you help others with your writing because it validates their own feelings and suspicious and they see their own thoughts in writing and know they are not insane or alone in their thoughts. That’s how it felt for me when I first went online and found some writers who said what I was thinking. I knew I was not crazy then .. I knew my instincts were right and something really was wrong …

I wish I could give you a beer … anyhow, you’re not alone … hope it helps to know that …. :-)

100. lucid - 31 July 2007

MitM – your voice is always a welcome one to me, whatever your mood.

Hegel, though no feminist, argued that the fall of ancient Greek culture, despite its amazing accomplishments and contribution to history, occurred because of its collective failure recognize women as equal. in Phenomenology of Spirit he uses the trilogoy of Antigone to demonstrate that while within the symbollic order women were the representation of reason, democracy, justice, etc. on a cultural level they were no better than slaves and hence the determinate negation of Greek culture. While this has a bit of the Wilsonian ‘women as our moral center’ stench to it, it certainly does ring true if you are familiar with both the history of Greek thought and the history of ancient Greece… and it is a foundational concept of all elightenment humanism – if equality is not universal, then freedom is impossible.

We live in a world where human freedom, human essence, remains unrealized despite western delusions otherwise. We’ve been taught to view freedom in terms of ‘material freedom’, i.e. as the freedom to buy and own things, as opposed to a deeper ‘spiritual freedom’ – a freedom in which every human being is able to actualize themselves, choose their life and bring forth into reality their most passionate fantasies. Because of this, we still live within feudalism. That western people cannot recognize this is both a travesty and a testament to the cleverness of the aristocracy in preventing the revolution.

Are we shouting to the wind? Can we hold out hope that enough people will hear our voices and awaken from the hazy comfort of their pillow top beds? I don’t know.

It wounds me when I tell people something so simple and obvious as the above and they stare back as if I’m psychotic or patronize me with an expression of pity for my naivety.

I’m not drinking this evening, but I’m right there with you. And either way, I don’t think I can give up trying – the alternative would be to take up my birthright as a priveledged white male and enjoy the material comforts my contemporaries believe themselves entitled to. And that for me is an empty existence.

101. liberalcatnip - 31 July 2007

#27. LOL spyin’ cats:

LOL! Hilarious.

I don’t know what to make of Justin Raimondo or the whole antiwar.com crowd. They get it right on some things but every once in awhile they go off the deep end.

I like reading Raimondo. The man is the King of Links in his articles. I don’t always agree with him since I’m not a libertarian but I find him entertaining.

I will try ot forward it to you if Sabrina is not around…

Merci!

102. liberalcatnip - 31 July 2007

I’ve been depressed as long as I could comprehend the world.

Yup. Me too. I’m amazed I’ve lasted this long. Just too damn stubborn, I think.

103. marisacat - 31 July 2007

Well someone just sent me this (I saw her big FP weep and woe but I did nto open it, thanks I had my fill with pyrrho-technic boy)

I hope this answers some questions.
(8.92 / 13)

I am now going to my therapist, no doubt to spend far too much time crying
over this fucking blog.

I’m sick of being nauseated every time I sign on to my own fucking blog, and
if it takes banning every motherfucker who’s here just to fuck with it, so
be it.

-9.63, -7.03 If I can’t rant, I don’t want to be part of your revolution.

by: Maryscott O’Connor @ Tue Jul 31, 2007 at 15:18:19 PM CDT

LINK

Jeebus christ on a stick. I’d hate to be her therapist.

— end of email —

***********************************

As BHHm said long ago, not her keeper.

I suggest she mend yet another Fp skin rip and FP whine and put the text and the comments back up.

LOL Good enough for louisianagirl and Voyeurs: Good enough for a bullshit blog bud boy.

104. wu ming - 31 July 2007

you’re not alone, madman. i’ve been throwing more and more of myself into gardening and the daughter, just as a way of not overloading on it all, to find sources of energy and inspiration to keep myself going. my wife is a lot more pessimistic about this stuff than i am, so i’m usually embargoed on discussing the latest outrage with her. her family was targetted in the red scare at one point, so it’s not like it’s news to her that the country’s going to hell.

still, the existence of all thus soul crushing reality isn’t the whole of life. even in the shittiest of times, historically, life goes on. the trick is maintaining empathy without letting the pathos of it bury you alive, and in finding people to talk it out with. one of the beautiful things about these blogs is that one begins to realize that others are going through the same paces.

as for LSF, my account got messed up there a while back, so i can’t comment, but i do lurk.

