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Thread……….. 10 April 2008

Posted by marisacat in 2008 Election, California / Pacific Coast, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter, Lie Down Fall Down Dems, The Battle for New Orleans, WAR!.
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San Anselmo CA - 2004
San Anselmo – CA – 2004

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1. diane - 10 April 2008

Chevron Slow to Announce Hire of Controversial Pentagon GC

“When a company recruits a prominent government official, it’s usually eager to put the word out immediately. But Chevron Corp. took more than a month to publicly confirm that it had hired William “Jim” Haynes II, the controversial former general counsel of the Pentagon. Chevron officials say that they didn’t make a big deal of Haynes’ hiring because they didn’t think it was newsworthy.

Haynes, however, is very much a man in the news. In addition to having run one of the biggest law departments in the federal government, Haynes has drawn fire for his role in developing the Bush administration’s detainee interrogation policies. Democratic senators maintained that Haynes had approved interrogation procedures that amounted to torture and were able to kill his nomination to a federal judgeship.

The U.S. Department of Defense announced Haynes’ resignation as general counsel Feb. 25. Two days later Chevron general counsel Charles James sent a memo to the company’s management committee stating that Haynes would be coming aboard as chief corporate counsel. Haynes, who will report to James, will manage the 45-attorney legal department.“

quaint.

2. liberalcatnip - 10 April 2008

1. He’ll fit right it considering all of Chevron’s human rights abuses around the world.

3. liberalcatnip - 10 April 2008

Here’s a follow up on The Independent’s food additive/food colouring story: Food agency calls for ban on six artificial colours

These colours and the preservative sodium benzoate (E211) were linked to hyperactivity…
[...]
The board decided to take no action on sodium benzoate because it was “a preservative” rather than a colour. E211, which is linked with other potential health problems, is found in many soft drinks including Diet Coke, Irn-Bru, Lucozade and Fanta, and its removal would pose a significant technological and financial challenge to drinks companies.

Iow, the lobbyists won that one.

4. marisacat - 10 April 2008

FWIW

Frontier airlines went out. Bankrupt… I don’t even know wehre they flew, but at least I had heard of them…………..

5. diane - 10 April 2008

2

Yeah, just like Chevron et al (and their ‘Big Four’ accounting firms) fit so nicely “sponsoring” “commercial free” public broadcasts in the ‘public’s interest.’

6. marisacat - 10 April 2008

Very nervous… LOL

7. liberalcatnip - 10 April 2008

Speaking of people with enormous amounts of money getting favours: Court condemns Blair for halting Saudi arms inquiry

Tony Blair’s government broke the law when it abandoned a fraud investigation into a multibillion-pound arms deal between BAE Systems and Saudi Arabia, the High Court ruled yesterday.

Two senior judges condemned the Government’s “abject” surrender to a “blatant” threat when the Serious Fraud Office (SFO) halted its inquiry into allegations that BAE had made secret payments to Saudi officials in order to secure a series of massive contracts. BAE has always denied any wrongdoing.

This isn’t over yet.

Mr Blair faced controversy in December 2006 when Lord Goldsmith, the Attorney General, announced the investigation had been dropped. Mr Blair warned at the time that threats had been received which indicated that continuing the inquiry would put British lives at risk.

But yesterday, Lord Justice Moses and Mr Justice Sullivan said that the SFO director, Robert Wardle, had failed to stand up to threats from the Saudis.

They said: “The director was required to satisfy the court that all that could reasonably be done had been done to resist the threat. He has failed to do so.”

How about going after the Saudis for those “threats”? (rhetorical question, obviously)

8. liberalcatnip - 10 April 2008

6. Flipping hilarious! Flip-flopper. lol

9. diane - 10 April 2008

4

Dominoes __ __ __////////||||||||||

10. diane - 10 April 2008

6 Unbelievable……..

11. liberalcatnip - 10 April 2008

Marcy Winograd has a diary up at dkos now thanking Obama. Jeebus H Christ on a Stick.

12. marisacat - 10 April 2008

they’ll get rid of her yet. Or hundreds of the others. People just cave, so fucking stupid.

13. marisacat - 10 April 2008

600 + American flights to be canceled tomorrow.

14. diane - 10 April 2008

goodnight ladies and sweet dreams ……..

15. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

I see Winograd also posted her original purge diary at dkos where she was met with torches and pitchforks. kid oakland had to weigh in, of course, to mention how special he is for not thinking he could be a delegate. Note the point finger.

I’m frustrated Marcy (16+ / 0-)

because your chosen vehicle, like Brian’s, was to “go big” with an outraged diary making big claims.

(Why do progressive bloggers so often do this? ie. Write diaries making big outraged claims without letting facts and some perspective enter the mix? I don’t know. Running to post a blog post as a first course of action is something that bugs me. It makes us bloggers look bad.)

IOW, shame on you!!

What makes you look bad, ko, is your constant Dem party butt-kissing.

16. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

*pointy finger

17. wu ming - 11 April 2008

IIRC, frontier was a low-budget airline in the west, sort of like america west, or horizon air (which is part of alaska, but a separate name for whatever reason).

i just hope they can keep some planes in the air long enough for me to get the hell out of the country this fall. i suspect the long haul transoceanic flights might hang on a bit longer than the short budget ones, because the only competition is stowing away on container shipping boats.

18. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Well Marcy is a fool for falling back in line, but Plouffe caved. So, she and the others were RIGHT.

19. marisacat - 11 April 2008

wu ming

well they have said the low cost commuter flights were hardest hit. Makes sense.

20. melvin - 11 April 2008

Frontier started out as a Denver airline and basically went from everywhere to Denver – hey, it beats Salt Lake.

I flew Frontier Seattle to Denver once, but in an altered state, so don’t remember too much about it.

21. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Washington lobbying sets record in 2007

WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Corporations, unions and other interests spent a record-setting $2.79 billion in 2007 on lobbying Washington officials for favorable policies, said a study from a watchdog group released on Thursday.

The Center for Responsive Politics said spending in 2007 eclipsed the previous record in 2006 by $200 million, with health care interests, Wall Street, the real estate industry and insurers among the biggest spenders.

Can someone please explain to me how Obama actually plans to end their influence? (The non-fairy tale version?)

22. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008
23. Victor Laszlo - 11 April 2008

File this in Things We Already Knew But It’s Nice To Have Confirmation Anyway:

AP: Cheney Approved Harsh Interrogations
WASHINGTON, April 11, 2008(CBS/AP) Bush administration officials from Vice President Dick Cheney on down signed off on using harsh interrogation techniques against suspected terrorists after asking the Justice Department to endorse their legality, The Associated Press has learned.

The officials also took care to insulate President Bush from a series of meetings where CIA interrogation methods, including waterboarding, which simulates drowning, were discussed and ultimately approved.

A former senior U.S. intelligence official familiar with the meetings described them Thursday to the AP to confirm details first reported by ABC News on Wednesday. The intelligence official spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to publicly discuss the issue.

Between 2002 and 2003, the Justice Department issued several memos from its Office of Legal Counsel that justified using the interrogation tactics, including ones that critics call torture.

“If you looked at the timing of the meetings and the memos you’d see a correlation,” the former intelligence official said. Those who attended the dozens of meetings agreed that “there’d need to be a legal opinion on the legality of these tactics” before using them on al Qaeda detainees, the former official said.

The meetings were held in the White House Situation Room in the years immediately following the Sept. 11 attacks in 2001. Attending the sessions were then-Bush aides Attorney General John Ashcroft, Secretary of State Colin Powell, CIA Director George Tenet and national security adviser Condoleezza Rice.

CBS News link

The ACLU is demanding Congress investigate.

Bwahahahahahahaha yeah right.

24. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Screw this useless congress. They wouldn’t do their jobs even if someone was being tortured right in front of them. Send them all to The Hague.

25. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Ben Smith at Politico has a round up piece on the delegate purge in CA… I don’t think he has caught up to the Plouffe letter, however………….

26. melvin - 11 April 2008

22 — (Mandela is still of the US terrorist watch list? WTF?)

You don’t come off these lists.

The Committee in Solidarity with the People of El Salvador (CISPES), illegally targeted in the 1980’s by the largest FBI Internal Security investigation of the Reagan era, has in recent months again received threatening communications from the U.S. Department of Justice. Citing the Foreign Agents Registration Act of 1938, a letter sent to CISPES in January questions the organization’s relationship with the leftist Salvadoran political party known as the Farabundo Marti Front for National Liberation, or FMLN. CISPES received similar inquiries in the 1980s which eventually led to an illegal FBI investigation into its activities.

The letter cites the organization’s website and an article published in the Washington Post – which does not mention CISPES – following the December 2007 visit of the FMLN’s presidential candidate Mauricio Funes. It states that, “it has come to our attention… that the FMLN, and/or possibly its candidate for El Salvador’s 2009 presidential election, Mauricio Funes, hired your organization for the purposes of conducting a public relations media campaign to include political fundraising…” The Department of Justice gave no other evidence to back up the claim.

27. marisacat - 11 April 2008

hmm i have not been to Koswhacklandia… so I don’t know the reaction… but isn’t Schweitzer one of the Kos beloveds (or was)? Apparently, tho, Obama is not a Schweitzer beloved….

or something?

28. marisacat - 11 April 2008

I burst out laughing at this one. FP advisor or bag boy?

Obama policy advisers also meet with bundlers and other top givers. Anthony Lake, who served as President Bill Clinton’s national security adviser, has met with so many Obama contributors that, in an unusual move, the campaign credits him for funds raised when he conducts the meetings.

He’s on the top bundler list.

“This is the first time I’ve ever gotten involved in this kind of work in a campaign,” Lake said.

29. marisacat - 11 April 2008

… and you know these people are laughing at the Holy Rollers in the rallies. If they even think of them.

Good lord.

30. marisacat - 11 April 2008

whoops! No Morning news says Frontier will keep flying.

Oh those plucky little start ups!

31. marisacat - 11 April 2008

hahahahah… somebody is chewing their fingernails…

A Marist poll finds that in New York State, a McCain/Rice ticket would edge out either a Clinton/Obama or Obama/Clinton ticket.

32. JJB - 11 April 2008

It appears that someone has launched an attack against the icasualties.org website. They currently have the following message posted on their FP:

Due to a malicious attack on our web server we have removed most of the content from this site. The attack caused users to be redirected to random sites that have no affiliation with iCasualties. After a good deal of effort we think that we have identified [the] problem and hope that we will soon return the site back to it’s proper state. Please accept our sincerest apologies for any inconvenience this has caused you.

With the number of fatalities for US troops having increased dramatically the last few days, I found myself wondering if something like this was happening. I’d had a lot of trouble logging onto it myself.

33. marisacat - 11 April 2008

I think TNH last evening, said 18 so far this week… KIA in Iraq….

34. JJB - 11 April 2008

According to icasualties, it’s 20.

Truthfully, I’m surprised this sort of thing hasn’t happened much more often to them.

35. JJB - 11 April 2008

Some really good commentary from Juan Cole today:

War turns Republics into dictatorships. The logic is actually quite simple. The Constitution says that the Congress is responsible for declaring war. But in 2002 Congress turned that responsibility over to Bush, gutting the constitution and allowing the American Right to start referring to him not as president but as ‘commander in chief’ (that is a function of the civilian presidency, not a title.)

Now Bush has now turned over the decision-making about the course of the Iraq War to Gen. David Petraeus.

So Congress abdicated to Bush. Bush has abdicated to the generals in the field.

That is not a Republic. That is a military dictatorship achieved not by coup but by moral laziness.

