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Light and Dark 26 October 2007

Posted by marisacat in California / Pacific Coast.

     Driving down Highway 18 evacuating Lake Arrowhead.  (Submitted to YourScene – LA Times – by s_stockley)

I noticed New American Media a few months ago… we still have, on KQED our local PBS station, a pretty liberal, open local news roundup on Friday nights… Occasionally a reporter from NAM will be on.

They hve this report at their site, about the non white and hidden face of the ‘fire this time’:

Invisible Fire Victims in the Canyons

Enlace, News Report, Hiram Soto, Translated by Elena Shore, Posted: Oct 25, 2007

CARMEL VALLEY, Calif. — They were kicked out of the canyon, literally, laying their suitcases full of clothing and other items on the side of a tomato field. This was their evacuation. They stayed there for hours while they tried to figure out a plan B.

These farm workers and Mixtec peasants who have lived in the open air in the McGonigle Canyon for years are among the most destitute residents affected by the forest fires. But while some left the area, many remain in the canyons, either because they do not want to or can’t leave.

“We’ve been telling them that they are in an evacuation zone but they don’t want to move because they have all their stuff in the hills and because they’re afraid of the police and the people,” said Juan Ramon, an activist with the Indigenous Front of Binational Organizations.

Many of these immigrants have been targets of harassment and frequent protests by groups like the Minutemen, and have been evicted by the police several times. [snip]

There is some outreach but it is easy to see, the situation is more than ordinarily difficult… and close to dire.


      The Santiago Fire rages above Foothill Ranch. (Submitted to YourScene / LAT By jwlchr)

The flip side….

[A]IG’s Wildfire Protection Unit, part of its Private Client Group, is offered only to homeowners in California’s most affluent ZIP Codes — including Malibu, Beverly Hills, Newport Beach and Menlo Park — and a dozen Colorado resort communities. It covers about 2,000 policyholders, who pay premiums of at least $10,000 a year and own homes with a value of at least $1 million.

Carrier and his 15 crew mates sprayed retardant on and around more than 160 homes in Malibu, Lake Arrowhead and the hardest-hit areas of Orange and San Diego counties this week. They claim to have saved a dozen homes.

Jim Moore of Malibu, for one, was grateful for their services.

“Just picture it,” said Moore, whose house was sprayed by Firebreak early Monday. “Here you are in that raging wildfire. Smoke everywhere. Flames everywhere. Plumes of smoke coming up over the hills. Here’s a couple guys showing up in what looks like a firetruck who are experts trained in fighting wildfire and they’re there specifically to protect your home. . . . It was really, really comforting.”  [snip]

An eerie cloud of smoke above a pocket of clean air. Sierra exit on I-15 (Submitted to YourScene / LAT by kathy) 


From the previous thread, as it came up late, pulling some comments forward   A congressional House bill that has passed and is moving on to the senate…

marisacat |

when I saw this over at PFF, I thought it was a joke.

Legislating against radical idealogy – with references to homegrown violence as diversion (that is my take, they already spy on anti war Quakers… and sic the FBI/Homeland Securitat on librarians).

It’s not. Put forward by Jane Harmon, pro war, pro Israel… and 14 co sponsors.

Don’t miss the Bloooooooooooo Dogs… and the shits (Dan Lundgren is a fucking nutter). It passed the House, now goes to the Senate.

Rep. Christopher Carney [D-PA]
Del. Donna Christensen [D-VI]
Rep. Yvette Clarke [D-NY]
Rep. Charles Dent [R-PA]
Rep. Norman Dicks [D-WA]
Rep. Al Green [D-TX]
Rep. James Langevin [D-RI]
Rep. Zoe Lofgren [D-CA]
Rep. Nita Lowey [D-NY]
Rep. Daniel Lungren [R-CA]
Rep. Ed Perlmutter [D-CO]
Rep. Ted Poe [R-TX]
Rep. Dave Reichert [R-WA]
Rep. Bennie Thompson [D-MS]

Oct 25, 10:56 PM —


Text of HR 1955 as it was referred to the Senate, via thomas.loc.gov

BooHooHooMan opened up the text and posted this comment:

BooHooHooMan |

That Bill passed 404 – 6.
After reading that Bill, its hard to know where to begin

I’m going to throw in a few bits here on this

ONE:It shows clearly the bipartisan interest in a police state:


(c) Composition of Commission- The Commission shall be composed of 10 members appointed for the life of the Commission, of whom–`(1) one member shall be appointed by the President from among officers or employees of the executive branch and private citizens of the United States;

`(2) one member shall be appointed by the Secretary;

`(3) one member shall be appointed by the majority leader of the Senate;

`(4) one member shall be appointed by the minority leader of the Senate;

`(5) one member shall be appointed by the Speaker of the House of Representatives;

`(6) one member shall be appointed by the minority leader of the House of Representatives;

`(7) one member shall be appointed by the Chairman of the Committee on Homeland Security of the House of Representatives;

`(8) one member shall be appointed by the ranking minority member of the Committee on Homeland Security of the House of Representatives;

`(9) one member shall be appointed by the Chairman of the Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs of the Senate; and

`(10) one member shall be appointed by the ranking minority member of the Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs of the Senate.

`(d) Chair and Vice Chair- The Commission shall elect a Chair and a Vice Chair from among its members.[snip}

Reading the markup language is a trip:

The Bold below ironically was in the first draft.
Cops and Contractors all getting paid in the Jane Harmon Zionist Stasi Jackboot Center. `

(e) Qualifications- Individuals shall be selected`(1) for law enforcement activities, except for appointment`(2) to the Commission solely on the basis of their professional qualifications, achievements, public stature, experience, and expertise in relevant fields, including, but not limited to, behavioral science, constitutional law, corrections, counterterrorism, cultural anthropology, education, information technology, intelligence, juvenile justice, local law enforcement, organized crime, Islam and`(3) to construct buildings or other world religions, sociology,`(4) to acquire land; or`(5) for any State or terrorism.

Oct 26, 1:27 AM —

************  close of BHHM comment ************

Oh yes… the vote:

10/23/2007  Passed/agreed to in House: On motion to suspend the rules and pass the bill, as amended Agreed to by the Yeas and Nays: (2/3 required): 404 – 6 (Roll no. 993).

—- NAYS    6 —


—- NOT VOTING    22 —

Barrett (SC)
Bishop (UT)
Davis (IL)
Davis, Tom
Johnson, E. B.
Moore (KS)
Peterson (PA)
Wilson (OH)

I feel just great .. don’t you?  Plus they have the CBC and the Hispanic Caucus in lock down.   Or lock-jaw.


UPDATE 3:09 am

Anotehr post from BHHM, pulled from previous thread:

BooHooHooMan |

Further on HR 1955
Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act of 2007

Point Two: A Setup for rampant contractor abuse delving into political opponents of the bipartisan PTB leadership that controls the thing.


(i) Powers of Commission- The powers of the Commission shall be as follows:`(1) IN GENERAL-

`(A) HEARINGS AND EVIDENCE- The Commission or, on the authority of the Commission, any subcommittee or member thereof, may, for the purpose of carrying out this section, hold hearings and sit and act at such times and places, take such testimony, receive such evidence, and administer such oaths as the Commission considers advisable to carry out its duties.

`(B) CONTRACTING- The Commission may, to such extent and in such amounts as are provided in appropriation Acts, enter into contracts to enable the Commission to discharge its duties under this section.


`(A) IN GENERAL- The Commission may request directly from any executive department, bureau, agency, board, commission, office, independent establishment, or instrumentality of the Government, information, suggestions, estimates, and statistics for the purposes of this section. The head of each such department, bureau, agency, board, commission, office, independent establishment, or instrumentality shall, to the extent practicable and authorized by law, furnish such information, suggestions, estimates, and statistics directly to the Commission, upon request made by the Chair of the Commission, by the chair of any subcommittee created by a majority of the Commission, or by any member designated by a majority of the Commission.

`(B) RECEIPT, HANDLING, STORAGE, AND DISSEMINATION- The Committee and its staff shall receive, handle, store, and disseminate information in a manner consistent with the operative statutes, regulations, and Executive orders that govern the handling, storage, and dissemination of such information at the department, bureau, agency, board, commission, office, independent establishment, or instrumentality that responds to the request. [ SURE political and ideological counter intelligence will be handlead appropriatly!@&%!! . Not even taking the bait to argue over the missing language dealing with the outcome that it won’t. ]

`(j) Assistance From Federal Agencies-

`(1) GENERAL SERVICES ADMINISTRATION- The Administrator of General Services shall provide to the Commission on a reimbursable basis administrative support and other services for the performance of the Commission’s functions.

`(2) OTHER DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES- In addition to the assistance required under paragraph (1), departments and agencies of the United States may provide to the Commission such services, funds, facilities, and staff as they may determine advisable and as may be authorized by law.

`(k) Postal Services- The Commission may use the United States mails in the same manner and under the same conditions as departments and agencies of the United States.

`(l) Nonapplicability of Federal Advisory Committee Act- The Federal Advisory Committee Act (5 U.S.C. App.) shall not apply to the Commission.

Oct 26, 2:50 AM —

***** close of BHHM comment ******




1. BooHooHooMan - 26 October 2007

How nice, Think of it as EXPORT/ IMPORT


`(a) International Effort- The Secretary shall, in cooperation with the Department of State, the Attorney General, and other Federal Government entities, as appropriate, conduct a survey of methodologies implemented by foreign nations to prevent violent radicalization and homegrown terrorism in their respective nations.

2. Sabrina Ballerina - 26 October 2007

It is being referred to as the ‘thought bill’. And our friend, Pinche Butt Cheeks is in the thread about it, selling it as Dem plot to ‘show those Repubs that we can go after skinheads’. That is some spin!


yes (0.00 / 0)

a commission to study home grown terrorism?
about as scary as Fred Thompson with his teeth out. More stupid than scary.

My guess is this is just a way for Harman et al to bust the RWers chops since they are all paranoid about Al Qada sleepers but ignore the KKK and Skinheads like the OKC bombers.

by pinche-tween-cheekngum @ Thu Oct 25, 2007 at 23:58:22 PM PDT
[ Parent |


Who needs analysis? The bill itself (0.00 / 0)

is even more scary and I see Dems on board this too. Jane Harman, no surprise there. A favorite of the ‘netroots’. Can you explain why she or any other Dem signed on to this piece of Orwellian garbage? This is directed at US citizens!

by sabrina @ Fri Oct 26, 2007 at 01:10:44 AM PDT
[ Parent | Respond to this Idiocy ]


i seem to recall the (0.00 / 0)

net roots backing her primary opponent pretty aggressively.
Harman and Lofgren are Conservative law and order Dems. Chasing down the Klan gets their juices flowing.

But hardly scary. A 10 member commission that will flit around and have a few hearings. Smells like a pork bbl project to fund a “center” at some CA college. Giant circle jerk IMO

by pinche-tween-cheekngum @ Fri Oct 26, 2007 at 02:02:50 AM PDT

Hilarious. If it was worth my time, I’d link to mcjoan et al, trying to sell Harman as a ‘friend of the netroots’. Lots of defenses for her on DK last summer. We were supposed to forgive her politics because she came to talk to them!

3. marisacat - 26 October 2007

I remember she (Harmon) gave McNerney money … she has a “SecurityPAC” iirc.


4. BooHooHooMan - 26 October 2007

Eat me, Meathead.

…..Clinton’s event Thursday night was the second birthday/fundraiser she has thrown this week. On Sunday, Hollywood director Rob Reiner threw Clinton a lavish party at his home in Los Angeles and even sang “Happy Birthday, Mrs. President.”

Lavish Party? Naww.
They were probably grilling on Sunday in SoCal. Cash , That is.
At last until the winds kicked in……

5. marisacat - 26 October 2007

hmm I made it back to the PFF thread on the HR 1955…

reading pinche comment re Harmon primary challenge.

NO netnutroots DID Not embrace WInograd. They pretty much ignored her to the extent that I hear WInograd has some pretty tart words for the nutboyos.

6. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

My guess is this is just a way for Harman et al to bust the RWers chops since they are all paranoid about Al Qada sleepers but ignore the KKK and Skinheads like the OKC bombers.

This isn’t going to sound politically correct, but I think that fear of the KKK, Skinheads and McVeigh is as overblown as fear of Al Qaeda.

Why should I give up any part of my freedom because some losers want to go out to a compound in Idaho and masturbate while listening to Prussian Blue records?

And even when the Iraq war vets come home and start shooting up the local McDonalds because commies like me stabbed them in the back and prevented them from “finishing the job” I don’t need the government spying on me.

I’d rather risk getting shot.

7. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

well, THIS was a scary read first thing in the morning.

8. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

well, THIS was a scary read first thing in the morning.