105. bayprairie - 31 July 2007

sabrina said

For anyone who’s interested, I did transfer that MLW thread to email. So, anyone who wants it let me know …. SV’s posts are there I think that’s what was deleted.

sb, don’t forget ms xeno. she mentioned some feminist bloggers she wanted to share the comment thread with. and if it’s no trouble, send a copy to me too, at gmail.

thanx!

106. marisacat - 31 July 2007

Oh this is too funny:

See my front page post, please. (9.00 / 1)

IN my opinion, that person comes to MLW solely to fuck with it. The fact that she may post commentary that ISN’T necessarily trollish doesn’t make her any less a troll. If you want to know why I believe her a troll, visit Mcat’s site and witness her gleeful celebration of MLW’s recent troubles.
Frankly, if Mcat denizens wish to contribute here, they’re on a short fucking leash, because I know full well their primary intention is to fuck with MLW and celebrate their success in doing so.

I’m sick of it.

-9.63, -7.03 If I can’t rant, I don’t want to be part of your revolution.
——————————————————————————–
by: Maryscott O’Connor @ Tue Jul 31, 2007 at 16:20:51 PM EDT

LOL. I can reel off the so called sock puppets MSoc has used here.

She forgets – as does pyrrho – I see the IP.

“Ignoblesse” and “useful idiot” are but two she has used. It ws not even interesting her pathetic tries to post here, I just noted it, after all the site is mine.

I never even registered at MLW. Under any name.

Say what anyone will, hrh/SV posted there in opposition to an asshole. And is a relentlessly strong commenter on feminist issues. AND has never sucked up for the Treats and Sweets that the likes of Kos Armando etc dole out.

Nor is hrh someone who worked along side DD – I have said in open threads to msoc here in the summer of 06, she should have charged for all those months she was beside DD in 2004, if she did not, she is a fool, a longtime community organiser in the NE pointed out to me he/Delaware Dem NEVER waded in a thread battle without her, if he could help it: GET A FUCKING CLUE she worked as an operative with him – and gives refuge to and clears the way for the likes of Armando and thereisnospoon.

Basta.

107. bayprairie - 31 July 2007

oh sb! no need to bother with forwarding to me. someone already thoughtfully sent it!

108. ms_xeno - 31 July 2007

Mcat, thanks for the welcome-back, belatedly. And the links. And thanks to everyone who had technical advice. I had grand plans to forward Dick Spoon’s comments to a few important folks (well, important to me) but it will have to wait until tomorrow. Long day at work and I’m barely able to sit up straight. Bah.

109. marisacat - 1 August 2007

ugh

I got thru the Quindlen and on page 2 she manages to get to the federal ban:

Justice Anthony Kennedy, obviously feeling excessively paternal, argued that the ban protected women from themselves. “While we find no reliable data to measure the phenomenon,” he wrote, “it seems unexceptionable to conclude some women come to regret their choice to abort the infant life they once created and sustained.”

well if a priest abusing a child is “paternal”…

Kennedy answered the dog whistle of an observant catholic. he conformed to the Catholic Bishops. And I certainly do think the court was charged with accomplishing several roll backs, abortion and Brown v BofE the other.

And iirc Quindlen is a Catholic —- she certainly looks like the eternal boring good girl, the sort who to put it vulgarly, gives good daughter — she won’t be saying much other than the deep knee bend of “paternal”.

More slowly dying swans.

110. marisacat - 1 August 2007

whoever plans to do soemthing with the TINS comments, besure to gild them!

that boychick is blog royalty:

[M]aybe I’m missing something here. I agree that TINS’ sentiments on rape were wrong and highly offensive.

But surely something more than comments should be required to demote someone who’s damn near blogosphere royalty.

ProgressiveHistorians: History and Politics Of, By, and For the People

——————————————————————————–

by: Nonpartisan @ Tue Jul 31, 2007 at 19:27:55 PM CDT

well he was a long time suck up to Armando, still is…. So not too surprising.

111. D. Throat - 1 August 2007

Ms. X. make sure to send Thereisnorape’s “apology” to show he has no remorse.