Ironically, what officers like Petraeus need from Bush is not deference but vigorous leadership in the political realm. Bush needs to intervene to work for political reconciliation in Iraq if Petraeus’s military achievements are to bear fruit. But Bush seems incapable of actually conducting policy, as opposed to starting wars. Bush happened to Iraq just as he happened to New Orleans. He cannot do the hard work of patiently addressing disasters and ameliorating them. He just wants to set people to fighting. Crush the Sadr Movement, perhaps the most popular political movement in Iraq? He’s all for it. Risk provoking a wider conflagration in the Middle East by worsening relations with Iran? Sounds like a great idea to him. Bush campaigned on being a ‘uniter not a divider’ in 2000. In fact, he is the ultimate Divider, and leaves burning buildings, millions of refugees, and hundreds of thousands of cadavers in his wake. He is not Iraq’s Brownie. He is Iraq’s Katrina itself.

Just as New Orleans’s Ninth War will still be a moonscape when Bush goes out of office, so will Iraq.

36. marisacat - 11 April 2008

yes it was clear in New Orleans (and the Gulf coast) that the military was in charge.

Post coup. Post collapse (collapse is the Demcrats).

37. Arcturus - 11 April 2008
38. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Enterprising little rightie chipmunk… with a camera on so called “billionaires row” when Obama came to the big fundraiser (one of three that day) at the Getty house, SF, April 6

39. marisacat - 11 April 2008

37

Arcturus, thanks for that… thru AA I picked up yesterday on the big piece in the LAT. Seems that Rashid Khalidi is now saying that Obama never had sympathies for the Palestinians. And various people are pointing fingers at Ali Abunimah, whom I have read several times in E Intiifada, he lived in Obama’s district in the 90s…. saying he is unreliable.

All fo this to please Israel. We are so skrewed

40. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

27. re: the Schweitzer story

I see some commenters are saying this isn’t “news”. They do the same thing at Politico whenever anything critical of Obama is posted. They’re as determined to not see the complete truth as Bush’s fundies – a truly disturbing phenomenon. If they can’t stand criticism of Obama, how the hell would are they going to last during a 4 year presidency without daily head explosions? They’ve become their own narrow-minded religion.

41. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

So Congress abdicated to Bush. Bush has abdicated to the generals in the field.

I don’t know about that. Look at the retired generals who are now speaking out. When they’re active, they’re required to keep their mouths shut. Bush has abdicated to the civilian neocons, afaic. Who knows what Petraeus really thinks about the policies? He’s said repeatedly that policy-setting is not his job. (Not that I respect his position. If he had any cajones, he’d tell the truth.)

42. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

38. That was entertaining. :)

43. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008
44. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

I caught a bit of the news conference about the marine being busted in Mexico who’s charged with the murder of a female marine in the states. The DA (I think it was) decided to make a political statement saying that because (teh evil librul) Jimmy Carter had signed an extradition treaty with Mexico way back when ensuring the death penalty was off the table, the state couldn’t pursue it. That was crass. As if everybody and their dog doesn’t know that.

45. marisacat - 11 April 2008

LOL

Yesterday BA said they would do so much better than SF… it was kind of silly really. As soon as it got there, instead of a photo op for the Flambe, it was hustled off to a “undisclosed location”. Sounds like Cheney….

What a riot!

46. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Sounds like Cheney….

lol :)

They tried out a new technique there:

At least three water balloons were thrown at the flame at it passed the presidential palace, but guards batted them away.

47. Arcturus - 11 April 2008

Dan Bacher:

The Pacific Fishery Management Council (PFMC) at its meeting in Seattle on Thursday, April 10, voted to close recreational and commercial salmon fishing off the coast of California and most of Oregon this year.

The only exception to the closure will be a selective recreational fishery for coho salmon in Oregon, according to Dan Wolford, PFMC member and Coastside Fishing Club science director. The fishery closure will extend from Cape Falcon in northern Oregon to the US-Mexico border.

This complete closure of fishing for chinook salmon will be the first since commercial fishing began in California in 1848. The decision was made because of the “unprecedented collapse” of Central Valley salmon stocks. The Sacramento River fall chinook population, until recently the most robust West Coast salmon run, was the driver of West Coast salmon fisheries.

As recently as 2002, 775,000 adults returned to spawn. This year, even with all ocean salmon fishing closures, the return of fall run chinook to the Sacramento is projected to be only 54,000 fish.

48. Arcturus - 11 April 2008

UC Davis fish biologist Peter Moyle:

Indy Bay link

Ever since EuroAmericans arrived in the Central Valley, Chinook salmon populations have been in decline. Historic populations probably averaged 1.5-2.0 million (or more) adult fish per year. The high populations resulted from four distinct runs of Chinook salmon (fall, late-fall, winter, and spring runs) . . .

Unregulated fisheries, hydraulic mining, logging, levees, dams, and other factors caused precipitous population declines in the 19th century, to the point where the salmon canneries were forced to shut down (all were gone by 1919). Minimal regulation of fisheries and the end of hydraulic mining allowed some recovery to occur in the early 20th century but the numbers of harvest salmon steadily declined through the 1930s. There was a brief resurgence in the 1940s but then the effects of the large rim dams on major tributaries began to be severely felt. The dams cut off access to 70% or more of historic spawning areas and basically drove the spring and winter runs to near-extinction. In the late 20th century, thanks to hatcheries, special flow releases from dams, and other improvements, salmon numbers (mainly fall-run Chinook) averaged nearly 500,000 fish per year, with wide fluctuations from year to year, but only about 10-25% of historic abundance. In 2006, numbers of spawners dropped to about 200,000, despite closure of the fishery. In 2007, the number of spawners fell further to about 90,000 fish, among the lowest numbers experienced in the past 60 years, with expectations of even lower numbers in fall 2008 (probably <64,000 fish). The evidence suggests that these runs are largely supported by hatchery production, so numbers of fish from natural spawning are much lower.