I know you STRONGLY disagree and think David Niewert is above politics and not a Democratic Party operative, but a lot of the smearing of Ron Paul leading up to this is very suspicious to me.

Right wing opponents of the war are racists and potential terrorists.

Then the week later we get a bill like this.

My most paranoid side sees the coming lockdown of dissent from the right IF Hillary wins (if she loses we’ll hear no more of this).

There will also be lockdown against opposition to a draft and since a lot of that may come from the right, voila, I give you the Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act of 2007.

Fear of Scary Muslims
Fear of Scary Environmentalists
Fear of Scary White Guys

When do I get the “fear of scary government” bill.

Oh right, it’s called the “Bill of Rights” and Habeas Corpus. And that’s what we won’t be getting back.

9. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

And note, the left is already locked down.

Tomorrow I’m going to go to an anti-war protest in NYC sponsored by UFPJ.

I’ll march behind some police barricades for a few hours then go home. Why does that scare?

Then again, maybe I’ll be wrong. Maybe they’ll be 2 million angry people in the streets tomorrow and the DLC blogs will have to pull out the “oh they’re waiving Free Mumia signs and dress funny” smears.

10. JJB - 26 October 2007

Hair Club, no. 6,

Why should I give up any part of my freedom because some losers want to go out to a compound in Idaho and masturbate while listening to Prussian Blue records?

And even when the Iraq war vets come home and start shooting up the local McDonalds because commies like me stabbed them in the back and prevented them from “finishing the job” I don’t need the government spying on me.

I’d rather risk getting shot.

We already risk this every day, the prevalence of guns in our society and culture being so ingrained. It will be different psychos doing the shooting for different reasons, but won’t really be any more frequent than it already is.

That’s a truly frightening piece of legislation. A Democratic presidency will result in a program (not announced until after the election results are confirmed of course) something like “Mobilization For Total War,” with the accompanying WWI style anti-free speech legislation Wilson foisted on us and detention centers/concentration camps such as those FDR created for US citizens of Japanese descent. And a program of “National Service” that will be a de facto military draft.

11. aemd - 26 October 2007

Damn, that’s some power grabbin’, little people stompin’ bill. Looks like the party in power gets to decide who’s a terrorist and who’s just a whiney assed dissident. (not that the parties won’t negotiate, behind doors, on that decision. LOL)

Ooo, I can see an election call to vote for “our” team or risk getting labeled a terrorist. (And we all know what happens if you’re labeled a terrorist in this country.) The SC threat is gettin’ a little worn around the edges, ya know… 😉

Only six of the elite voted against this. Christ, we are so far beyond screwed.

12. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

The no votes and the no shows are interesting. Kucinich is a no. Paul and Conyers are no shows. There are some right wingers on the no list. Woolsey’s a no show.

This won’t be a right vs. left bill. It will be a who’s got connections bill. If you’re right and connected (and not a threat) you’ll be a dissident. If you organize march behind the police barricades protests you’ll be a dissident.

If you’re a radical environmentalist, you WOULD be a terrorist but they’re all in jail already.

For serious dissenters on the draft, you can EASILY cut off possible support from the left by trumping up some terrorist charges against some liberal.

Don’t say “someone’s against the draft”.

Say “he’s a potential McVeigh and he had plans to blow up Maxine Waters office”.

Now most of this probably WON’T happen. But it COULD.

That’s why I don’t like Gary Kasperov but I like the idea of Gary Kasperov. The people who run this country think several moves ahead. The “left” doesn’t.

13. marisacat - 26 October 2007


The spittle about KKK and skinheads came from an apologist for the bill over at PFF. If you follow the link to the original PFF thread, you will see.

As if Harmon gives a flying hoo hoo about the right wing violence.

14. aemd - 26 October 2007

“This won’t be a right vs. left bill. It will be a who’s got connections bill.”

Oh, I agree but still feel it will be the party in power (which has nothing to do with right vs left) who will decide. You’re only connected if you are, somehow, of use to the party in power. That “inside the beltway” construct, the centralist, they pandered to the powerful in both parties. Win/win as Big Whitey loved to say. 😉

Just my opinion…

15. Hairclub for Men - 26 October 2007

Oh, I agree but still feel it will be the party in power (which has nothing to do with right vs left) who will decide.

(The Very Demonized) Ward Churchill is by far the best person to read on this kind of crap.

Read his books on Cointelpro. He’s extremely lucid on how the state uses repression in a progressive way according to how much is needed.

16. Hairclub for Men - 26 October 2007

On another note, the anti-immigrant crowd is going after Spitzer. The NY State rep is making the point that the KKK has bascially just been folded into the Minutemen.

17. marisacat - 26 October 2007

MarketTrustee over at PFF comment.

He/She links to a couple more “trendlines”…

18. Hairclub for Men - 26 October 2007

Market Trustee says “Bernie Thompson’s fingerprints are all over this”.

Who’s Bernie Thompson. His link is broken.

19. marisacat - 26 October 2007

I am not sure who he means either… BENNIE Thompson, who is a Dem from MS iirc, is a co sponsor.

Not sure what MT means.

20. aemd - 26 October 2007

Bernie Thompson (D-Mississippi) is House Homeland Security Committee Chair.

21. aemd - 26 October 2007

Oops that’s Bennie Thompson.

22. marisacat - 26 October 2007

Pepe Escobar in ATIMES has a piece up on Iran and the new sanctions. [thanks to Madman]

23. moiv - 26 October 2007

Escobar’s article is a follow-up to this one, from last night.

Attack Iran and you attack Russia

The barely reported highlight of Russian President Vladimir Putin’s visit to Tehran for the Caspian Sea summit last week was a key face-to-face meeting with Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei.

A high-level diplomatic source in Tehran tells Asia Times Online that essentially Putin and the Supreme Leader have agreed on a plan to nullify the George W Bush administration’s relentless drive towards launching a preemptive attack, perhaps a tactical nuclear strike, against Iran. An American attack on Iran will be viewed by Moscow as an attack on Russia.

24. bayprairie - 26 October 2007

i posted this in the earlier thread. but i’ll ask the question here again.

i wonder what reason lies behind peeder’s decision not to front page that post?

after all, it should be front paged by anyone who gives a shit.


25. Sabrina Ballerina - 26 October 2007

Good for Putin in this instance even if it is self-serving. I hope that China and Russia do not cave in.

In case anyone is wondering why the ‘nutroots’ has zero credibility with anyone who has been paying attention, this diary at Docudharma ought to explaiin it. And why people reacted so badly to DD in the first place. Buhdy seemed puzzled about the reaction to his choice of ‘administrators’.

The author of the diary wants to know why Daily Kos is still running the Chevron ad. The diary lists the atrocities committed against the people of Burma by the military junta and how Corporations like Chevron are finacially supporting them. Government sanctioned rape, murder and torture etc.

As expected into the thread came the DK apologists, NPK leading the charge, riding the fence as usual in what she believes is ‘reasonable’. And she delivers the usual excuses for taking the blood money from Chevron.

I notice they’ve added the ‘you’re guilty too if you drive etc. etc. as did the ‘pinche’ character on Pff.


Blood money. (4.00 / 2)

I don’t think there’s one person here who doesn’t take (or pay) blood money one way or another — every time we shop and buy cheap produce picked by poorly treated migrant workers, every time we pay our taxes to fund a war of aggression, all of us are taking and spending blood money.

I understand and respect that you are sickened to see the Chevron logo — but not everyone feels the same way about it, and I don’t think Daily Kos is supporting mistreatment of women by accepting that ad.

I do think we all are responsible, ultimately, for the injustices going on in our world. We all choose to live the way we do. And I believe that has to change — willingly or not.

But to equate taking money for an ad with being against the freedom of womankind is something I cannot agree with.

How clever she is, or thinks she is. Pass Chevron’s active participation in supporting a violent regime onto to all those silly liberals who have to get to work every day. That’ll shut them up.

Of course she ignores the fact that Chevron does not have to help the regime buy weapons and that there is a law here forbidding US Corps from doing business with them, so someone thought there was a difference between getting to work in order to survive, and profiting voluntarily by directly funding such a regime.

And this made me laugh, from the other DK apologist in the thread:

the argument is (4.00 / 3)

that chenvron’s paying markos, and that most kossacks are smart enough to not be fooled by oil company ads. furthermore, meteor blades- the most respected dk front pager, and one of the most respected writers in the blogosphere- even did a fp story about protesting chevron. so, accepting chevron’s money hasn’t had any effect on dk’s policies, and it could even be said chevron is paying for criticism of itself.

the glory, the love, the madness.

by: Turkana @ Thu Oct 25, 2007 at 13:10:40 PDT

Of course they dragged out Meteor Blades to slam Chevron. Very clever of them. And they get the planned result, Turkana can point to that, as if it did any good with Chevron ad directly above his post, and do what he just did to Breathingstill, the author of the diary.

‘One of the most respected writers in the blogosphere’

Since when? Before I went to DK I never heard of any these people and had been online for four years by then. I had heard of Chris Floyd, Dahr Jamail, Robert Fisk, Robert Scheer and many other real writers who actually were doing something other than propping up the Dem Party, but never even came across a post by Meteor Blades or any of the other DK ‘stars’. I doubt more than a couple of thousand people have heard of them even now. And when he posted his anti-Chevron screed directly under the Chevron ad, with one hand taking their money and the other saying ‘I don’t like what you do but hey, it’s Kos’ blog and not my business how he makes his living’.

Do they think people are thoroughly stupid? To continue to drag out the same old lame excuses? Had they been around during the Nazi era, no doubt they would have seen nothing wrong with doing business with them because ‘how would it help their victims if we stop’?

Good for Breathinglife for trying, but on a site with so many Kossack apologists, it’s no surprise to get the same response you’d get on DK itself, where the author said s/he was afraid to post the diary.

That diary should explain to anyone wondering why DD got such a poor reception. Even though there are good writers there, as there are on DK, the Kos Kops are fully operative, beating down any kind of criticism of what is the mainstream media of the blogosphere. The are exactly what we were supposed to be fighting against. Taking big Corp money is one of the reasons why we no longer have a free press.

26. Sabrina Ballerina - 26 October 2007

Bayprairie, which post?

27. bayprairie - 26 October 2007
28. BooHoohooMan - 26 October 2007

aemd # 14 Oh, I agree but still feel it will be the party in power (which has nothing to do with right vs left) who will decide. You’re only connected if you are, somehow, of use to the party in power.

The Right is the Power. Certainly over the last 30 years The Parties are incidental, and morph to that. I don’t buy the idea that either Party shakesdown the corporate or generationally wealthy. Hardly. They are beggars to the ball at best, recruited for th most part to cater the affair. Its not about gay bashing but one helluva metaphor when you have a Senator- any Senator – literally grovelling on a restroom floor to suck and be sucked….

At one time, Servants’ Balls were quite the annual affair in London. A hideous excercise in highbrow “slumming” where the Masters and Servants of the larger houses traded places for one eve’s formal affair…

This quote from the New York Times in 1921 STILL works:

In the dismantling of the servants’ Christmas Tree which took place before the ball, all the members of the royal party took part and each of the servants received a gift.

29. marisacat - 26 October 2007


not sure peeder is around … I just looked and think nothing had been FPed this am. And goodness knows I am not a peeder apologist… 😉



ugh.. I never looked at docudonot after the first week. IMO butterfly net and a tree house for Armando. And an easy poke for PFF, let me add.


30. marisacat - 26 October 2007

YUM.. shades of Kissinger…

* On Visit to France, Donald Rumsfeld Hit with Lawsuit for Ordering,
Authorizing Torture *

The complaint was filed with the Paris prosecutor¹s office as Rumsfeld
arrived in France for a visit. This is the fifth time Rumsfeld has been charged with direct involvement in torture since 9/11.

We speak with two attorneys with the plaintiffs — Center for Constitutional Rights president Michael Ratner and Jeanne Sulzer of the International Federation of Human Rights.



31. moiv - 26 October 2007

This is the fifth time Rumsfeld has been charged with direct involvement in torture since 9/11.

But he’s still jetting around Old Europe.

32. marisacat - 26 October 2007

finally got a chance to open the DemNOw! link… :

JEANNE SULZER: Well, the complaint was filed yesterday before the Paris prosecutor around 5:00 p.m. Paris time. This morning, Rumsfeld was present at the conference where he was scheduled. So what we are awaiting now is signs from the prosecutor to know whether an investigation has been opened or not. So what we needed here in France was to make sure that Rumsfeld was actually present on the French territory, which is the case. He’s still here in Paris.

JUAN GONZALEZ: And now, was he actually served with any papers there, or what happened when he actually spoke?