112. marisacat - 1 August 2007

pyrrho

you are banned. Stop trying to post.

You are like a child hanging on an adult’s leg. Go home to mother.

113. BooHooHooMan - 1 August 2007

I think as a nation we haven’t even begun to ponder the real, core meaning of 9/11, regardless of “who” one thinks the perpetrators were who were behind it. To me the meaning of 9/11 is this: Our nation indeed HAS become a gluttonous sham of a country filled with individuals either so frightened of losing what little they have or so obsessed with getting that next TV or SUV for self validation that a small group of nefarious people VERY WELL CAN hijack your reality and terrorize “the most powerful nation on earth”(c) into submission rendering questions of why superfluous.

Bush and Cheney should have been Impeached by both parties the day they found out about the August 2001 PDB. It’s a wonder they weren’t seized, if not shot by the patriotic brass we’re always hearing about in the Pentagon. We don’t have Military Oaths of Personal Allegiance to the Commander in Chief.

And to the candyass DK voyeurs: I already have an FBI file.

114. bayprairie - 1 August 2007

Supervixen, aka “HunterHawk” (6.00 / 1)
Despite your claim that this comment will “soon be deleted” (which you made elsewhere, ahem), this comment will NOT be deleted by any administrator at MyLeftWing.

You have us confused with DailyKos–we don’t erase comments here.

Thanks for signing up with a new online name, though.

by: The BloggingCurmudgeon @ Sun Jul 29, 2007 at 11:12:59 AM CDT
[ Parent | Reply ]

ooops. somebody spoke too soon.

115. marisacat - 1 August 2007

Bush and Cheney should have been Impeached by both parties the day they found out about the August 2001 PDB — BHHM

is that ever the truth. Instead we spin along with shits like Ignatius to sell the widening wars. And Hillary saluting and waving the flag of the Punjab or Israel or whereever.

I just read today that George Packer is up in the New Yorker, on the scabrous boys Pollack and O’Hanlon and their recent POS NYT opinion piece… and he tries to sell them as long time critics of the war.

WE ARE SO FUCKING FUCKED.

116. BooHooHooMan - 1 August 2007

When attacking hrh, Shouldn’t MSOC have added the italics?….
…this person is a troll in my considered opinion myself, namely, that I am a person with a considered opinion

Highly labile individuals– persistently pickin’ petals while palabering*
” Markos loves me, he loves me not” DO NOT “considered opinion” makers make.— Regardless of how many rubberneckers momentarily pay attention.

‘slike sayin’ : “4 out of 5 Star Trek Convention Attendees say….”

pallabering 1.) v. – to blabber palaver of the worst kind, lol.

117. BooHooHooMan - 1 August 2007

Who gives a shit?!? With conciliators in our midst what comes NEXT?
Gettin’ the BIG Battle plan together? Oh that is just priceless.Its taken me 20 + years to see it. It’s always the next election ” that we’ll REALLY be able to…”

I’ve personally lived a decent life, but I’ve seen every promise of Democracy left unfulfilled, the minimal beachheads of progress in a secular society are being being pounded relentlessly and washed away.

And the flotsam and jism of the Blog Boyz sails on.

118. D. Throat - 1 August 2007

Ah (0.00 / 0)
Well, let me say I agree with you completely in theory — blogosphere royalty is a bad thing. But on the other hand, from a pragmatic point of view, this site needs more traffic because MSOC needs more cash. And keeping blogosphere royalty like TINS on the front page is a surefire way to keep that traffic. It’s cynical, but when you’re soliciting money for groceries, maybe it’s necessary.

Besides that, I think TINS has earned his front-page spot with a number of excellent essays over the years. His piece on the Overton Window was a landmark in blogosphere history.

ProgressiveHistorians: History and Politics Of, By, and For the People
by: Nonpartisan @ Tue Jul 31, 2007 at 23:12:46 PM CDT

Money trumps progressivism every time. Yes, please keep haboring Thereisnorape… so you can get more hits…

119. marisacat - 1 August 2007

I wonder have they figured out the numbers there continue to fall WITH him on the fp.

This is almost, but not quite, entertaining.