. . . blaming “ocean conditions” for salmon declines is a lot like blaming the iceberg for sinking the Titanic, while ignoring the many human errors that put the ship on course for the fatal collision. Managers have optimistically thought that salmon populations were unsinkable, needing only occasional course corrections such as hatcheries or removal of small dams, to continue to go forward. The listings as endangered species of the winter and spring runs of Central Valley Chinook were warnings of approaching disaster on an even larger scale. “Ocean conditions” may be the potential icebergs for salmon populations but the ship is being steered by us humans. Salmon populations can be managed avoid an irreversible crash, but continuing on our present course could result in loss of a valuable and iconic fishery.

uggh, sorry ’bout the coding before – i need sleep

[think I got both, don't worry just took a few seconds... -Mcat]

49. Arcturus - 11 April 2008

shit. i quit.

50. marisacat - 11 April 2008

… not to worry…

I was delayed as there was a Safeway delivery.

51. marisacat - 11 April 2008

oh I saw a headline … SF (meaning Gavin in his peed upon Chinese dogskin slippers) was effing dumb. we are stuck for the full bill.

UNFUCKINGBELIEVABLE. Dept of State, Chinese Embassy, Consulate, Chinese heavies, pro Chinese bussed in from all over…. (fine their right) and not counting the overtime copulation… of cops… it is 600K. AND Gavin or Fong (our lady chief of cops) admit they MOVED THE PROTESTORS and not the pro Chinese… and they should have moved BOTH when conflict broke out.

And boy is the City defensive. Media is REALLY laughing… There was a city rep, not for Gavin, not for the IOC, but Officially For the Torch (lol), who said,

well just go talk to the wheelchair person in paris who got assaulted.

ABC 7 nescasters laughed out loud when they cut back… “so blame the French? But hey isn’t that too easy?!”

Oh what a fucked mess Gavin made for himself.

52. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Obama: Public finance system ‘creaky’

Whoops!

Obama noted that participation in the $3 checkoff had declined, reducing the amount of money in the fund. Obama himself, however, did not check off the $3 designation in his 2005 and 2006 tax returns.

Obama, who had checked off the box in previous returns, said it was an oversight

“It may be a situation where my accountant didn’t do it,” he said.

His campaign later said that an amended 2006 tax return did assign the $3 to public financing.

The all things to all people politician at work:

n talking to reporters, Obama also offered a discourse on abortion, noting that he has received support from anti-abortion Democrats such as former Rep. Tim Roemer of Indiana and Sen. Bob Casey of Pennsylvania.

“It may be that those who have opposed abortion get a sense that I’m listening to them and respect their position even though where we finally come down may be different,” he said.

“The mistake that pro-choice forces have sometimes made in the past, and this is a generalization so it has not always been the case, has been to not acknowledge the wrenching moral issues involved in it,” he said.

“Most Americans recognize that what we want to do is avoid, or help people avoid, having to make this difficult choice. That nobody is pro-abortion, abortion is never a good thing.”

It seems he couldn’t take a firm stand if his life depended on it. Tell me again why he’s some sort of “new” politician.

53. melvin - 11 April 2008

47, 48 — Anadromous fish are in the same position as migratory birds. They rely not on one habitat, like an animal that lives in a limited area, but on several. A critical breakdown in any one spells trouble. In all at once and populations are certain to crash.

Certainly ocean conditions contribute to the problem. (One never mentioned is increasing clarity in the Pacific. Not good news if you are six inches long.) But it’s just standard denialist strategy to always find some possible contributory cause and say aha that must be it! and ignore everything else, including fifty years of research on salmon.

54. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

_Obama acknowledged that besides an unusually large number of small donors, he also has relied on well-connected fundraisers with corporate interests. But he said his financial operation is separate from his policy positions.

“We have a national finance committee, they are very active but they don’t interact with me,” he said. “They are not as a general rule part of my day-to-day policy or advisory committee. Although there are some people who have raised money for me who are also prominent business leaders, so if we were putting forward an economic plan and there was some expertise there we would tap into it.”

55. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

My head – it spins.

56. marisacat - 11 April 2008

snagged this via Ben Smith…. already almost 500 comments. I was just htinking this am that Obama was due for a whopper.

You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing’s replaced them…And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not.

And it’s not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.

WHOPPER I fully admit I would beg for a so called Spy in the House of Politics, to play on an old title… someoen to record when they feel all comfy in a wealthy house, people asking how goes it on the trail with the plebes and Holy Rollers..

I love the comment about clinging to religion. Pastor wright? Pastor Wright? Meeks? Pfleger? All the other jive artists.

Oh bust all their chops. Bill Hillary, Barack Michelle, John and that whack job Cindy.

Becasue we know they all do it.

57. marisacat - 11 April 2008

The Ben Smith link….

58. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

56. Not only that, there’s a lot of discussion about his decision not to hand out street money in PA. How about helping out some of those poor folks who are campaigning for you, Obama, instead of hanging out with billionaires?

59. marisacat - 11 April 2008

hmmm I read the full Mayhill Fowler piece at HuffWuffPo… and it si very thoughtful.

The Obama-ites at Politico are very dismissive of her “hit pieces”. But I would not call it that.

60. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

59. I just finished reading it too. Like I said before, I don’t think I can stand 4 years of Obama as president if his supporters are going to whine and cry over every bit of criticism launched his way. I may have to take up crocheting full-time.

What exactly is his plan for helping out all of those gun-toting, immigrant-hating, religious people in small town PA? Or anywhere else for that matter? I’d be pissed if I was in that situation and someone stereotyped me in that way. I guess that would just make me a “typical white person” though.