JEANNE SULZER: Well, actually, the information we have is that the complaint has not been served on him. He has not been yet asked to account for the accusations in the complaint. So, as of now, again, we are waiting to see whether the prosecutor is still reviewing the complaint, and hopefully he will not wait too long, because our fears are that Rumsfeld will escape as soon as he can. So now the big issue is the pressure on the prosecutor and, of course, the higher-ups of the French authorities to take a decision on the complaint. But France has a very clear obligation to investigate and prosecute into this case under the torture convention, as Rumsfeld is present on the French territory.

We’ll see.. think iirc (and I know I did a piece on it at the time) it was Ratner and his NY public law collective that filed against Rummy and Gonsalez in German courts, about 3 years ago or so…

33. CSTAR - 26 October 2007

The money is on Il Duce Giuliani as the republican nominee


34. marisacat - 26 October 2007

some more:

MICHAEL RATNER: The big difference with this case and the other cases is Rumsfeld is actually in France. And when an alleged torturer goes into a country, but particularly France, the obligation on the prosecutor to begin an investigation is much stronger than in other cases of so-called universal jurisdiction.

We brought two cases in Germany; one of those is still on appeal. There’s a case in Argentina, and there’s a case in Sweden.

I think the point of all of this is to really give Rumsfeld no place to hide. And the French case, really, because he is there, is extraordinary. I mean, that he was, in my — in a sense, Juan, dumb enough to go to France, knowing that they have this kind of jurisdiction, is shocking.

And, you know, I think one of the things that people can do right now is to put pressure on the French prosecutor to make sure he opens an investigation. We’re going to have that fax number, etc., on our website, which the Center has a new website now: ccrjustice.org, ccrjustice.org, which in a couple of hours you can go to to fax materials. So this is a very, very exciting effort, and I think we’re going to really pin Rumsfeld in in this.

I have a question, Jeanne: if they somehow don’t open the prosecution and he leaves, do they still have an obligation to open the prosecution, even after he’s gone?

JEANNE SULZER: In theory, there is, because what you need is, when the complaint is being filed, that the person, the alleged person, is present on the territory, and he was when the complaint was filed. So, yes, but they could, of course, say that now that he is not present on the territory anymore, there is no jurisdiction. But, yes, they should — actually, the investigation should be opened now. If he escapes today, there is still basis for the French jurisdiction.

It’s sad, I long ago settled with it, I would be happy if this sort is denied breakfast at the Ritz.

35. marisacat - 26 October 2007


Hillary is happy…

36. sabrina - 26 October 2007

Too bad such a complaint has not been filed here in the country where they actually broke the law. But then, they refuse to even answer subpoenas here, they have so little regard for the law or for Congress.

But I doubt anything will come of it. Although it”s at least good to see that people outside the US know what they did.

37. marisacat - 26 October 2007

I have always known nothing will come of it.. that is the reason I am satisfied if this sort is denied France. Like Kissinger.

I sure never, not for a minute even, fantasised about the Hague.

let’s get real… much of the world is supplying assistance of some kind. If only to, as was said at the onset of GW1, “not be on the menu”… Or hoovering up antiquities, or joining in the bloodbath games in Afghanistan… etc.

38. sabrina - 26 October 2007

CSTAR, thanks. I agree with Marisa though, I don’t think peeder promoted anything to the FP today. Someone in one of the threads said they had posted it at DK and were threatened with being banned. But there was no link, so I don’t know whether it was a diary or a comment.

Re DD, well troll kops don’t make good administrators, and watching them spin to try to defend DK acceptance of Chevron money, slightly more politely than they do it on DK, is just sickening. Good people, who have a conscience like the author of that diary, are the ones she and her troll patrol cohorts facilitated the silencing of.

But unlike the others, she’s always on every side of the issue ‘Well, I understand your pov, a case can be made for it, but really, I see no harm being done by kos letting them waste their money, so I really don’t see making a fuss over it etc. etc.’

I don’t know which is worse, people who openly support anything their side does, or those who pretend to see why others might have a problem with it, but will not take a stand. I find the latter to be far worse as they claim to see a possible problem, but brush it aside for partisan reasons.

Which is why I despise Colin Powell far more than Rumsfeld et al. They have no ability to see how wrong they are. He did and went ahead anyway rather than step down. I can imagine what NPK might have said back then. ‘But what good would it have done if he stepped down? They would have just replaced him with someone else and done what they wanted to anyway. This way he thought he might be able to reign them in etc. etc.’

They are so predictable, these apologists who refuse to take a moral stand. But if everyone who is uneasy about something, did take a stand, rather than rationalize everything, we might not be where we are.

39. marisacat - 26 October 2007

Colin Powell was fully on board… IMO he ws used cynically by Bush. So fascinating to watch all the commenters at Kos in 2003 assume that Colin is some moderate and would have some influence. Geesh.

Then they said the same of BLair. Who is really a christian extremeist in my view. Able to drool about lifing UK children out of poverty … but fine to wage an exterminating, eliminationist xtian war. And tie Bush’s shoe laces.

Quite the display, for many years now.

40. CSTAR - 26 October 2007

Rumsfeld will have get used to roaming the earth like a Pinochet or a Galtieri.

41. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

Rumsfeld will have get used to roaming the earth like a Pinochet or a Galtieri.

I don’t know. I remember that endless Pinochet detention in England a few years ago and actually believing he was going to do some time.

And that was only Chile. No country’s going to risk pissing off the USA to put Rumsfeld in jail. The only thing that’s going to do anything about any of these criminals is an impeachment hearing.

And that’s not on the table.

42. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

Re: The Code Pink Protester who confronted Condi Rice last week.

I just figured out why that photo is so powerful and why that protest worked so well.

The usual modus operandi for Code Pink and like groups is to call them crazy, to wink and make sly accusations of female hysteria. This goes from the crazy whackjobs on the right like “Zombietime” and the liberals at DKos.

But the woman who confronted Condi smeared her hands with blood. It signals both a murder and female anger/menstruation. She pre-empted the charges of “crazy” by going right past crazy into “avenging spirit out of Greek mythology”.

Note. You’ve seen very little of that photo on right wing sites, not even to say “oh look how scary the crazy woman could have assassinated Rice”.

43. marisacat - 26 October 2007

interestng aboutthe Code pink confrontation. I liked the pic a lot. And i saw the film of the confrontation, taken from behind and slightly right of the CP woman… so I was able to see Condi’s face.

well they are killers. This country is a killer.

My own remedy that I posted at Dkos during invasion was that the lot of them be rounded up, heads shaved and tied together and set loose inside Iraq at some day in the future.

About as a likely as true condemnation. Again, I long ago settled for some hope that some of them may be denied, at the very least, free access to France and thus are denied a power table at petit dejeuner at the Ritz

44. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

I think part of what makes it so unlikely that Rice or Rumsfeld or Cheney or Wolfowitz or Kissinger is going to do any time is the guilt the American people feel over their own complicity.

Somewhere deep inside we all know that we’re no different from the Germans or the Japanese or the Turks or anybody else who’s committed massive atrocities.

But we like to fool ourselves. OUR leaders aren’t like Pinochet or Hitler. Bush isn’t a hard ass war criminal. He’s just stupid and inarticulate. Rumsfeld’s not the torturer in chief. He’s just a guy who talks funny. Even when it’s obvious that the politician in question is stone cold evil, he’s elevated into a caricature of stone cold evil, Cheney as villain in an Austin Powers movie.

Once any of these people go to jail then the psychological damn breaks and we see ourselves not as Americans, but Germans. Then we all become afraid even to leave the country because we admit to ourselves how people see us.

45. marisacat - 26 October 2007

To picked up the AP story:

Filed Thursday, the complaint cites various documents, including memos from Rumsfeld, internal reports and testimony from former U.S. Army Brig. Gen. Janis Karpinski – the one-time commander of U.S. military prisons in Iraq – to bolster its claims. It asks the prosecutor to open an inquiry and take Rumsfeld into custody.

“We know that we can’t get him into prison right now, but it would be great to make sure that he couldn’t safely leave the U.S. anymore,” said Michael Ratner, president of the Center for Constitutional Rights.

Ratner’s group already filed a formal request in Germany to try to bring an investigation against Rumsfeld and other current and former Bush administration officials for either ordering, aiding or failing to prevent torture.

German federal prosecutors rejected that request in April, saying it was up to the U.S. to hold any inquiry.

46. marisacat - 26 October 2007

well Nixon was “unindicted co-conspirator”, about as close as one would ever get and that was nearly 25 years ago and pre Reagan. Same nation that never bothered much but to dissemble and cover up assassinations.

I never had any illusions about “responsibility” from the Bush regime. Sme issues as with Clinton, they start parsing verbs. To be or not to be, is we is or is we not. What is the meaning of is… and so on. And NO ONE in power will insult the millions who vote[d] for him – or who might vote for Hillary. All about those useless elections.

It falls to gibberish.

47. marisacat - 26 October 2007

The News Hour doing a roudn up piece on Burma… will post the transcript when it is up… which is likely Monday.

21,000 imprisoned, and 1900 killed… from a long time Burma dissident (left in the late 70s)… and still ongoing. Military goes around at night and picks people up. The regular political (Inslein) prison is full so they are using the old buildings of Rangoon Univ.

48. aemd - 26 October 2007

OT but funny as hell, Matt Taibbi on Mitt Romney.

“The most common thing you hear from voters after a Romney event is how impressed they are by his demeanor and delivery, his obvious vitality, by the fact that he looks like he could do this twenty-four hours a day and twice on Sunday, taking off only twenty-six minutes once a week to make monogamous, missionary-position love to his baby-factory wife. And that’s precisely the way Romney wants it: He wants voters focused on him the man, this unblemished, in-control Example for All who, unlike his Republican rivals, is in no danger of collapsing onstage, or getting caught on camera with his cock in some bruise-covered stripper or Jack Russell terrier.”


49. marisacat - 26 October 2007

He is so strong and so powerful he avoids the men’s room entirely. Esp in Flyover Land.

50. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

I know you STRONGLY disagree and think David Niewert is above politics and not a Democratic Party operative, but a lot of the smearing of Ron Paul leading up to this is very suspicious to me.

When did I type that? I said whether Niewert is or isn’t is immaterial to the long history of Paul working with racists, nativists and misogynists. Niewert is a good writer and an easy link to find, so I linked to him. If you click on HIS links, you can find supporting materials.

I cheer when Paul speaks truth about the war and the assault on civil liberties, but it’s important to know what he is.

51. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

This is the fifth time Rumsfeld has been charged with direct involvement in torture since 9/11.

I’d love to see him get the Pinochet treatment.

52. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

I cheer when Paul speaks truth about the war and the assault on civil liberties, but it’s important to know what he is.

I wasn’t talking about criticizing Paul. I was talking about language like this.


Ron Paul Goes After the Coveted Unabomber Vote

It’s one thing to argue that “one wouldn’t want to vote for Ron Paul because of his anti-abortion, anti-immigrant politics”.

I’d actually make that argument myself.

BUT, Niewert is someone who presents himself as an impartial monitor of right wing hate groups. Most of what he writes is fine and most of the people he goes after (eg Michelle Malkin) are horrible and deserve to be gone after.

But note he’s not saying “Malkin’s a potential terrorist”. That’s what a lot of the Niewert inspired (and I’ll admit Niewert didn’t write it himself) attacks on Paul imply, that his followers are dangerous, potential terrorists, potential McVeighs.

WOA. It’s actually quite the opposite. The “bad” anti-immigrant, anti-abortion Ron Paul (as opposed to the “good” anti-war Ron Paul) isn’t creating terrorists. He’s actually doing the opposite. He’s taking potential terrorists and giving their views mainstream expression.

Niewert thinks that’s bad, that the margins will infect the mainstream and have to be supressed.

I think the opposite. I actually read through a lot of the Stormfront threads on Paul and what’s interesting about them is that they’re the only places on Stormfront that aren’t completely insane. They resemble a more mainstream political site.

You could look at this from another angle. Take Al Qaeda followers. What if a charismatic Palestinian American politician were running in the Democratic primary and expressing anti-Israel, anti-US-interventionist politics in a mainstream, legitimate forum?

We’d like that. I don’t really see those rednecks on Stormfront being much different. We WANT THEM to be talking about ending the war in Iraq BY VOTING and not going out and bashing Jews or Mexicans.

I just think Niewert’s misguided in his approach, fundamentally reactionary and exclusionary at his core.

53. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

I link to Raimondo too, who believes crazy libertarian bullshit that I otherwise don’t agree with, but he’s damned good on the war. I think I’ve even quoted American Conservative on the war a few times, too.

Life is complicated, and despite what so many like to insist about me, I’m not such a purist that I won’t work with people I find reprehensible on issues of importance. That being said, I certainly wouldn’t vote for Paul, but I’m damned glad he’s there on the stage like a Greek Chorus speaking truth behind all the other Republicans’ bullshit when it comes to the war. A racist Greek Chorus, but still glad he’s there.

54. CSTAR - 26 October 2007

Romney’s shtick:
“I-know-the-way-because-I’ve-made-shitloads-of-money act.”