120. D. Throat - 1 August 2007

Crashing the Gates – JetBlue Style
by TocqueDeville
Fri Jul 20, 2007 at 12:14:51 AM PDT

We’re almost there. All we need now is a few more rides in the limo, a weekend at the Grove, and an opportunity to completely fuck a few of our fellow “progressives” – for the greater good of course – and we’ll have fully assimilated into the Beltway culture.

Call this an epitaph for the People Powered movement.

(now deleted from Daily Kos)

How far we’ve come. From taking our country back to becoming a cash machine for entrenched power. I honestly thought it would take a bit more than this. You should have at least held out for the Grove. The food is to die for.

Remember when Howard Dean said, “I’m from the Democratic wing of the Democratic party?” What did you think he was saying there? He was saying that his party, your party, has been compromised.

What Dean knows, even if he didn’t get his war, is that it’s not the people who need to change. It’s the system itself. I guarantee, the vast majority of Democrats occupying the halls of power in Washington started out just like you and me. They got into politic to do good.

But the machine beats them down. Raising money, trading votes, and eventually, they become the system. They learn to play the game, and the game wins. Now, they serve no function but to maintain the status quo.

And now we get to watch a little scaled down, mini version of these events play out right here. Some of the “leaders” of the blogworld are seriously vaccuous opportunists. They see this as a path to a fat gig.

121. bayprairie - 1 August 2007

MEsock and the “new definition” of a MLW trollish post.

“deeply traumatic” (7.50 / 2)
Being dateraped by a guy whom you previously trusted IS deeply traumatic. Perhaps even moreso than being attacked by an armed stranger in a parking lot. Marital rape, which I mentioned elsewhere in this discussion, is likewise deeply traumatic. This is a situation in which a man you loved, who made a vow to honor and protect you, forcibly rapes and brutalizes you. I know one woman who brought charges against her husband for forcible rape, and made them stick. He’s now in jail. Good for her.

Furthermore, the impulse behind the rape, the daterape, and the marital rape is the same: “This woman is here for my enjoyment and I don’t need her permission.”

When you shrug off the problem of daterape and complain about women falsifying rape charges, etc., you perpetuate the culture that condones that rape impulse.

You don’t seem to understand that.

by: HunterHawk @ Mon Jul 30, 2007 at 09:25:34 AM CDT

she erased that?

My Left Wing Lies

122. D. Throat - 1 August 2007

Thereisnorape said:

If old school feminists can’t get that the new feminism has appropriated sexiness as a new form of empowerment, and is so behind the times that it doesn’t understand the irony inherent in a modern Maryanne and Ginger pie fight and…

would rather deny ad revenue to a major progressive blog than even be forced to look at the ad,

… there’s not much help for them.

It has nothing to do with right-of-center Reaganite views–it has to do with different tactics.

I can’t cut and paste this quote enough.

The image I get from Thereisnorape here is of a woman being held down and hair pulled back so she can look at those ads… then being told it was all in her best interest to be “forced” for the common good of blogads.

123. marisacat - 1 August 2007

hmm Just saw this at Angry Arab, who got it from iraqSlogger:

The Lebanese al-Akhbar daily reported that a “semi-official” autonomous government was announced yesterday in Southern Iraq.

The paper said that “over 40 tribal chiefs from the provinces of Basra, Nasiriya, ‘Amara and Samawa” have signed an agreement announcing the birth of a “self-ruling government” in the Shi’a-dominated southern provinces; and released a statement signed by “the administration of the autonomous government of the South.””

Posted by As’ad at 1:38 AM 11 comments

So when the Brits pull out (sure sounds today like Brown will try to achieve that)… then

-we move into the south as well? And

-work on the Turko – Kurd war in the North? And

-run ‘over the border’ ops into Iran? And

-wage war into the provinces of Pakistan, TOO?

Surge the surge and surge it again.

124. D. Throat - 1 August 2007

What is coming out loud and clear from MLW is that it is indeed a sham blog… not one word about Thereisnorape’s comments from the day before… not one word… from anyone. The email mail tree must have worked overtime.

How can you control an entire blog community like that unless it is all false to begin with?

125. BooHooHooMan - 1 August 2007

“Blogosphere royalty like ‘spoon” says NonPartisan?
L.
M.
A.
O.