61. marisacat - 11 April 2008

What the Obama-mites don’t get (Ben Smith comments well over 1000 now) is that he did a soft shoe dance, followed by a tap dance for the wealthier elites and USED people whose votes he is currently asking for…. However the show for them is different from what he performs at the Getty manse… (see link at 38, I put it up as a laugh, but it sure fits in now)

The very segment he does badly with, from poorer whites, to Catholics, to rural and so on.

McCain/aides have it in hand. The coup de grace, in San Francisco! All you can do is laugh.

LOL Obama just will not out his inner Evital… ;)

What a hoot. Popcorn futures.

62. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Bizarre kossack behaviour (or maybe not, considering…). Post a diary asking for impeachment over torture and make it a mojo fest at the same time. I can’t quite wrap my head around that one.

63. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008
64. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

This, from that WaPo article, contradicts what Obama said in another article I linked to above (54) where he said the bundlers don’t have access to him:

Obama’s bundlers help make up a more loosely defined “national finance committee,” whose members are made to feel part of the campaign’s inner workings through weekly conference calls and quarterly meetings at which they quiz the candidate or his strategists. At one meeting, bundlers urged the campaign to link Iraq war costs with the faltering economy. And they got an advance copy of Obama’s Philadelphia speech in which he addressed the incendiary remarks of his longtime pastor.

65. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

I forgot this quote from WaPo: “Obama policy advisers also meet with bundlers and other top givers.”

66. marisacat - 11 April 2008

LOL of course they have access.

What bullshit.

67. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

That WaPo article went to great lengths (or at least his money people did) to claim that those big money types expect nothing in return. Right. And I’m the queen of England.

68. marisacat - 11 April 2008

The News Hour is doing a lovely segment on Van Cliburn… an interview with him in his house outside of FW, TX….

Politics is all bound up in everything but it is good to remember that some things DO transcend.

69. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Compassion forum or Desperate Housewives? I’m conflicted. ;)

70. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Ben Smith links to HuffWuffPo with audio from SF fundraiser…

he says it is not that great, best with headphones. gah.

71. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Maybe sew his mouth shut.

“Mrs. Clinton’s opponent in the race for the Democratic presidential nomination, Senator Barack Obama, said in an interview that the welfare overhaul had been greatly beneficial in eliminating a divisive force in American politics.”

I suspect this is calculated. I very much doubt he wants poor votes, no matter the color. And rememeber, they are all poor now:

“Before welfare reform, you had, in the minds of most Americans, a stark separation between the deserving working poor and the undeserving welfare poor,” Mr. Obama said in an interview. “What welfare reform did was desegregate those two groups. Now, everybody was poor, and everybody had to work.”

“desegregate”… hmmm mmm.

72. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

71. And “Now, everybody was poor” is a Good Thing? Or even true? People who receive aid are still seen as “undeserving”. Maybe I’m missing something, but wtf is he talking about?

73. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Obama seems to be on a downhill roll with these mistakes this week which, I’ve believed all along, would be what we’d see in his presidency if elected. He’s not Jeebus, folks. He’s a politician.

74. marisacat - 11 April 2008

To be honest I am unsure what he is saying. I followed the TruthOut link at SMBIVA, it is the reprint of that NYT look back at Welfare Reform in the light of the economic downturn (not the first since it was enacted)… with guotes from Hillpac, ObamaRama and the Wright-Edelmans….

I don’t know, I think he is just blithering out the words, in some vague hang togehter.

The Righties are circulating YouTubes of Denzel Washington playing Malcolm X, and it ain’t pretty. Sell me the movie, let me buy a ticket, it would be easier than this run. To be blunt.

I just don’t know. The three of them, ObamaMan, Hillpac and the old crazy white guy are a good snapshot of USA! USA! today.

75. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

KO just called Obama’s comments “pretty heady intellectual stuff”. Mon dieu. If that’s what passes for that characterization, America has been dumbed-down to the point of being unrecognizable.

76. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

I think what KO was really trying to say was (ironically adding more insult to injury) that if you don’t get what Obama meant, you’re stupid.

77. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

What exactly is his plan for helping out all of those gun-toting, immigrant-hating, religious people in small town PA?

Who cares? Fuck ‘em. If there is one group of people that I am completely out of compassion for, it’s moron white people who’ve suckled on gov’t subsidies for years, voted against their own interests for years, voted for the destruction of public education FOR years, clung to racism and homophobia and misogyny … FOR YEARS … fuck ‘em.

78. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Bubba needs to go on a long vacation.

79. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

77. Now, now. They’re “Obamacans” – or at least they were until today.

80. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

Now, everybody was poor, and everybody had to work.”

Yup, you fucking house Negro, keep pushing Reagan’s “Welfare Queen” meme. In my experience the poor were mostly working already, for little pay and less respect, and all Clinton did was take away the last line of support if something went wrong or they needed a little help.

Fuck Obama, fuck the donks.

Sorry, cranky tonight.

81. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Someone needs to ask Obama if he clings to his religion because he’s bitter.

82. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

80. Maybe he’ll bring back government cheese. That would get those Wisconsin “welfare queens” working again.

83. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Well for every Haseldine PA with a nasty white ethnic Barletta as mayor… there is a Dover PA where people fought back agasint creationism. And a R appointed judge helped publicise the battle. In order to win, after the court facts, agaisnt ID – if possible.

Locales will save themselves. Or not. But the Federal Government is in the way.

84. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

heh:

Bill O’Reilly is set to receive a local Emmy award in Boston next month. But he won’t, if a former fellow tabloid talker gets his way. According to the Boston Herald, Barry Nolan says O’Reilly is “a mental case,” and doesn’t deserve the award.

Having once worked in Boston, O’Reilly is being honored for taking his contributions to the national stage, first as anchor of Inside Edition (?!?!?!) and later on Fox News.