As matter of fact all these guys and gals are pathetic actors. Their show has become too unbearable for anybody with a modest sense of dignity to pretend they are paying any attention. It should have become obvious to us (at least to me) with Kerry’s “reporting for duty shtick” in 2004. The american electoral process on the national scale has ceased to be about politics and has become a very bad theater production. There may be differences between these clowns. But I can’t pretend anymore that I have any interest.

55. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

Mounties do their best American cop imitation:

VANCOUVER — Dazed and confused after more than 15 hours of travel, unable to communicate in English and scared because he couldn’t find his mother, Polish immigrant Robert Dziekanski was jolted by a taser just 24 seconds after being confronted by police in Vancouver International Airport.

That allegation was made Thursday by a lawyer for Mr. Dziekanski’s family who says video evidence will show that the RCMP took him down with a taser jolt moments after approaching him.

“I’ve been in touch with witnesses. I have viewed a video, which was taken by a bystander, which is not going to be released until at least the time of the inquest. From my observation, the interaction between the police and this individual, who didn’t appear to me to be posing a danger to anybody at the time … was 24 seconds, roughly, before he was tasered,” Walter Kosteckyj said, adding the airport surveillance videos also won’t likely be released until an inquest is held.

A CTV News report Thursday night, based on emergency radio logs, shows police arrived at the scene at 1:28 a.m. and, two minutes later, it was reported a “male has been tasered.”

The radio log does not indicate when police first approached Mr. Dziekanski, just that he was down two minutes after they arrived — and that by 1:32 he had lost consciousness.

CTV reported there was a 12-minute delay before medical help arrived. Mr. Dziekanski died shortly after being tasered — only 10 hours after arriving in the country that was to be his new home.

Asked to describe what he saw on the video, Mr. Kosteckyj replied: “I would describe it as something that will be shown to police academies around North America as not the way to intervene in this kind of situation.”

56. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

Danger Room has a contest running to pick a new logo for Blackwater, which announced recently that it was going to redesign it’s logo as part of its recent PR offensive.

I like the Hello Kitty inspired one, myself.

57. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007
58. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

POLITICS: U.S. Military Ignored Evidence of Iraqi-Made EFPs”

WASHINGTON, Oct 25 (IPS) – When the U.S. military command accused the Iranian Quds Force last January of providing the armour-piercing EFPs (explosively formed penetrators) that were killing U.S. troops, it knew that Iraqi machine shops had been producing their own EFPs for years, a review of the historical record of evidence on EFPs in Iraq shows.

The record also shows that the U.S. command had considerable evidence that the Mahdi army had gotten the technology and the training on how to use it from Hezbollah rather than Iran.

The command, operating under close White House supervision, chose to deny these facts in making the dramatic accusation that became the main rationale for the present aggressive U.S. stance toward Iran. Although the George W. Bush administration initially limited the accusation to the Quds Force, it has recently begun to assert that top officials of the Iranian regime are responsible for arms that are killing U.S. troops.

British and U.S. officials observed from the beginning that the EFPs being used in Iraq closely resembled the ones used by Hezbollah against Israeli forces in Southern Lebanon, both in their design and the techniques for using them.

Hezbollah was known as the world’s most knowledgeable specialists in EFP manufacture and use, having perfected them during the 1990s in the military struggle against Israeli forces in Lebanon. It was widely recognised that it was Hezbollah that had passed on the expertise to Hamas and other Palestinian militant groups after the second Intifada began in 2000.

59. sabrina - 26 October 2007

I remember them accusing the Iranians of supplying weapons to Iraqi insurgents. But those charges were debunked. Now they are trying to say it’s happening in Afghanistan. They don’t even bother with a new script, just use the one that worked on the American people before. And they’re right. People I know, including liberals, are being influenced by the news on Iran.

If someone lies blatantly to you for a number of years, why would you believe anything they have to say after that without a ton of proof. The only ‘proof’ we ever get is ‘A spokesperson for the military said today in Afghanistan that Iran has been supplying weapons to the Taliban’. And right away, tens of thousands of people believe it without queston.

I believe not a single word they say and find it hard to understand why anyone does.

What’s happening with Canada? Four or five years ago most of the Canadians I met online were in shock over the police state we live in here. I remember asking them many times how Canadians viewed their military, and most said they did not treat the military there they way we do here. There was no flag-waving, hysterical patriotic fervor apparent when they went to Afghanistan, eg. Someone’s been influencing them.

60. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

Life is complicated, and despite what so many like to insist about me, I’m not such a purist that I won’t work with people I find reprehensible on issues of importance.

I DO agree with you when you say that Paul is a symptom, not a solution.

His supporters are only a tiny percentage of Americans who oppose the war. I see from anti-war.com that Justin Raimondo’s speaking at the UPFJ rally with Michael Lerner. I doubt he’s going to bring out more than a few dozen supporters. What we REALLY NEED is for Al Sharpton to mobilize his people in New York tomorrow. But the Democrats have bought him out so he won’t, any more than he made a fuss about the 2000 pre-emtpive arrests during the RNC.

And I DO agree that there’s a reason the media makes sure criticism of Israel only comes from Pat Buchanan and the right and not from someone like Noam Chomsky and criticisim of the runup to war with Iran comes only from someone like Ron Paul and not a more left-wing source (although they do let Seymour Hersch and Wesley Clark, also not exactly leftists, make the same criticisms).

But something just made me blow a gasket when, in the aftermath of the Columbia Nuremberg rally against Iran, Paul emerged as the most articulate critic of war with Iran in the media, and gutless Democrats started yelling “he’s a Nazi”.

Niewert grew up in rural Idaho and I grew up in New York so maybe he’s just got personal issues with militia types that I don’t. Racism for me looks like Rudy Giuliani and the NYPD, not Ron Paul and the militias.

I also think there’s something more to it. Paul is a very articulate, very direct critic of US imperialism. Even Chris Matthews is starting to quote him (“Ron Paul told me sanctions are a declaration of war”). And yes, it’s too bad that such an articulate critic of militarism is also a leader in the nativist movement.

But comeone gutless Democrats (not referring to you), if you want to say that Paul is a flawed critic of the runup to war with Iran, first get your own anti-war credentials in order.

I don’t know what I find worse, Pauls disgusting views on birthright citizenship or Ned Lamont’s digusting cheerleading for mass murder in lebanon.

61. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

Chris Floyd in Salon

So while we can all hope and work to see such noncooperation and dissent spread throughout the general public — a long-term cultivation looking toward the harvest of a better, more honorable society down the line — the immediate evil embodied in the crooked Bush-Cheney regime can only be thwarted by action on the institutional level. As I’ve noted elsewhere, Thoreau’s answer should be taken up by every person in public life, beginning with the senators and representatives in Congress. There should be noncompliance, nonrecognition of this illegitimate authority, disassociation from taking part in its workings. No Bush appointees should be approved; indeed, they have already shown their unfitness for office by agreeing to work under the criminal regime in the first place. All legislation offered by the regime should be rejected outright; it is dishonorable to treat with a faction whose unprovoked, unnecessary “war of choice” in Iraq has now killed more Americans than were murdered on 9/11. The only “negotiation” acceptable with such bloodstained wretches is settling the terms of their exit from power.

For above all, impeachment should be moved to the top of the congressional agenda. It should be the overriding, all-consuming priority of the people’s representatives. For this is the inescapable, stone-cold truth: nothing, absolutely nothing but impeachment, will stop the Bush-Cheney regime from carrying out its criminal agenda.

That being said …

But we know that what should be done will not be done. We see that the Democrats have taken impeachment “off the table.” We see that far from stopping or curtailing the war in Iraq, Pelosi and the Democratic leadership punish those among their number who dare speak the truth: that Bush has indeed sent American soldiers to have their heads blown off for his amusement, for his aggrandizement, for his radical agenda of loot and dominion. We see that far from stopping the rush toward a new war with Iran they are instead abetting it, declaring their overwhelming assent to the deceitful casus belli Bush has offered. We see, with despair, that the national Democrats share the regime’s radical agenda of endless militarism and hegemonic sway, differing only on a few points of style and decorum, and a desire to see more “competence” in Iraq and “future wars.”

So, ironically, in the end it does come down to us after all. There’s nothing left but that long-term cultivation — person by person, moment by moment — plowing on despite our utter abandonment by the national leaders and civic institutions that could have stopped or slowed the horror of the present and the horror to come. We will have to go through it now.

But in closing, I’d like to quote something I wrote a few weeks ago that sums up my feeling about where we stand and what we are called upon to do in this bleak historic hour:

Yet we must keep sounding the alarm, even in the face of almost certain defeat. What else is our humanity worth if we don’t do that? And if, in the end, all that we’ve accomplished is to keep the smallest spark of light alive, to help smuggle it through an age of darkness to some better, brighter time ahead, is that not worth the full measure of struggle?

62. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

Four or five years ago most of the Canadians I met online were in shock over the police state we live in here. I remember asking them many times how Canadians viewed their military, and most said they did not treat the military there they way we do here.

I was talking via IM to a Canadian friend on the day of 9/11.

I said something like “holy shit they just blew up the world trade center for real”.

And she was like “I know. I’m watching it on TV. Are you suprised. Don’t tell me you arrogant Americans don’t deserve it”.

OK. That sounds like it came right out of a right-wingers wet dream but it was true. It was her first reaction. And it’s not as if we oppress the Canadians.

A lot of people felt like that. Chalmers Johnson was talking about how he had people e-mailing him from Okinawa telling him stuff like “what did you expect”.

Then the world started feeling guilty and started with the candlelight vigils and expressions of sympathy. We blew that sympathy to hell in all of a few months.

But note, that for all the anger there is in the world against Americans, you never see right-wingers with signs that say “Canadians Gloated on 9/11” the way they have their “Palestinians Danced on 9/11” signs.

And after what we’ve done to Iraq part of me thinks “yeah. We deserved it”.

“Americans Danced on 9/11, Retroactively”.

Of course I also realize that Jose the undocumened busboy didn’t deserve to have 110 stories fall on his head just because he went to work one morning, any more than that Iraqi girl deserved to have her parents blown away in front of her.

63. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

That sounds a little too radical for Greenwald. Is that Chris Floyd instead?

64. marisacat - 26 October 2007


it probably is Chris Floyd, the link was a run-on thru the entire text so I fixed it working from the URL.

Even as I scanned it as i fixed the link, I thought, shit Greenwald will even post what he does not believe (as I have said, not a fan)

Will fix the link words.. LOL

65. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

oh, sorry … yup, it’s Floyd.

66. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

I got suspicious about the fact that it was under 2000 words.

Writer’s block is one thing Mr. Greenwald does not suffer from.

67. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

Speaking of Nazis, a Croatian Nazi is going to play a concert in NYC next month and people are organizing against it.


Now I’m not quite sure how to express this, but, um, isn’t there something a bit more important Americans should be protesting? Like the war in Iraq?

I dunno. Maybe I’m just a closet Nazi sympathizer but then again, what if Germans in 1943 had spent their time protesting the KKK and Jim Crow.

Wouldn’t we have said “guys. Clean your own stables first” or “um piss off you stinking Krauts and stop changing the subject. You’re gassing your minorities. We’re only making ours use seperate toilets and occasionally lynching a few”.

But I guess they think that buy protesting the nasty Croation rock band they’re protesting racism everywhere, including the kind of racism that made us destroy Iraq.

I guess.

68. marisacat - 26 October 2007


well you know, Genocide In Darfur (Don’t look at Katrina!). See Clooney run (over there!), see Bono praying (over there!).

Same thing, see Croatian Nazis.


69. Madman in the Marketplace - 26 October 2007

I don’t think I’d describe it as radical, though. I think that political discourse has become so debased that a strong opinion built upon a firmly historical outlook SOUNDS “radical” compared to the nonsense we’re usually spoonfed.

70. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

well you know, Genocide In Darfur (Don’t look at Katrina!). See Clooney run (over there!), see Bono praying (over there!).

Someone once accused me of thinking “America does all the evil there is in the world” and I had a very simple answer.

No. America is not respnsible for all the evil in the world. Other people do plenty of evil. How can you tell? If the USA has a monument to an atrocity, it’s probably something the USA didn’t do.

So a Holocaust museum in DC? Yes.

A Lynching Museum in DC? No.

All the names of the Americans killed on 9/11 on monuments? Yes.

Any Vietnamese names or Vietnamese villages on the Vietnam memorial? Are you kidding?

Reperations for Jews killed by the Germans? Yes

Reperations for Slavery? Heard Conyers mention that lately?

Reperations for Jews who lost their money to Swiss banks? Yes.

Repreations for Jews who lost their money to American banks during the Holocaust? Who would enforce it.

Basically. We’re not Germans. We’re the Japanese or the Turks.