So NP is the kids Dad now.Who knows?
Maybe the blogosphere royalty claim is coming from Uncle Shmuel. LOL

Next the Non Partisan Historian is going to verify biblical texts and certify land claims for this improbable Royal Klansman.

126. D. Throat - 1 August 2007

Also, not one mention of RESTORING the “accidentally” deleted comments that “by chance” included comments from Thereisnorape showing him to be a misogynistic prick. The comments are still on the server… how come Emsock is refusing to restore them…and why isn’t anyone asking?

127. BooHooHooMan - 1 August 2007

I’m out.

128. StupidAsshole - 1 August 2007

“How can you control an entire blog community like that unless it is all false to begin with?”

Because people are sheep and consensus is extremely easy to manipulate. People love to police one another. The world is chock-full of Elises, mbnycs, clonecones and taylormattds.

129. marisacat - 1 August 2007

oh too funny…

Someone emailed me that if you do a cache search for the diary title + HUNTERHAWK you get reams of comments:

i used this search phrase

Kos’ Ebay Auction as Fundraiser… WOW! hunterhawk

and after it loaded the first time i went to the bottom and clicked the hyperlink that says

repeat the search with the omitted results included.

at that point i got about 3 pages of hits. some were individual comments, some a nest of two and three but several are yards long. ive saved all the ones i looked at, both long and sort. i did the first page completely and plan to return to this tomorrow.

For anyone out there who wants the rape equivocator’s comments… and remember, treat them gently, gild them, play soft music for the comments….

The author is nearly blog royalty. NP says so.

laugh yourselves to sleep on that scheisse.

130. D. throat - 1 August 2007

Absolutely (0.00 / 0)
And when I discussed the concept at my site, I linked to Trevino alone — he’s one of my favorite bloggers, left or right.

Nevertheless, Spoon was the purveyor for most if not all of the readers in left blogistan. He gets credit for recognizing that piece for what it was, and disseminating it to s many.

ProgressiveHistorians: History and Politics Of, By, and For the People
by: Nonpartisan @ Wed Aug 01, 2007 at 04:03:33 AM CDT

Who are they kidding?

131. Nonpartisan - 1 August 2007

Way, way late response to Catnip on the previous thread: TINS kept saying that half the readership of BMT had left when Caliberal departed that site. I think he was confusing her with you, though he never acknowledged as much despite my queries to him.

132. D. throat - 1 August 2007

What is this???

Sensing an opportunity to impress religious voters — and tip elections — Democrats in Congress and on the campaign trail have begun to adopt some of the language and policy goals of the antiabortion movement.

For years, the liberal response to abortion has been to promote more accessible and affordable birth control as well as detailed sex education in public schools.

That’s still the foundation of Democratic policies. But in a striking shift, Democrats in the House last week promoted a grab bag of programs designed not only to prevent unwanted pregnancies, but also to encourage women who do conceive to carry to term.

The initiative, part of a broader appropriations bill, passed the House with solid bipartisan support. A separate measure, still pending, calls for funding maternity and day-care centers on college campuses so pregnant students won’t feel they must have an abortion to stay in school.

Such efforts are aimed at alleviating the concerns women often cite to explain why they’ve turned to abortion: financial strain, fear of raising a baby alone, disruption to work and school.

“We are willing to talk about anything that helps women make good choices,” said Rep. Diana DeGette (D-Colo.), co-chairwoman of the bipartisan Pro-Choice Caucus. Preventing unplanned pregnancies, she said, “is not the whole story.”

Rep. Tim Ryan of Ohio, a Democrat who opposes abortion, goes even further. For the first time, he said, his party is sending a forceful message to conflicted women: “Bring the baby to term, and we’ll provide for you.”

The Senate will take up the spending package later this year. In the meantime, liberal stalwart Edward M. Kennedy (D-Mass.) is working with staunch conservative Sam Brownback (R-Kan.) to mandate more support services for pregnant women carrying fetuses with genetic abnormalities, such as Down syndrome. Focus on the Family, an influential conservative ministry, praises that bill as “lifeaffirming.”

Hmmm…. sounds like Kennedy is promoting Leslie’s “shopping spree” that now with the new supreme court ruling “we can go after” abortions for birh defects like Downs Syndrome.

I saw this at myDD and they brought in a known paid operative to shill and cover Tin Ryans anti abortion ass.