“I am appalled, just appalled,” Nolan, now with CN8, told the paper. “He inflates and constantly mangles the truth…and his frequent target is the ‘left-leaning’ media — the ones who do report the news fairly. And those are the same people who will be sitting in the room honoring him.” Oh, really?

Despite the protestations, local Emmy chief Tim Egan says O’Reilly will be honored. “You may not agree with him, but you can’t say he hasn’t increased the political conversation in this country with his style of broadcasting,” says Egan.

And it gets better. Nolan claims he will still attend the May 10 ceremony and, since his wife is out of town, he’s invited Keith Olbermann, as his date.

85. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

I know there are good people in small towns, but I’m sick of hearing that people in places like that are the “heartland” and “real Americans” and “hard working” (which carries with it the assumption that other people aren’t). I’m tired of how their tender sensibilities are some tripwire not to be touched, but it’s okay to a attack single mothers or urbanites or the working poor in cities or college students or pick your other acceptable punching bags.

I am from people like that, and “bitter” and “clinging to religion” and “hating people who are different” and immigrants is pretty fucking descriptive.

86. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008
87. marisacat - 11 April 2008

well the problem is that more and more the off hand pejoratives from ObamaMan seem to describe him. He is conflicted beyond belief. And a juveile in his searches for his own meaning..

Don’t fucking run for the presidency… he and his wife don’t much like anyone, as best I can determine watching him for 4 + years and her for over a year, that is not like themselves. And she oozes bitterness. he oozes disdain. Wight is retiring to a 1.6 million dollr house with a hinkey land deal and letter of credit all mixed up between a bank and the church. In a gated communiyt. What bullshitters.

All of them. They cannot lecture to anyone, afaiac.

There is no unity… and they – and the fucking religious entourage Obama nd Michelle draag like baby blankets behind them… presume to rule us. As I say, they want to become Bill and Hill.

We are so blessed. They too can retire to a Presdiential Library in South Side Chicago dubbed the Double Wide.

88. bayprairie - 11 April 2008

Senator Barack Obama, said in an interview that the welfare overhaul had been greatly beneficial in eliminating a divisive force in American politics.”

what a barbershop asshole that dude is.

from a comment by kactus in the thread to this post (also by kactus)

Monday Afternoon at the Welfare Office

…Ever since our friend Bill Clinton signed the Welfare Reform Act in 1996, things have gotten worse for poor families but the non-profits have gotten incredibly rich. Here in Milwaukee we have privatized welfare, with huge corporations like Maximus and co-called non-profits like YWCA and Goodwill (which has since lost its W2 contract because of fraud) raking in the money while dropping women off cash assistance as fast as possible. And what’s even more ridiculous is that the statewide cost of W2 is so much larger than AFDC was. For example, in 1995 it cost $314.8 million to serve 214,400 clients. In 1999, three years after welfare reform, Wisconsin spent $589 million for only 40,000 clients. Where’d the money go? I can assure you that almost none of it went to the poor clients it was supposed to be helping, unless you call sending moms out on “job searches” and making them do free forced labor in exchange for their cash grants counts.

I really could go on and on about how welfare reform has been a boon for non-profits and poverty pimps and nothing but disaster for poor moms. How few of us are making family supporting wages after being forced off. How nobody gets to aim for higher education anymore because work comes first, even if it’s work at McDonald’s. How poor moms never see their kids anymore because they’re always in daycare and the moms are always at work or looking for work. I could talk about moms getting evicted because of getting a full-family sanction (that’s when your caseworker decides you haven’t been compliant enough and cuts off 100% of your cash grant) and doubling up 2 or 3 or more families to a house. Families where grandparents are raising the kids because the moms are working, and working, and working, and getting absolutely nowhere….

89. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

85. I’m with you on that to a point. His mistake was in stereotyping people with attacks that play to the Repubs’ strengths. He’s going to lose votes which, afaic, is fine with me. But it was a stupid political mistake. You don’t go to a cloistered meeting with billionaires and dis the poor saying the only reason they “cling” to religion and guns is because they don’t have jobs and are bitter. I highly doubt that’s how those people he was talking about see it.

Mcat also noted to me that he included “anti-trade” in those remarks. Isn’t he supposed to be “anti-trade” (NAFTA), as well? Or is that just talk for the regular folks while he winks and nods at the people for whom NAFTA’s actually brought benefits – the rich?

90. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

speaking of the end of welfare, Moyers is doing a piece on the strain that food pantries are facing.

91. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

88.

Senator Barack Obama, said in an interview that the welfare overhaul had been greatly beneficial in eliminating a divisive force in American politics.”

And that’s definitely a problematic, red flag kind of statement since he’s running on ending divisiveness. If he thinks so-called welfare reform was a good way to do that, what else might he cave on?

Good post on waiting at the welfare office. I lived through that too as a young single parent and it’s no bloody picnic. It’s dehumanizing.

92. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Thanks for the heads up on Moyers…

The food pantries here have been in trouble [here anyway] for a couple of years.. and now it has gone critical.

A smart local news crew walked thru some supermarket warehouse a few weeks ago, just walking by the staples, everything had gone up between 5 and 15 %.

But you know it was noted years ago out here, that with masses of cash roiling the state, the new industries and the new moguls and billionaires were not much interested in charity. Not a Carnegie or a Packard among them…

Like those nice people at the Getty manse.

93. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

it’s an interesting lineup … he starts w/ food pantries, then goes to a gov’t farm subsidies program which wastes money on wealthy landowners who may not even farm (the segment on Texans who cashed in on the Shuttle disaster under that program is amazing), then closes with an interview w/ David Beckman from Bread for the World.

94. melvin - 11 April 2008

Baying Fox News mob yuks it up over pregnant trans man, calls for his suicide. This crowd, concerned as always about the unborn, refers to the coming child as “the little Ewok she’s gonna crap out.”

95. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

94. Neanderthals.

96. diane - 11 April 2008

59

I would agree for the most part Marisa, but I did take exception to this (near the end of her post) perhaps she’s very young:

California is the, most racially tolerant and ethnicity-tolerant state in the Union.

Well hmmmm, no in fact California isn’t that… although, historically California has been far more subtle at its racism; and, quite creatively, economically abusive (versus tolerant) of its ‘ethnics.’

I would expound further but frankly, I’ve worn myself out silently debating the ridiculousness of the claim.

I will say though, I’ve heard things out of the mouths of born and raised Californians that would make the least politically correct folks outraged at the apparent cruelty, total self absorption, and ignorance of United States history.

97. Miss Devore - 11 April 2008

can’t believe that people who have chided BHO for his referencing religion in his life, freak out when he expresses a nuanced view–that in some circumstances the religious impulse embraces isolationism or a flight from substantive participation.

most Americans are sick of the way everything is going. You think they want McCain to continue surge/pause? You think they want to go through the First Laddy’s scorecard of undermining his wife?

Yes, BHO is a politician. A damn good one. Better than Howard Dean, which is where a lot of us hoped previously.

Raw story had a little bit about Mark Penn lunching with Karen Hughes today. Sure it was about keeping the dynastic siccessions intact.

98. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

most Americans are sick of the way everything is going.

And Obama will only put a fresh scent on the same old shit.

99. Miss Devore - 11 April 2008

98. I disagree. I think he is a nudge in the right direction. I don’t think I’m infallible, but I don’t think you are, either.

Off to read mearsheimer & walt..

100. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

And Obama will only put a fresh scent on the same old shit.

I saw a cliche in a comment today that I’ve never heard before: “You can’t stick the shit back into the horse” (or something close to that). Maybe it’s because I’ve become delusional from all of this political minutiae but, for a moment, I found that funny.

96. When I read that, I thought of Rodney King. There’s still a long way to go.

101. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

Feisty Obama adds gays to the mix. Obamacans’ heads explode.

102. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

I also (really) don’t understand the connection he made between rural PA folks not having jobs but turning to guns as some sort of catharsis – unless he’s talking about militia types.(?)

103. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

the only way to get a new direction is to break the duopoly of the current, corrupt political parties. Obama will only ratify center-right idiocy that the donks have been selling for nearly 20 years now. How can he even remotely claim to be pushing “change” when he keeps praising that monster Reagan?

If you’re sick of it, vote third party, or withhold your vote from the top of the ticket. Quit buying into their fearmonger of the so-called “other side”.

104. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008
105. diane - 11 April 2008

100

True, but that’s one of the more blatant instances of racism in Cali.

Cali’s prisons are loaded with Arian Brotherhood, the dog that so viciously ripped apart Diane Whipple, in San Francisco, was in fact owned by an Aryan Brotherhood member adopted (as an adult) by two not unsuccesful attorneys in San Francisco who were keeping his dog for him.

106. diane - 11 April 2008

105

I should have expounded on that one, the chosen clientele of those two (married) attorneys, were specifically Aryan Brotherhood.

107. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Diane

oh I would never call California racially tolerant. It is a cauldron, and in places it does work… but that is it. Mayhill is 60 or more, in fact there are comments around that “she knows nothing as she is 60″ – and I don’t know where she lives, where her home base is….

BTW, I am a couple of blocks from where Diane WHipple lived… I followed that case in the legal press here in CA. What a fucking mess.

108. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

Bill Maher: “That’s what the Catholic Church is, the Bear Stearns of organized pedophila”.

Tonight’s New Rules finished with a bit about how the compound in TX isn’t that different from the Catholic Church.

109. diane - 11 April 2008

107

Never thought you even implied it Marisa (I would never call California racially tolerant) and yes, what a mess, sordid would be putting it too kindly…

110. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

What really went on with the BAE fraud case? Now Gordon Brown wants the investigation dropped as well. Just what lengths will they go to to protect the Saudis?

111. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

Just what lengths will they go to to protect the Saudis?

More likely to protect their own investments, their own personal foibles (the Saudis have deep pockets … who knows what they know about Blair/Brown et al?).

112. marisacat - 11 April 2008

I was just disagreeing with Mayhill’s particular line, that was all. When I called it “thoughtful” I was thinking of the overall tone of the piece (and she has a subsequent piece up as well). AND how the Obamamites howled.

LOL…. In a way the whole thing is pretty entertaining… he could nto keep buttoned up what he really thinks of people. The glaring lack of outreach to certain groups is … well glaring.

I know people were so shcoked shocked that he did nto win CA… but he made no outreach to Hispanics, some, a little, late. Sent his local Chicago outreach, Gutierrez, a state senator too iirc, out here, after he complained publicly in the press (twice, that I caught) that Obama CA outreach was lacking.

We have a 6% black electorate (which came out in a smaller proportion than in 04,, btw) but we have a Latino electorate at close to 36%… LOL…

113. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

re. Bill Moyers show about food banks (which I’m watching). One of the former ministers in charge of dealing with the poor here in Alberta was asked what he knew about food banks a few years ago. His response? He’d driven by one a few times.

And our former assholish, drunk Conservative premier Ralph Klein decided to stop by a homeless shelter one nite to reem out the clients. If that had been my shelter, he’d have gotten an earful.

114. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

111. Well, something big definitely smells there. Hopefully, there’s enough pressure against Brown and the Tories who have sided with him to either change that decision or bring him down.

115. Madman in the Marketplace - 11 April 2008

I’m just so baffled by people. Especially by people with MORE.

Just to give some perspective. I’m a loner. I don’t really like very many people. They depress and disgust me most of the time. The social games and lies and all the rest exhaust me. I don’t like people.

Still, all of that being said, people are capable of such beauty, such kindness, such creativity. Just the music and art produced by the human race alone has brought such joy and enlightment to my life.

So why are people capable of so much that is good and beautiful so fucking horrible?