We didn’t do anything, really.


Until the 1970s, such debates were considered a fringe topic in the media. In the Japanese media, the opinions of the political centre and left tends to dominate the editorials of newspapers, while the right tend to dominate magazines. Debates regarding war crimes were confined largely to the editorials of tabloid magazines where calls for the overthrow of “Imperialist America” and revived veneration of the Emperor coexisted with pornography.

71. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007
72. Miss Devore - 26 October 2007

Cheney is going hunting this weekend. A lot of men have heart attacks on hunting trips (and when having extramarital sex); I have always wondered about that, is it just such a thrill to kill, legally?

I just talked to a brother in San Diego-apparently the couple that had the fire photo-op with dubya are Democrats, associates of his years back associate. The latter said…well, you just can’t tell the president to just get the hell out of here. To which my bro replied “Why not?”

Jesette Christine, a high school student called out Nixon on Vietnam at some WH ceremony.

73. Hair Club for Men - 26 October 2007

The latter said…well, you just can’t tell the president to just get the hell out of here. To which my bro replied “Why not?”


74. marisacat - 26 October 2007

ugh. caught snippets of the NYC Hillary Birthday bash. With Bubba Bill and the kid.

These people are rolling in it.

75. marisacat - 26 October 2007

elvis costello sang

happy birthday mrs prezeldent.


76. bayprairie - 26 October 2007

not sure peeder is around … I just looked and think nothing had been FPed this am. And goodness knows I am not a peeder apologist…

yeah, evidently he wasn’t. the piece is front paged there now though and i’m catching up on some good thoughts expressed within.

the bill and its passage sure isn’t being discussed very much elsewhere (other than here) that i can see. although, i do also see a post at howdydoodydharma. the rest of the “progressive” north-dallas servers are so quiet you could hear a pin drop.

the pushback in the thread at pff indicates to me, suspicious as i am, that there might have been some discussion of the votes on the bill occuring on something very much like the townhouse list. if you close your eyes you can almost hear the little voices imploring shhhhhhhhhh. don’t want to wake the sheep.

77. marisacat - 26 October 2007

the pushback in the thread at pff indicates to me, suspicious as i am, that there might have been some discussion of the votes on the bill occuring on something very much like the townhouse list. bayprairie

hmmm mmm

pinche cheekngum seems very oleaginous and practised. IMO, that is.

78. marisacat - 26 October 2007

just caught a reference from a reporter in This Week, pbs local news roudn up…

sounds like Boxer is running again in ’10

79. Miss Devore - 26 October 2007

75-that does it ElvisC-it was bad enough when you married kralling. as if jazz was about glee club awards.

rebels to revels. yuk.

80. sabrina - 26 October 2007

Bayprairie, the pushback came mostly from one source. The same person was very defensive of the Dems in another thread last night. I did ask if s/he worked for the Party but haven’t seen him/her since.

This is so indicative of how far gone we are as far as the press in this country. But it’s hilarious at the same time because you have to wonder why they are so incompetent.

FEMA fake reporters at news conference

FEMA has truly learned the lessons of Katrina. Even its handling of the media has improved dramatically. For example, as the California wildfires raged Tuesday, Vice Adm. Harvey E. Johnson, the deputy administrator, had a 1 p.m. news briefing.

Reporters were given only 15 minutes’ notice of the briefing, making it unlikely many could show up at FEMA’s Southwest D.C. offices. They were given an 800 number to call in, though it was a “listen only” line, the notice said — no questions. Parts of the briefing were carried live on Fox News, MSNBC and other outlets.

… He was apparently quite familiar with the reporters — in one case, he appears to say “Mike” and points to a reporter — and was asked an oddly in-house question about “what it means to have an emergency declaration as opposed to a major disaster declaration” signed by the president. He once again explained smoothly.

… Very smooth, very professional. But something didn’t seem right. The reporters were lobbing too many softballs. No one asked about trailers with formaldehyde for those made homeless by the fires. And the media seemed to be giving Johnson all day to wax on and on about FEMA’s greatness.

Of course, that could be because the questions were asked by FEMA staffers playing reporters. We’re told the questions were asked by Cindy Taylor, FEMA’s deputy director of external affairs, and by “Mike” Widomski, the deputy director of public affairs. Director of External Affairs John “Pat” Philbin asked a question, and another came, we understand, from someone who sounds like press aide Ali Kirin.

Lol – I wonder is Brownie still working behind the scenes? You have to wonder whose idea this was and why they thought they would not get caught!

81. marisacat - 26 October 2007

I don’t thnk there is any reason or evidence to think that FEMA is anything but what it was two years ago.

I always read about and sometimes post on the CA fires… but I would never compare it to Katrina…. 3000 homes vs 300,000 homes. Flood v fire. Considerable difference in land mass affected… and so on. The list is long.

And despite bad management for almost a hundred years (officially, total fire suppression is the rule – this thwarts nature) again, we do this every year, several times a year. The same entities are involved over and over again… To some large measure, we do know the response game.

So, there is no reason to think that FEMA is anything other than a republican agent for denial of peoples’ needs.

Bush came to CA specifically to get a bump. Arnold rides his strange goosestepping ‘green am i’ neo con revolution.

About it.

82. sabrina - 26 October 2007

I agree re FEMA, but to use fake reporters is crossing a line even for an agency totally under the thumb of the Bush administration. It’s not unusual for the Bush administration to do so, but this was so blatant.

I wonder if the usual disaster vultures have figured out to make a profit from this tragedy.

I agree too that there is no comparison to Katrina. We really don’t even know that whole story, how many died etc. It was a horror and should caused the entire administration to be removed from office.

Just saw a report that police shot a man they suspected of being an asronist. Not much info on why he was a suspect.

83. marisacat - 26 October 2007

All I meant is that the government, state and federal, is USING a non related incident (Ca wilfires – a cyclical disaster) to look good.

Won’t wash. But will fly for a while as PR. Vautned Qualcomm is looking ragged too. ‘Security” not sure if that is police or what, turned in for deportation.

I just don’t see any reason to be surprised at what this government (and the next and the next) does.

They shot a suspected arsonist in an unrelated incident (of suspected attempt to set a fire) a few days ago, think that is the one.

84. marisacat - 26 October 2007

soemone popped me this diary at Dkos. “Secret” list of whistleblowers revealed.

Gotta love the House Judiciary under the Dems. Secrecy is ON THE TABLE, impeachment is OFF THE TABLE.

85. antihegemonic - 26 October 2007

FEMA is hegemonic.

Now Texans want to keep prisoners in tents:


86. antihegemonic - 26 October 2007

A South Carolina candidate for Congress engaged in sexual activity with a young girl less than ten years old.


87. marisacat - 26 October 2007

a former candidate, who ran unsuccesfully in 2000. Kind of different.

To be blunt, all manner of slugs and slime in politics.

88. antihegemonic - 26 October 2007
89. moiv - 26 October 2007

Now Texans want to keep prisoners in tents:

Aside from the fact that tents for Smith Co. inmates are off the table, this idea is nothing new. South Texas sheriffs have tried the same thing, and under Gov. Bill Clements, the state prison system did it in the mid-80s. There were huge 20-man white tents all around the front of the main Walls Unit in Huntsville, until Federal Justice Wayne Justice (not a typo) put a stop to it.

But that was then, this is now, and today every sheriff wants to be Joe Arpaio when he grows up.

90. marisacat - 26 October 2007

thanks moiv.

aunti hege / louisianagirl / pointecoupeedemocrat is a little slow on the uptake.

When not selling John Breaux or sucking the Dem party tit.

91. BooHooHooMan - 26 October 2007

[chomp chomp chomp on the Cajun Corn]

92. moiv - 26 October 2007


93. marisacat - 26 October 2007


charged with rape. A 52 year old grandmother he met in a bar and took to his offices. Some small town councilman, one more insect under the political rock..

but as you are a spammer, you are long gone.

ta ta

94. moiv - 26 October 2007


95. marisacat - 27 October 2007

jesus. Get out a hankie.

Merrill Lynch Weighs Ouster of Top Officer


Directors of the brokerage firm have begun to consider whether to replace the embattled E. Stanley O’Neal, and with whom.

NYT Link

96. moiv - 27 October 2007

OK, I’ll bite. Just how embattled is he?

That means how much are they willing to give him to get him to leave — that’s what the real battle’s all about, no?

97. marisacat - 27 October 2007

“There were Mercedeses and Jaguars pulling out, people evacuating, and the migrants were still working,” said Enrique Morones, who takes food and blankets to the immigrants’ camps. “It’s outrageous.”

Some of the illegal workers who sought help from the authorities were arrested and deported. Opponents of illegal immigration, including civilian border watch groups, seized on news that immigrants had been detained at the Qualcomm Stadium evacuation center as evidence of trouble that illegal immigrants cause.

He said that the agency never abandoned enforcing the border and that agents helped with removals and rescues. Fire blocked some access points to border areas, but Agent Fisher said, “We were very conscious in making sure our border security mission was met.”

Some people have speculated, including on the Web, that immigrants might have set some of the fires, as has occurred with campfires lighted in fields.

The authorities have not given any causes linked to immigration.

Two men, one in San Diego County and the other in Los Angeles, who were arrested on arson charges, accused of setting small fires this week, are believed to be deportable, a federal immigration official said.

The San Diego police detained people suspected of stealing at Qualcomm Stadium. Six were handed over to the immigration authorities when it became apparent that they might be in the United States illegally.

The Border Patrol said the six, and at the group’s request, an American juvenile with them, were returned to Mexico.

The American Civil Liberties Union said it had received reports that people had been denied help at shelters because they lacked proper identification. Officials have been checking identification to prevent people not affected by the fires from taking advantage of the free food, clothes and other services.

“People are dying because we can’t control our border,” Mr. Bilbray said. “That’s what they should be screaming about. Anyone who knows the land and the illegal activity in that rugged terrain knows there was no way we would avoid deaths in this.”

Wayne A. Cornelius, a political scientist at the University of California, San Diego, who studies border questions, said that if the past was a guide there would be more friction over the fires and their effects on illegal immigrants.

“San Diego likes its illegal migrants as invisible as possible,” Mr. Cornelius said. “So whenever something happens that calls attention to their presence, it is fodder for the local anti-immigration forces.” [snip]


98. marisacat - 27 October 2007


LOL they don’t even hide the lede, the very next story on him is:

The Price of Any Departure Will Be at Least $159 Million


Merrill Lynch’s directors may be weighing E. Stanley O’Neal’s future, but one thing is already guaranteed: at least a $159 million payday if he steps down.

99. marisacat - 27 October 2007

There is a punch line… the board is considering, as replacement, a Mr Fink of BlackRock.

Gotta love money people. They are just so fun.

100. moiv - 27 October 2007

If the parachute is all that golden, I wish to hell they’d fire me.

101. BooHooHooMan - 27 October 2007

Atop the Rec List of the great dailykos, America’s finest liberal blog and divorce counseling website for “mommys bodybuilders, political junkies and wannabee writers”. …And I’m just quotin the author’s profile!. I’m sorry. I’ll put myself in the naughty chair.

What gullibalistas can be punked and owned so easily by this kind of turdplay??? LOL.

My husband is leaving me.
by Strawberrybitch
Fri Oct 26, 2007 at 08:25:01 PM PDT

It’s been 10 days since he got back from Iraq and he announced to me that after 15 years together and three children, he’s leaving me for a 20 year old Turkish art student he met on the internet. I’ve been waiting for three years for him to get home so we could rebuild our relationship that has been battered by 12 years in the military followed by three years as a contractor repairing ITAS systems for the military in Iraq. I thought finally, we could set aside all the hurt, pain and distance to finally heal.
I know this is a very short diary but Daily Kos has been one of the few things that has helped me maintain my sanity these past three years waiting for him to return and right now I feel more lost and alone than I ever have when he was gone.
I was fortunate enough to get him to go to counseling yesterday and the wonderful woman that had the balls to undertake this trainwreck of a marriage told us that she is putting in 12 hours a day, damned near seven days a week with the overload from near by Fort Lewis. Business is booming for marriage counselers.
If there are any Kossacks with advice for me on how to win him back please let me know.

* Strawberrybitch’s diary :: ::

Tags: Iraq Fallout, personal, Recommended (all tags) :: Previous Tag Versions

Permalink | 214 comments

((((((((Strawberrybitch))))))) (113+ / 0-)

Recommended by:
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“2009” The end of an error

by sheddhead on Fri Oct 26, 2007 at 08:28:03 PM PDT

102. marisacat - 27 October 2007

I thought finally, we could set aside all the hurt, pain and distance to finally heal.

apparently not….

103. marisacat - 27 October 2007

Kosmaniac Dem Lady, MaryCh, noweasels, Mother Mags, Strawberrybitch, BalanceSeeker

so……the diarist rec’d the comment too…???