My question is where is the text of he bill and will this be used as a qualifier to criminalize all abortion?

133. Madman in the Marketplace - 1 August 2007

I’m sorry your acct is screwed up wu ming. LSF has been screwed up since we moved to a new host to stop the DNS attacks (the old hoster used to just shut us down). The move screwed some things up, and I’m not good enuff at this crap to fix it.

134. Madman in the Marketplace - 1 August 2007

oh, and thanks for the encouragement everybody … it does help. Off to work.

135. Sabrina Ballerina - 1 August 2007

Blog Royalty? Lol … the problem is that certain Kossacks believe that their personal experiences should determine public policy, and their personal blog friends should be everyone’s favorite writers. I think that’s what causes the never-ending problems they have. They are so self-centered, that it is shocking to them to discover that the vast majority of people in the world do not share their preferences or their views. In fact, most of the world never even heard of them.

I never thought Tins was anything more than a mediocre writer, not very inspiring, lacking in passion, and very often wrong on facts. Iow, he is a dime a dozen on the Internet. NP spends way too much time confined to the BBB so yes, by comparison to what is left on DK, and the dull, boring aspect of its FP, anyone looks like blog royalty. Which is why people are moving away from that small circle of blogs. Any of the really good writers who used to be there, are no longer there …

As for what happened with Tins on MLW, the problems occurred because he is posting extreme rightwing and very old-fashioned views about women on a leftwing blog. What did he expect? Going back to the 50s is not what women (or men) want whether they are Republicans or Democrats. In the end, he made himself look like some old guy with a very bad temperament.

His views are the views of the past and he naturally attracts friends who shares those views. His mistake is in thinking the rest of the world also shares them. Rather than wake up and accept that he lives in an increasingly narrow world (as does DK) he tried to push his old views on others as if they were ‘new’. Calling them ‘new’ doesn’t change the fact that they are old.

Almost without exception, his views were rejected . We are not going back to the 50s.

I would advise NP that his opinions on who is ‘blog royalty’ are his own. Tins is NOT viewed as a great blog presence by anyone other than some at DK. The great writers of the blogoshere do not reside at that blog. Most people around the internet never heard of Tins and of those who have, he is by no means a generally accepted top writer or personality. But as always, everyone is entitled to their opinion, just so long as they realize that’s all it is, an opinion.

136. JJB - 1 August 2007

Oh really, Mr. Burns?

But to speak of General Petraeus in particular, General Petraeus is 54 years old. Let’s look at this just simply as a matter of career, beyond the matter of principle on which I think we could also say we could expect him to make a forthright report. At 54, General Petraeus is a young four star general, who could expect to have as much as ten more years in the military. And he has every reason to give a forthright and frank report on this. And he says, and he says this insistently, that he will give a forthright, straightforward report, and if the people in Washington don’t like it, then they can find somebody else who will give his forthright, straightforward report.

He is not without options on a personal basis, General Petraeus, and I think he, from everything I’ve learned from him, sees both a professional, in the first place, and personal imperative to state the truth as he sees it about this war.

William Westmoreland was 50 when he took charge of our military effort in Vietnam.

So much for the idea that youth equals truth in the General population.

Between war pimps/apologists like O’Hanlon and Pollack being described as harsh critics of the BushCo. war effort in spite of easily found evidence to the contrary that proves they have all along been BushCo. promoters; AND

Yesterday’s headlines about “US Fatality Count Lowest In 8 Months” when a fuller accounting shows the total for July (78) to be only 3 less than February and March, and that when you count total coalition deaths, the total for July was higher than a number of months in the relevant time period; AND

That by the standards of 2004 through 2006, 78 US dead in one month is quite high;

It is impossible to believe anything other than that this report was written long before any useful analysis could have been done, and they’re simply trying to manipulate things to conform to the foregone conclusion, and in doing so they will tell lies so obvious they cannot even be described as transparent.

137. JJB - 1 August 2007

Hair Club, no. 55,

Atrios was a good site for awhile in 2003/early 2004 (especially when they used to have “talk like Bill O’Reilly day”). But he got lazy and his comments were taken over by a very closed sort of clique and quickly become unreadable and unbearable.