Why don’t people who claim to LIKE other people, all of the good, religious, “decent” people leave more space for compassion? Why don’t all the people in political parties and civic organizations and churches and all of the rest manage to find a way to actually inject some care and openness for other people into western (or any, to be honest) society?

We let people, CHILDREN, suffer and die for want of food and healthcare and shelter in this country, this “good” country, built around the “heartland”, source of truth, justice and the American Way.

I don’t get it (and from catnip’s comment 113 apparently we’re not alone in this criminality in the western hemisphere).

116. diane - 11 April 2008

I think people, particularly native Californians, tend to think that California has a far higher black population than it actually has, especially compared with the south and states west of the Mississippi, for one of a multitude of reasons why his results in Cali may not match their expectations…

117. Heather-Rose Ryan - 11 April 2008

About Obama: well, it shouldn’t be a surprise to people (unless they were snoozing through their history classes) that economic misery aggravates existing fears/resentments and triggers the search for scapegoats.

About the Olympic Flame: the Olympics is a wretched fraud, a completely corrupt boondoggle. And the TV “spectacle” isn’t even entertaining anymore. I refuse to countenance any of it. Boooooooooring.

118. diane - 11 April 2008

113

In PA, those pulling all the strings apparently know much about their Food Banks – a person has to inexplicably give their Social Security number when receiving food from a charitable organization.

Don’t have a clue which is worse……..

119. diane - 11 April 2008

oops, comment 116 was in response to comment 112, sorry.

120. Heather-Rose Ryan - 11 April 2008

115, Madman: they do, actually. If you go around your community looking for people who are helping and providing goodness, you’ll find them. You might even find a way to assist them.

The problem is that they don’t tend to make the news. The news is devoted entirely to the bad and the shocking. The more vile, the better. If it bleeds, it leads. And when a rotten tidbit is particularly tasty, we have to chew it over for years. For example, catnip’s story about the drunk former premier is seven years old.

We all have to choose what to focus on.

121. marisacat - 11 April 2008

that economic misery aggravates existing fears/resentments and triggers the search for scapegoats.

yes well hardly nooz. Breaking broken or otherwise. But that was not my issue with his little performance for a select group here in the City..

122. marisacat - 11 April 2008

well the last line of the NYT article, the Truthout version linked above in the comment i posted with his quotes on welfare “reform”, it states that there are 1.2 million more children in poverty now than just a few years ago. And of course this is the second, worse and longer I suspect, economic downturn since “reform”.

But plenty of hard hearted political currying faavor comments from the likes of ObamaMan and Hillpac and others.

I really laughed at his pulled from the ass comments. ‘desegregated’ and complicated explanations of ‘division’. Making hay off the poor.

Such bullshit.

123. marisacat - 11 April 2008

well i can chew over shit Reagan excreted. And i often do. And he is dead. But sadly not gone. whether I speak of him or not.

124. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

For example, catnip’s story about the drunk former premier is seven years old.

That exemplified Klein’s behaviour towards the poor for the entire time he was premier. We’ve had 4 decades of that type of Conservative rule here with poor and so-called “lesser” people being thrown off the bus. There are much more recent examples from the party but that one says it all.

125. marisacat - 11 April 2008

LOL

from a late post at Ben Smith, apparently Obama also delivered a parallel diagnosis of the bitterness of the inner city.

126. diane - 11 April 2008

trying to bite my tongue and analyze some comments I’ve read.

I must say, some things do actually need to be repeated, for years, if that’s what it takes…..

127. diane - 11 April 2008

Re my comment 126:

To put it another way, Heather Rose Ryan, the future is built upon the past. If folks don’t understand what fucked up the past, they need to understand, no matter how boring it may sound to some who may be beyond all that.

They can’t build a better future until they do.

128. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

We all have to choose what to focus on.

And I choose to focus on the poor at times because I’m one of them.

129. liberalcatnip - 11 April 2008

So much for the “success” of the so-called surge: 289 killed, 1448 injured in two weeks in Sadr City – medic

130. diane - 11 April 2008

goodnight all, sweet dreams…

cheesecake with blueberries and funnelcakes, lightly powdered with confectioner’s sugar for breakfast!

YUM!

131. Victor Laszlo - 11 April 2008

Madman at #115: A misanthrope is a disappointed idealist. At least that’s the source of my antipathy for most of my kind. People, in crowds, have this disturbing sheeplike tendency. People want a Big Daddy Savior, at least most of them do, and it’s just appalling.

Miss Devore at #99 wrote: I think he is a nudge in the right direction.

What a stirring campaign slogan:

Vote O’Bama in 2008! Nudge America in the right direction!

I would prefer a nudge in the LEFT direction, but oh well…..

Henceforth, I shall call O’Bama The Nudge. McCain can be The Grudge and Hillary can be The Drudge. Collectively, they are the Three Stooges.

Sorry, Miss Devore, I don’t mean to pile on, but I simply can’t stomach the notion that O’Bama represents anything other than Business As Usual.

132. marisacat - 11 April 2008

nuuuuuuuuu thred………………

LINK

8)

133. marisacat - 11 April 2008

Henceforth, I shall call O’Bama The Nudge. McCain can be The Grudge and Hillary can be The Drudge. Collectively, they are the Three Stooges.

pretty perfect, I’d say…

134. VAGreen - 12 April 2008

103. Madman in the Marketplace – 11 April 2008
“the only way to get a new direction is to break the duopoly of the current, corrupt political parties. Obama will only ratify center-right idiocy that the donks have been selling for nearly 20 years now.”

Some good third party news: The Greens are on the ballot in Arizona. We needed to collect 20,449 valid signatures to get our candidates on the ballot through November 2009. We got 22,570.

There’s plenty of work to be done, including in my home state of Virginia, but I’m hopeful about getting on the ballot in most states.

Go Green!

http://www.gp.org
http://www.runcynthiarun.org


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