(whoever it is)

Hug thyself. Sounds like DkosWhacks

104. marisacat - 27 October 2007

just noticed this at Counterpunch

At base, Harman’s proposal seems to be a direct attack on First Amendment rights. No where is this more clear than in the third introductory paragraph (the “where as” section) that provides the context for the action desired. Specifically, this legislation aims at the unregulated nature of the Internet:

“The Internet has aided in facilitating violent radicalization,ideologically based violence, and the homegrown terrorism process in the United States by providing access to broad and
constant streams of terrorist-related propaganda to United States citizens.”

Moreover, Harman is telling the American public, citizens and permanent residents, that they are too dumb to recognize hate speech, demonizing rhetoric, and propaganda, and are so morally immature that they are not capable of knowing when to “blow off” terrorists and their messages designed to incite large scale insurrection

105. Miss Devore - 27 October 2007

“WASHINGTON (AP) — The State Department says it will require some diplomats to serve in Iraq because of a lack of volunteers willing to work at the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad.

Beginning Monday, 200 to 300 diplomats will be notified they have been identified as prime candidates to fill 40 to 50 vacancies that will open next year at the embassy, said Harry Thomas, director general of the Foreign Service.

Those notified they have been selected for a one-year posting will have 10 days to respond. Only those with compelling reasons, such as a medical condition, will be excused from duty, Thomas said Friday.

He said those being sent to Iraq will receive extra pay and vacation time. About 50 diplomats will be needed in Iraq by January, in addition to the current level of 200.

However, those refusing Iraq duty may face disciplinary action up to and including dismissal for failing to uphold their oath to serve the United States and the Constitution, Thomas said.”

Serve the Constitution. Thick irony.

106. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

Somehow I think Harman and the rest are hoping to use it against Code Pink …

107. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

The California Wildfires and the American Social Crisis

The draw-down of National Guard equipment exacerbates the already depleted state of emergency response and firefighting services in the southern California area, long one of the most rapidly growing urban areas in the world.

In San Diego, for instance, the epicenter of the fires with an estimated 1,300 homes and 150 other buildings destroyed, $1 billion in property damage and five people dead, there are only 975 firefighters. They must cover 330 square miles and protect 1.3 million residents, while in San Francisco, 1,600 firefighters protect 850,000 residents living in only 60 square miles.

University of California San Diego professor Steve Erie told the Los Angeles Times that the anti-tax, pro-business policy of local governments in the area had contributed to the disaster. “Developers own most of the city councils,” he said. “In Poway, in Escondido, what they do is put homeowners in harm’s way. They’re able to control zoning processes, and they’re frequently behind initiatives that say no new taxes, no new fire services. It’s insanity.”

The federal government has also failed to meet its responsibilities, despite the lessons of the 2003 wildfires that devastated much of San Diego County. Congress authorized up to $760 million a year for efforts at “fuel reduction”—clearing and removing dead trees and underbrush that in drought conditions catch fire explosively. The Bush administration has chosen to seek appropriations for only about two thirds of that, $500 million a year.

One major factor contributing to the fire disaster is global warming, which underlies the cycle of drought and high temperatures that have made the latest round of wildfires so much more challenging to the firefighters. According to federal statistics, seven of the ten busiest fire seasons in US history have been in the eight years since 1999. Even before the current outbreak, the total number of acres burned by US forest fires in 2007 stood at 8 million, compared to a ten-year average of 5.8 million acres. The 2007 total now seems likely to surpass the record 9 million acres burned last year.

One chilling media report, on CBS television, included an interview with a forest fire expert who cited the growing number of “mega-fires,” those of 100,000 acres or more, which used to be relatively rare, but are now commonplace. The current fire has already burned over 500,000 acres. This official estimated that more than half the forest land in the western United States could be burned out within a few decades because of the growing intensity and frequency of big fires.

The ecological Know-Nothings in the Bush administration, of course, suppressed any discussion of global warming at the federal level for years, and continue to reject any organized international effort to deal with or diminish the impact of the crisis.

What underlies all these factors, however, and is the fundamental cause of the social crisis, is the anarchic and unplanned character of the capitalist system. Housing tracts are built throughout southern California on the basis of the profit considerations of home builders, property developers and Wall Street speculators, not the needs of people for homes or the suitability of the development given the constraints of the natural environment.

The insurance companies, as always in an American disaster, operate in the most ruthless and socially destructive way. After Katrina, they frequently refused to pay for storm damage unless threatened with lawsuits or actually taken to court. There are already reports that the current fires will be used as a pretext for canceling policies or dramatically raising premiums.

The response of a rationally organized, i.e., socialist society to such a disaster would be a serious, well-financed, carefully planned reconstruction, that would take into account the common need for decent housing, as well as natural circumstances and the burden on social infrastructure such as water, sewage and electrical systems. Under the capitalist system, nothing more can be expected than a repetition of the profit-gouging and reckless plundering of nature and human labor that produced the disaster in the first place.

108. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

So very sad

Robin Prosser, a Missoula woman who struggled for a quarter century to live with the pain of an immunosuppressive disorder, tried years ago to kill herself. Last week, she tried again. This time, she succeeded.

After her earlier attempt failed, Prosser wound up in even more trouble after investigating police found marijuana in her home. She used the marijuana to help cope with pain.

That marijuana charge was eventually dropped in an agreement with the city of Missoula, and Prosser had reason to rejoice in 2004 when Montanans passed a law allowing medical use of the drug.

She was a high-profile campaigner for the Montana Medical Marijuana Act, and like others, she was dismayed when the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that drug agents could still arrest sick people using marijuana, even in states that legalized its use.

The ruling came to haunt Prosser in late March, when DEA agents seized less than a half ounce of marijuana sent to her by her registered caregiver in Flathead County.

At the time, the DEA special agent in charge of the Rocky Mountain Field Division said federal agents were “protecting people from their own state laws” by seizing such shipments.

“I feel immensely let down,” Prosser would write a few months later, in a guest opinion for the Billings Gazette published July 28. “I have no safety, no protection, no help just to survive in a little less pain. I can’t even get a job due to my medical marijuana use – can’t pass a drug test.”

Federal prosecutors declined to charge Prosser, but fear spread through the system of marijuana distribution set up in the wake of the medical marijuana act. Friends said Prosser turned to other sources for marijuana, but found problems nearly everywhere she turned.

“Most recently, she had found some people who said they could get her what she needed, but it didn’t go well,” said her friend Jane Byard.

Without the relief that marijuana delivered to her, Robin Prosser killed herself at home last week. She was 50.

Prosser suffered from an autoimmune disease that gave her allergic and dangerous reactions to most pharmaceutical painkillers. So she turned to marijuana. When that was no longer available she had no where else to turn.

109. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

What Does It Mean When Kos Accepts Clinton

A prominent blogger once told me that the Netroots was immune to flattery. He was either lying to me or he was lying to himself. Nobody is immune to flattery. It’s not a bad thing when Hillary Clinton shows up at a blogger candidate forum, but it doesn’t mean that much. Especially if she’s going to stand on stage and defend lobbyists.

As Hillary solidifies her lead (though it’s a long way from over, remember Howard Dean at this time in 2003) leaders of the Netroots are beginning to position themselves not as for Hillary, but as not against Hillary. Back in February Hillary seemed an unacceptable candidate for Markos. Now, some bloggers, worry perhaps that a Hillary victory will leave the Netroots powerless. Others, like Markos, might just believe it’s important to support the Democrat, whoever she is. I’ve met Markos. He’s a nice guy with a lot of integrity. He’s also a Democrat to the core and is likely to strongly support whoever wins the nomination. But Hillary is a bad choice. The primaries aren’t over and there’s no reason to move in that direction.

The other day Patrick Buchanan stated that “A Giuliani victory means right retains power but loses its soul.” Progressives need to recognize the same thing about Hillary Clinton.

Marcos is an operative, and I wish more people would confront that fact.

110. bayprairie - 27 October 2007

sabrina said

Bayprairie, the pushback came mostly from one source. The same person was very defensive of the Dems in another thread last night. I did ask if s/he worked for the Party but haven’t seen him/her since.

yes, pinchecheek’ngum is so obvious he’s probably posting from an IP coming in from domain * dot gov. the lawyerly coyote is more circumspect but is pushing back as well. he’s simply better at it.

doesn’t quite pass the smell test though.

that’s at least two pffers who appear to be democratic party minders “calming the waters” of the threads of the fab honorary texan, señor peeder.

Nothing to see here. (0.00 / 0)

Move along.

by coyote @ Wed Oct 17, 2007 at 16:11:58 PM CDT

111. Arcturus - 27 October 2007

re: the 6 ‘looters’ who were deported . . .

there was an excellent report on this (& the plight of migrant workers in the fires) yesterday on FlashPoints Radio

This is from the San Diego Immigrant Rights Consortium:


Yesterday (Wednesday), the police initiated an immigration enforcement action that was contrary to their policy of not calling in Border Patrol / ICE unless and until they file a formal criminal charge against a person. Police detained approximately 12 evacuees (at least four were children) who they alleged were “looting” donated blankets, food, and toys for the children. The detained evacuees and witnesses reported to us that volunteers were urging all evacuees, some of whom were preparing to return home after two days, to take as much as they could because the evacuees might find their home damaged and might not be able to access food and other important items due to the evacuation and destruction of stores in the area. Taking this to heart, the evacuees in question who were part of the same family, gathered multiple blankets and as much food as they could carry in preparation of returning home. There have been no shortage of donated goods and in fact, the city has asked the good people of the city to stop donating items.

The evacuees were detained by the police for three hours on site without being charged. The police asked the evacuees for their documents. When they presented none, the police called in an outside unit of Border Patrol to conduct an “immigration inspection”. The police never brought any charges against the evacuees. Prior to the arrival of the BP, a Channel 8 cameraman attempted to film the police interaction with the evacuees. One of the officers covered the camera with his hand, pushed it and the cameraman away, and took the microphone from the reporter. When a Spanish-speaking volunteer attempted to intervene to assist the family, one of the officers took her picture with his cell phone to intimidate her. When BP, came they asked the detained evacuees for documents and six of them (plus a 2-year old U.S. citizen child of one of the evacuees) were taken away, held for several hours without food, and deported. They are needless to say devastated.

Yesterday and this morning, both SDPD and BP reported out that the detained evacuees had confessed to “looting” for the purposes of selling the merchandise. AFSC spoke to the evacuees in Tijuana today and they say emphatically that they never confessed to this. There are no witnesses to this alleged confession. Piolin, a national radio personality from LA paraded through the stadium after the incident and congratulated law enforcement for getting rid of looters. All of the local media outlets regurgitated the law enforcement line about looting, despite being advised by witnesses that they had seen something to the contrary. Lots of comments about how we don’t want those people in our country. I heard one BP officer say in defense of the deportation, “Immigrants don’t want these kind of people here representing them.”

After the incident, Kevin Keenan from ACLU spoke to Chief Lansdowne about our concerns about the improper police pass off. He assured Kevin and then later the public in a press statement that the police were not interested in immigration enforcement. Later that night, around midnight, police walked around the stadium from family to family asking for identification and proof of residency in an evacuated zone. One ID was sufficient for a family. The problem of course was that lots of individuals and families could not produce IDs or the ID addresses did not correspond to an evacuated zone and some folks were just plain homeless and had come in for shelter from the air. Those who could not produce the proper IDs were escorted out in the middle of the night. Those who remained were given wrist bands.
. . .

Another half dozen individuals informed us that they had been detained and questioned by police in the parking lot or while exiting the stadium for allegedly looting or taking more than their fair share of free donated items. Families were asked to count heads for all the blankets in their possession. Some families were taking items back to family members who were too scared to come in. In one instance, police put orange cones around a car until it was “cleared.” Towards the end of the day, families with undocumented members were afraid to leave or afraid to take any food or blankets with them for fear of being detained and deported, since they were doing no different than the family deported yesterday. We escorted some of them out.

It should be noted that it was not just immigrants, but other persons of color who were harassed and suspected of looting. An African American woman was harassed for making two trips with a baby stroller filled with items (I witnessed this one). She attempted to register a complaint with the police officer in charge who treated her poorly and refused to process a complaint. We took a written statement. She was so upset by the end of the day and afraid to leave with anything else, that she told me she was headed back to Oklahoma (she had only recently moved). A Filipino volunteer who had been helping people day and night was thrown out for making two trips out to cars, both times to assist people to their cars. The officer threatened to tazer him and charge him with trespassing. When the volunteer coordinator tried to intervene on behalf of the star volunteer, he was pushed out of the way. After the incident he was told not to talk to anyone. We filmed the incident and tried to talk to the volunteer coordinator, but he had recently survived deportation proceedings and was so scared (in part because he did not have his green card on him) that he considered walking away from his job right then and there. Another Latina woman was denied diapers for her baby because she was told there were none. She stepped aside and then watched as a White woman asked for the same size of diapers and was given them. The woman was upset and only successfully acquired diapers when Pedro from AFSC went with her to ask. When I left today, there was a mountain (possibly 1,000 bags) of diapers. There was also a mountain of donated items that could have served 10 times the number of people left in the stadium. The whole afternoon, we watched White evacuees take cases of water and other large loads to their cars without being questioned.