That’s about as good a critique of Eschaton as I’ve ever read. Duncan Black got extraordinarily lazy, with most of his posts being perhaps 10-20 words of his own, and most of those the identical phrase “yeah, yeah, another stupid open thread.” I haven’t been in one of his comment threads in at least 3 years. The only reason I still go there is because he links to and quotes a fair amount of interesting material, proving that his laziness does have its positive aspects, and he’s smart enough to realize that other people write far bette material than he does.

138. marisacat - 1 August 2007

7:06 am

just let several out of Moderation, D Throat (2), Sabrina, NP…

139. Paul - 1 August 2007

I have two ideas. Let’s troll DailyKos, and let’s raise money to get the blog-software ready for prime-time.

It’s fun and easy to troll dailykos. You can use free proxy services to get around the bans and keep registering and posting at DailyKos.

It’s easy to spawn new gmail accounts to use for additional registrations.

This is the way to drive them nuts.

Either that, or we can sit on the margins and make fun of these DLC, “Blue Dog”, Republicans taking over the Democratic party as they make arrangements for Bush to finish his term and receive a preemptive pardon for all his crimes…

140. Paul - 1 August 2007

Look what Mike Stark did to Bill O’Reilly. You can do that to Markos right in the thread of his front-page posts.

If a bunch of us do it at once, they’ll go crazy.

My best rhetorical attack on Kos is that he opposes impeachment and that he’s still a Republican.

We can go and tear that place apart if they plan to keep to keep obstructing impeachment.

If we get a bit of money raised for software, we can create the new center of gravity for group-blogging.

141. marisacat - 1 August 2007

No thanks Paul. I am not interested in your “cyber sit-in”

*******************

A word of warning, there seem to be hiccups at WP (what is new) and i Just lost a comment. Maybe a good idea to ‘save all” and “copy” before posting a comment.

142. Paul - 1 August 2007

My “cyber-sit-in” is a rather subversive thing to do, but everyone has their own style.

I think I need to resume my “cyber-sit-in” to challenge marKos on impeachment again.

143. JJB - 1 August 2007

Hairclub, no. 60,

Justin Raimondo is a right-wing gay man who supported Pat Buchanan for president. He believe FDR intentionally provoked Japan into attacking the US so as to get us involved in WWII (I don’t believe he’s ever expressed an opinion on how FDR “provoked” Hitler into declaring war on us, but I’m sure he could come up with something). He does seem to genuinely hate war, and all those who, in his opinion, initiate it. He also counts among his cherished colleagues the aforementioned Pukecannon, and the loathsome wealthy Greek fascist and jailbird (got caught smuggling coke into the UK and did time for it) Taki Theodoracopulos.

144. lucid - 1 August 2007

How can you control an entire blog community like that unless it is all false to begin with?

From what I can tell MLW consists of the FP’s and maybe 25 other regular posters, so it wouldn’t be that hard…

145. bayprairie - 1 August 2007

But surely something more than comments should be required to demote someone who’s damn near blogosphere royalty.

by: Nonpartisan @ Tue Jul 31, 2007 at 19:27:55 PM CDT

from a pragmatic point of view, this site needs more traffic because MSOC needs more cash. And keeping blogosphere royalty like TINS on the front page is a surefire way to keep that traffic. It’s cynical, but when you’re soliciting money for groceries, maybe it’s necessary.

by: Nonpartisan @ Tue Jul 31, 2007 at 23:12:46 PM

statements cited above come very close to a “these knee pads are attached to the bones of both my legs with permanent surgical screws” moment.

146. D. throat - 1 August 2007

Whoa!!!!


Look what the cat just dragged in:

While at Northern Illinois University in 1993, during the period when President Clinton was endeavoring to implement a new policy that would allow gays to serve openly in the US military, Markos A. C. Moultisas published an editorial in the Northern Star, opposing the service of gays in the military.

Clinton’s 1993 initiative for gay rights was defeated. Markos A.C. Moulitsas’ 1993 editorial opposing Clinton’s gay rights initiative is reprinted below, verbatim, in its entirety.

Military Right

Published on: Monday, January 25, 1993

It’s truly disturbing how much ado has been made over Bill Clinton’s campaign promise to lift the ban on homosexuals from the U.S. military. It’s ironic how it has taken a president who has never served in the military to make a promise that affects the military in such a negative manner.