Easy enough for our imaginations to conjure terror in the face of an out-of-control conflagration. Now imagine the terror that leads someone to choose facing/risking that over dealing w/ an of an out-of-control gov’t. One that sees (ala N Klein) this disaster as yet another ‘opportunity.’

112. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

The War in the Media

Ms. Logan, a reporter who risked her life several times in Iraq getting frontline footage, had to deal with a network that was determined to keep some of her most important reportage off the air – on the grounds, as Kurtz puts it, that it was “too raw for a television audience.” The American people may be paying for this war, with the lives of their best youth and their tax dollars, but, according to CBS executives, that didn’t mean they had a right to see what was really going on in Iraq. When Logan filed a report containing some pretty graphic footage, including an account of what the Iraqi “army” was doing to its own people – murdering and torturing Sunnis – producer Rome Hartman kept it off the air, in part because of “editorial concerns.” There was “no room” for Logan’s report, Kurtz tells us: so Logan had it posted on the CBS website, and sent out an email to friends and associates asking them to make sure it got some circulation. It was posted on a website, Mediachannel.org – and was immediately denounced by neocon bloggers, such as professional witch-hunter Michelle Malkin, who claimed CBS had gotten the video from … al-Qaeda! “If it’s not off the Al-Qaeda video, then how did she get footage identical to the one used by Al-Qaeda? This needs to be explained,” insisted Nibras Kazimi. “Was Logan a willing tool or an ignorant fool?” brayed Malkin. CBS spokesperson Sandy Genelius explained the obvious: “Occasionally, identifying a video source could put someone’s life in danger. In that case, we do not identify the source. Such was the case with this video.” Iraqis peddling the same video to al-Qaeda and CBS, which is why, as Genelius put it, “the same video from Iraq often shows up in multiple places.”

Why is this so hard for Ms. Malkin to understand? Because it gets in the way of her attempt to smear as “anti-American” and “pro-terrorist” anyone who tells the truth about what is happening on the ground in Iraq.

In the midst of her report, Logan and crew were told that they were about to be targeted, and, on their way out of the area, a civilian was shot dead in front of them as they ran. What gets Logan – and this author – about the unconscionable charges thrown around by Malkin and her fellow bloggers is that Malkin & Co. have no credibility or standing in this matter. As Logan put it to Kurtz: “Why am I accountable to these f*cking idiots whose lives aren’t at risk?”

113. Arcturus - 27 October 2007

Glad to see you found NAM! The late Chauncey Phillips was involved w/ that project.

y mas:

This afternoon, I spoke with Enrique Morones . . . founder and director of Border Angels. He and other volunteers have been touring rural areas trying to convince immigrant families to evacuate. He reports that there have been numerous instances in which immigrant laborers are being forced to stay working in farms adjacent to evacuated areas. Employers are threatening to dismiss laborers who refuse to work under precarious conditions. This poses a great health risk for them primarily because of the polluted air they are breathing. This was confirmed both in the Union-Tribune article I just mentioned[iii] and an ABC news story.[iv]

I also spoke to Greg Morales from Border Angels and the Mexican American Poets Associaton . . . .. He is the person in charge of receiving food and water donations for immigrants at the historic Chicano Park in the community of Barrio Logan. He reports that authorities are neglecting and in some instances impeding their efforts to bring critical supplies to immigrants in the affected areas. In the past three days, they have loaded about two hundred vehicles full of supplies. Volunteers have been trying to transport these goods to the immigrant communities that need them most. According to Mr. Morales, one of them, Adrián del Río . . . attempted to take these supplies to Potrero, a rural community in the fire zone near the Tecate crossing of the U.S. Mexico Border. Authorites there tried to prevent him from entering and reportedly told him: “why do you want to go into Potrero? There’s nothing but drug dealers there.” I haven’t spoken to Mr. del Río yet but one person told me he was able to make it in there eventually and found many immigrant families in need of supplies (and evacuation).

This morning, volunteers gathering donations at Chicano Park received an unwelcome visit from seven members of the Minutemen. They have also received visits from people accusing them of distributing supplies stolen from other evacuee shelters, something that everybody working there emphatically denied. Volunteers have also been intimidated by police officers who have scrutinized their operation all day. When I asked Mr. Morales what help if any they had received from authorities, he responded: “the only thing we’ve gotten from the government is police harassment this morning, giving us grief for being here.”

114. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

Via a link at Opinion Mill: Charles Peirce:

In fact, it’s long past time for simple ridicule to become the default position on the entire Republican presidential field. Romney is deeply, profoundly, relentlessly silly; he appears to be enrolled in a course in Human Being as a Second Language. Rudy Giuliani gets crazier almost by the hour and, at any meeting of his foreign-policy advisory team, he’s the sanest lunatic in the room. Fred Thompson seems to have been unearthed a week ago in the Valley of the Kings. The second tier is populated by people like Duncan Hunter and Tom Tancredo, neither of whom you would hire to park your car. Ron Paul — an authentic libertarian crackpot — is treated as a serious phenomenon even by people who don’t believe that the U.N. is speaking through the fillings in Katie Couric’s teeth. This past week, we had a general all-hands-on-deck attempt to inflict Huckamania! on the general populace as good ol’ Mike announced his disapproval of Charles Darwin. And then there’s John McCain, who’s spent this entire campaign doing things he’d vowed he’d never do in the last one. I swear to God, they all ought to climb into one little black car and drive into the next debate behind jugglers, high-wire acts, and a parade of circus bears. I cannot remember a presidential field in my lifetime — not even the one that coughed up Mike Dukakis in 1988 — that is as publicly hilarious as this one is. How dare a major political party hand this collection of shills, fakes, loons, and mountebanks on the American people? And one of them is going to win. Jesus wept.

115. marisacat - 27 October 2007

speaking of pushback on HR 1955… this is the quick bio of the Counterpunch writer who pushed back agaisnt Harmon (link at 104):

Col. Dan Smith is a military affairs analyst for Foreign Policy In Focus , a retired U.S. Army colonel, and a senior fellow on military affairs at the Friends Committee on National Legislation. Email at dan@fcnl.org.

116. marisacat - 27 October 2007


seems to me Arcturus, there are more dead bodies to be found at immigrant encampments. The reports of not being released from work are just horrific.

117. marisacat - 27 October 2007

111 – Arcturus

too bad people refuse, absolutely refuse, to see the goosestepping.


Madman – 107


while in San Francisco, 1,600 firefighters protect 850,000 residents living in only 60 square miles.

I am surprised… SF City and County (which is the same) is barely more than 600K and we are on (they say) 49 or so sq miles. The extra quarter of a mil in pop. is the bigger issue…



Miss D – 105

be nice if the administration stopped talking about the Const… all things considered. We might be a tad safer.

118. Miss Devore - 27 October 2007

117–no sooner had you spoken:

“Craig to claim sex sting arrest unconstitutional
ACLU agrees, says senator’s foot-tapping in stall was protected speech”

i wonder if he will lead a wide-stance toe-tapping protest in nationwide stalls. Set his fly on fire.

119. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

Witch School fails to charm town – Community on edge after Wiccans arrive

I’m constantly amazed how little comfort xtians actually get from their superstitions.

120. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

Of course, Reich doesn’t ever admit that he helped the Donklephants GET like this, but still, this sums them up pretty well:

To some extent, the major Democratic candidates for president appear to agree. They are unanimous in their pledge to roll back the Bush tax cuts. That means that the wealthiest Americans, who are now taxed at a marginal rate of 35 percent, would go back to paying the 38 percent marginal rate they paid under Bill Clinton. So far, however, no Democrat has suggested that the nation should raise the marginal tax rate on the richest Americans above that 38 percent, as will probably be necessary if America is to avoid an economic meltdown in the years ahead.

The biggest emerging pay gap is actually within the top 1 percent of all earners. It’s mainly a gap between corporate CEOs, on the one hand, and Wall Street financiers — hedge-fund managers, private-equity managers (think Mitt Romney) and investment bankers — on the other. According to a study by University of Chicago professors Steven Kaplan and Joshua Rauh, more than twice as many Wall Street financiers are in the top half of 1 percent of earners as are CEOs. The 25 highest-paid hedge-fund managers are earning more than the CEOs of the largest 500 companies in the Standard and Poor’s 500 combined. While CEO pay is outrageous, hedge-fund and private-equity pay is way beyond outrageous. Several of these fund managers are taking home more than a billion dollars a year.

At the very least, you might think that Democrats would do something about the anomaly in the tax code that treats the earnings of private-equity and hedge-fund managers as capital gains rather than ordinary income, and thereby taxes them at 15 percent — lower than the tax rate faced by many middle-class Americans. But Senate Democrats recently backed off a proposal to do just that. Why? It turns out that Democrats are getting more campaign contributions these days from hedge-fund and private-equity partners than Republicans are getting. In the run-up to the 2006 election, donations from hedge-fund employees were running better than 2-to-1 Democratic. The party doesn’t want to bite the hands that feed.

If the rich and super-rich don’t pay their fair share, the middle class will get socked with the bill. But the middle class can’t possibly pay it. America’s middle class is under intense financial pressure. Median wages and benefits, adjusted for inflation, have been going nowhere for 30 years; health costs are soaring (employers are quickly shifting co-payments, deductibles and premiums to their employees), fuel costs are out of sight, the prices of the houses occupied by the middle class are in the doldrums.

What’s fair? I’d say a 50 percent marginal tax rate on the very rich, meaning those earning over $500,000 per year. I’d also suggest an annual wealth tax of one-half of 1 percent on the net worth of people holding more than $5 million in total assets. Can’t be done, you say? Well, the highest marginal tax rate under Republican Dwight Eisenhower was 91 percent. It dropped under John Kennedy to the 70 percent range. You say the rich will leave the country rather than face a marginal tax of 50 percent? Let them, and take away their citizenship.

If the Democrats stand for anything, it’s a fair allocation of the responsibility for paying the costs of maintaining this nation. So far, neither the Democratic candidates for president nor the Senate Democrats have shown much eagerness to advocate this fundamental principle. It seems the rich have bought them out.

121. CSTAR - 27 October 2007

“Moral hazard” is one of those terms invented to provide a patina of intellectual respectability to the dirty task of shifting the burden of risk on to the poor. See for instance The Great Risk Shift by Jacob Hacker (not a great book, but it does provide interesting examples in the area of health insurance).

Risk is one of those marketable entities that are notoriously difficult to correctly price (I am hesitant to say “commodity” because it doesn’t have the obvious properties of a commodity, but it is marketale) . It is one of those quirky little things that can make life unpleasant even for the very rich.

In this regard today’s FT has a report on the financial consequences of the the SoCal fires. Of note is the following excerpt from the article

While exhausted fire crews have battled for days to contain the blazes, some of the state’s wealthier residents had their homes protected by private fire fighting teams, paid for by insurance companies, such as American Insurance Group.

AIG sent specialist units to Malibu and other wealthy areas, where they sprayed fire retardant on houses and vegetation to prevent the blazes spreading. They protected homes belonging to upmarket customers of the group’s private client group, who pay special fire insurance premiums for the service.

Clearly, the concept of moral hazard applies only to the less affluent.

122. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

SCHIP and the Rigged Health Insurance Game

But the huge profits are killing health care. We all know that now. Profit-maximizing insurance companies are bad economics. They make money by denying care, which is a terrible way to try to keep us healthy. (The Rockridge Institute’s white paper on health care security has details.)

And, profit-maximizing health insurance does more harm than that. It is also killing our sense of community. It pits us one against another to get affordable and available insurance policies, strangling the trust and cooperation we need to thrive. If we can’t come together when we need each other most—when we’re sick, injured or dying—without our vulnerability being used as an opportunity to maximize profits, then the U.S. is a hollow shell. The community that makes our nation a family is dead.

Huge health insurance profits are killing community because they are killing Americans. This is obvious. We know that over 100 million Americans are under- or un-insured. They can’t get the insurance necessary to receive adequate medical care. So, millions of Americans remain sick unnecessarily and die prematurely.

But there is a second, more subtle impact of the profit imperative of health insurance that is destroying our communities.

In our current health insurance system, companies can’t maximize their profits unless they turn people away. According to Princeton economist Paul Krugman, in any given year about 80% of us need very little medical care. Some aspirin and cough syrup, more or less. But 20% of us have an accident or illness that requires major medical treatment. That’s expensive.