Those who have served in the military, such as myself, understand the demands and pressures of military life are incompatible with allowing integration with homosexuals. I’m neither socially conservative or prejudiced, and neither is liberal columnist Mike Royko, Gen. Colin Powell, and influential liberal Democrats Sam Nunn and Les Aspin, all who’ve come out against lifting the ban.

Under military circumstances, as much has to be done as possible to focus the unit’s mission and keep disciplinary problems to a minimum. Worrying about whether the known homosexual sleeping next to you is watching as you change your underwear may seem trivial as you read this, but to the soldier who’s short-tempered after three weeks in the field and four hours of daily sleep, it becomes a matter of great importance to his pride and sensibilities. And in any case, there aren’t many people who would change clothes in a group of co-workers if members of the opposite sex were in the same room watching. There is something inherently uncomfortable about it.

Such fears would go a long way in disrupting efficiency and morale in a unit.

MARKOS C.A. MOULITSAS

Undecided

Freshman

This boyz got serious sexual issues…

147. JJB - 1 August 2007

Open letter to Emsock, who seems to spend an awful lot of time here:

I, for one, couldn’t care less about your ridiculous website. I have never registered there, have never posted a comment there, almost never go there except to get a few cheap laughs at your expense when people post links to material posted there. If you were less of a solipsist than you are, you would realize just how embarrassing it is for you both personally and professionally (such as you can be said to have a profession), and just how unintentionally revealing your signature quote is. BTW, Emma Goldman would appreciate it if you stopped using it, you’re doing a huge disservice to both her and the informing idea behind the original “If I can’t dance, I don’t want to be a part of your revolution.”

148. D. throat - 1 August 2007

Spam, spam go away and come back another day

149. marisacat - 1 August 2007

whatta boy, he is so basic. So juvenile.

Gays and wimmens have couties.

No wonder he gathered a cadre of small thugs.

150. marisacat - 1 August 2007

New Thread

LINK

********************

Also, WP seems loaded iwth more glitches than normal. I am going to go hunt up the Forums and see if there is an ongoing thread to complain in. Looked for the “Feedback” button that used to be on the “dashboard”… LOL not there anymore.

Sneaky!

151. lucid - 1 August 2007

Holy crap! Not only is he an idiot, but his grammar sucks as well…

I’m neither socially conservative or prejudiced, and neither is liberal columnist Mike Royko, Gen. Colin Powell, and influential liberal Democrats Sam Nunn and Les Aspin, all who’ve come out against lifting the ban.

I mean, shit, my grammar sucks when blog posting – as that is the nature of quickly rattled off comments, but this was actually published? In a paper? Did they have editors?

152. colleen - 1 August 2007

I’m sick of being nauseated every time I sign on to my own fucking blog

Wow, emsock and I have something in common.

153. colleen - 1 August 2007

As for what happened with Tins on MLW, the problems occurred because he is posting extreme rightwing and very old-fashioned views about women on a leftwing blog. What did he expect? Going back to the 50s is not what women (or men) want whether they are Republicans or Democrats. In the end, he made himself look like some old guy with a very bad temperament.

His views on the sexual molestation of children have not been legal since women were able to vote in this country. I can see why NP would call him blog royalty.
I think that even spoonless understood what the effects would be. Clearly he w/are trying to produce a buzz and garner attention. Emsock, being what she is, went along with it.

154. wu ming - 1 August 2007

as a frontpager at MLW, i haven’t gotten any email or anything to say that TINS shouldn’t be spoken about. my hunch is that most people are just sick of the whole episode, and would rather not think of the misogynist wanker again (i may just be speaking for myself here). so if there is an email tree coordinating messages, i’m not on it.

155. D. throat - 1 August 2007

Why haven’t they restored the deleted comments?

156. supervixen - 1 August 2007

JJB, I would guess that MSock knows about as much about Emma Goldman as Thereisnobrain knows about Erica Jong.

157. wu ming - 1 August 2007

beats the hell out of me, as i said above, it’s not coordinated at all, with the very odd exception. i think i’ve gotten a maximum of 2 or 3 emails regarding the site ever.

158. Utter Slurpation « Marisacat - 2 August 2007

[...] over pyrrho’s text (and the repititous blither of his comments), does he anywhere link to the pertinent thread at [...]


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