If everyone in the U.S. were covered by the same insurance company or were part of a nationally organized universal health care plan, then this would all balance out. In any given year, the large number of healthy people would pay for the small number of really sick people. And, the years when you are part of the 20% with large medical expenses, the others will pay for you. Spread out the risk, share the costs, and we all get good health care. We thrive. This is what every other industrialized country in the world does. Except the United States.

123. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007
124. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

I guess this conspiracy theory isn’t verbotten on Kos.


Barns & Noble Suspressing Valerie Plame-Wilson’s “Fair Game”?

PA LEEZE. My local Barnes and Nobles, right in the middle of suburbia, has Jimmy Carter, Walt and Mersheimer and Noam Chomsky all on front tables.

They also have Ann Coulter and those idiots from “Protest Warrior”.

It’s all about who PAYS for a front table. Nothing to see here. Move on.

125. marisacat - 27 October 2007

when I first read of the paid for front tables at B*N and whoever else… I assume that also means window displays are paid for as well as the book racks facing the Front Door.

One of the good things about old time non chain book stores was the staff input- in display tables and in house Best Seller lists, etc..

SO, we should assume the Wilson/Plame publisher did not pay the premium?


126. CSTAR - 27 October 2007

Talking about old-time non-chain bookstores I was saddened to find a few weeks ago that the old Cody’s on telegraph ave is no more, after their SF venture failed. There is still a Cody’s somewhere else in Berkeley, but I was told by Moe’s daughter next door at her bookstore that it was not quite the same as the old one. To be quite clear, she urged me twice to pay them a visit, but no thanks. That part of Berkeley, has become too gentrified I’ve been told.

127. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

Co-op advertising is one of the MOST important things in any chain book or music store. Employee choice things are only if there is left over room, and generally away from the front door.

128. marisacat - 27 October 2007

CSTAR… I loved the old Cody’s… I have many many paperbacks tht I bought there… anthropology and history. Several on the early conquered Americas.

It was a sad day when it closed, esp as it was near Moe’s. Noe’s is where I got my copy of Nancy Cunard’s “Negro” that I got down off a shelf once, to read again, when I was so appalled at how ignorant the Koswhacks were/are about all the things that bedevil America.



One thing I can say for my local video store, it is true the racks that face the cash registers (where people walk past coming in and stand and look at as they wait to check out) are def co-op adverts/placemtn… but there is a decent rack of staff selections, place right at the break in the store between first run video releases and the Foreign, Cult, Mystery and Horror fims. And LOL you def get a different film buff back there.

A few years ago when it was clear we were down for the count, no easy, short run of authoritarianism and repression, i went there to rent everything by Fassbinder… and think but for the very most obsure they had everything. Fassbinder and Germany seemed a good study moment… LOL


129. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

I was pretty surprised when I saw a huge stack of Walt and Mersheimer’s “The Israel Lobby” on a front table surrounded by books by Jimmy Carter, Chomsky, Paul Krugman (don’t know how he feels about being in that crowd), Susan Faludi, and Naomi Klein. It was like a big leftist (or rather two paleocons with a leftis chorus line)smack in the face as soon as you walked through the door.

Plame’s book is also lurking about the front. No hiding it.

Now on first glance, this would seem to indicate that Barnes and Nobles is well disposed to the left but wait.

Mersheimer (University of Chicago), Krugman (NY Times and Princeton), Chomsky (MIT), etc. are first rate intellectuals.

On the other hand, there are dozens of (almost unreadable) books by people I’ve never heard of with no credentials at all warning of “The Islamic Menace” and very few books by left wing nobodies.

130. Miss Devore - 27 October 2007

one gets a vibe seeing the front table stuff, and usually avoids, unless there happens to be a book one is looking for, no?

a lot of readers don’t “shop” for books without something in mind, I think.

I read about 12 books my last 2-week vacation and indulged most of the genres I like, but out of the 3 book purchases I made during that period, the 2 real-crime books were the biggest disappointment. and neither were high-profile crimes; I choose one because it promised to look into the impact on the criminal’s family–which is something I am always curious about–but it was quite banal.

I grew up on The Boston Strangler and In Cold Blood for crime, and it’s tough to top them.

131. marisacat - 27 October 2007

I love ”True Crime’… and it is true, almost all are disappointments. Banal and often badly written.

I loved the old crime magazines of the 50s and 60s.

132. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

well, the management of B&N does lean left, but they lean toward the dollar first, and Regnery and the other winger publishers spend TONS of money on co-op advertising.

133. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

and Regnery and the other winger publishers spend TONS of money on co-op advertising.

I once got caught moving the Jerome Corsi book on John Kerry (UInfit for Command) to the fiction section.

That’s when the swiftboating of Kerry actually made me angry. When I realized he wasn’t going to stand up for himself, I got over it.

134. Miss Devore - 27 October 2007

I tried to read the hagiography on Kerry, but I couldn’t even make it to vietnam. he resembles hillary in that the ambition side has robbed them of personality.

135. marisacat - 27 October 2007

I had to wait for the Newsweek “book” their magazine round up of the election for the moment i had anticipated….

They quoted poor Edwards post election when he learned of Kerry in Paris, meeting with S Vietnamese political affiliates of N Vietnam. Apparently he [nearly] screamed, he met with TERRORISTS?

So tired of the stupid running. But I got a really good laugh out of that one. Poor white Southern boy, out in thw big big world. Bigger than some jury of yahooos, that is for certain.

136. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

Poor white Southern boy, out in thw big big world.

Do you know his father actually worked in a mill?

137. marisacat - 27 October 2007

LOL I have always been entertained by the party affiliation in the Edwards household. Father was white souterhn dixiecrat, til he got a promotion at the mill, then Republican to identify iwth management. Son claims to have gone Democrat, somehting to do with Vietnam. LOL Something vague!

So they say. choking on the cotton dust from the mill…

138. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

Wow. From a mill worker father to a high priced lawyer to running for president.

You know, sometimes I think there are almost “two Americas” and Edwards is the guy to bridge them.

139. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

Antiwar March a Manipulation

What it really looked like

140. marisacat - 27 October 2007

as in, no one — or ws that the tag end of the march?

Where were you? Manhattan?

141. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

as in, no one — or ws that the tag end of the march?

It was the usual Manhattan UPFJ route, from 23rd Street down to Foley Square. It’s a weekend, so the cops barricade Broadway all the way and just rope the whole street off for the marchers.

It was also raining so it was very sparsely attended. You had clumps of a few dozen people, then a lot of empty space, then a few clumps of a few dozen people, then a lot of empty space and so on.

Maybe 2000 people. Last April the same route drew over 100,000 people.

You get ot the end and everybody sets up their tables.

You had:

1.) The usual Marxist parties hawking newspapers
2.) The major anti-war organizations (UFPJ, Code Pink, Answer, etc.)
3.) 9/11 Truthers
4.) A couple of Ron Paul supporters
5.) A couple of Obama supporters
6.) A couple of Hillary supporters
7.) Maybe 3 or 4 right wingers trying to do the usual thing of provoking fights by shoutng abuse from behind police barricades. It didn’t work because there were 50 cops and 50 UFPJ Marshalls blocking them off.

All in all the same old shit with few numbers.

142. marisacat - 27 October 2007

well I am nto surprised…

I have not seen film yet of the march here (dropped out this afternoon) but did see some still shots someone sent of Cindy Sheehan marching … and crrying her campaign logom (good one, I think, fist iwth a peace sign on the wrist).

There is no political partner for the anti war…many groups co-opted, etc (as I see it) and unlike Vietnam era, it stands alone.

Some day there may come a poor peoples’, workers’, immigrants’ rights, anti war movement in the nation, but it does not exist now.

143. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

What I think:

In 2002 and early 2003 these big permitted anti-war marches served a puprose. They broke the “united we stand” mentality that came out of 9/11 and very loudly said “a lot of people dissent”.

I distinctly remember the pro-Palestinian (and other issues) march in April of 2002 in DC. The fact that there could be tens of thousands of people in the streets that soon after 9/11 sent a clear message. The media didn’t cover it, at all, barely mentioned it.

I also remember the huge February 15th march in NYC in 2003, Gigantic, over 100,000 people in the 10 degree cold. It was violently supressed by the police.

But what happened in 2005. You had Cindy Sheehan and Katrina. Both stripped Bush of his aura of legitmacy. In September of that year you had what might have been the biggest anti-war march of the past few years in DC but it had no affect.

Because once you get past the idea that “it’s OK to dissent, then where do you go”. For most people, it’s an internal thing. You know you can’t influence what the government does but you still reserve the privilage of hating it. Those early marches said it was OK to hate it, something you can easily express by showing up on a Saturday and carrying a sign.

But to really have an affect, you need to do more. You need to disrupt, risk getting beaten up or going to jail. Medea Benjamin does this for a living. Ann Wright is retired and has a military pension. etc.

These people have an effect because they do it 24/7. Most of us can’t, simple as that.

144. Hair Club for Men - 27 October 2007

Interesting question.

What if the San Francisco march had been successful beyond anybody’s wildest dreams and caused so much disruption they had to bring national guard troops back from Southern California and the fires?

That would have been a bad thing, horrible. There are (not many but some) times you want to get out of the way and actually let the government work.

Of course there was never any danger that would happen. But it would have been rather symbolically powerful (and destructive) had it been.

145. marisacat - 27 October 2007


I agree with that… it is just common sense really.

I really support the b lockading of congressional offices, esp on home turf. To me this is strategic and operational. The Democrats are the problem, esp for a left of the dial voting electorate.

I much enjoyed the blockading of the Doris Matsui offices in Sacto. LOL And if anyone wants to bitch and moan aobut South Seas Pearls, she has the finest in the congressional line-up, that i have seen. And I am sure hers are “gifts” from off shore supporters in Australia or HKong or Tokyo.

The government rolls on, no matter the presidential approval numbers or the crashing approval ratings for the Democratic congress.

The endorsements for Hillary roll in from people who have presumed to care for specific causes for years.


146. Madman in the Marketplace - 27 October 2007

Some day there may come a poor peoples’, workers’, immigrants’ rights, anti war movement in the nation, but it does not exist now.

Mohawk Warriors Unite with Zapatistas at Encuentro

TUCSON, Arizona: Mohawk Warriors joined in solidarity with Subcomandante Marcos and the Zapatistas at the Gathering of Indigenous Peoples of América. They quickly learned that one factor is the same for indigenous peoples all over the world: corporations intent on seizing the land, minerals and water have no regard for their lives or rights.

Rarahkwisere, Mohawk Warrior, said the Zapatistas’ encuentro, or gathering, made it clear to him that the same thing is happening to indigenous peoples all over Turtle Island.

Zapatismo in Spanish Harlem
The Movement for Justice in El Barrio, Inspired by the Zapatista Other Campaign, Brings New York Communities Together to Fight Gentrification

Over thirteen years since their famed uprising in the southeastern Mexican state of Chiapas, the Zapatistas’ words continue to reverberate throughout the world. Last Sunday, October 21, they echoed from East Harlem and throughout New York City at the first ever “NYC Encuentro for Humanity and Against Gentrification.”

Billed by hosts Movement for Justice in El Barrio (MJB) as “…a way of sharing developed by the Zapatistas as another form of doing politics: from below and to the left,” at least 15 different organizations working against gentrification from throughout the city in addition to observers from groups based in Rhode Island, Connecticut, New Jersey and Pennsylvania came to MJB’s East Harlem seeking to create “…a place where we can all speak, we will all listen, and we can all learn.”

147. marisacat - 27 October 2007

I agree madman… there are glimmers.

AND in the big spring of 06 immigration marches, we saw another seed: Asians came out here in San Francisco and joined in. There was discussion of the local numbers of Irish who are illegals… and so on.

There is hope… but it will take a long while I think. Just as the country will fall apart in sections.. much of it hidden from other parts of the country. As is poverty, abandonemtn and despair now…

148. marisacat - 27 October 2007

SF Gate/SF Chron on the march today, and some roundup on the national marches.

149. earth to meg - 27 October 2007

One of the coolest things about the Telegraph Avenue Cody’s was that nonfiction table right in the front as you walk in the door. They always had the latest stuff on econ and politics from progressive perspectives. And their sociology section was huge. The Fourth Street Cody’s – not so great. It is very upscale, and it’s pretty discombobulating in there, the layout just isn’t that user-friendly. ~ “Last Man Out” presentation November 1 at the Grand Lake Theatre in Oakland, Cindy Sheehan will be there.

150. marisacat - 28 October 2007

earth to meg

Not sure I was ever in the Fourth St Cody’s… last I was on that street was probably 12, 15 years ago for brunch lunch drinks. Seemed to be what it was good for – tho I remember nothing special about any of it..

Yes the old Cody’s was very accessible, wonderful to shop in…

151. marisacat - 28 October 2007

new thread…


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