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Just a thread (what else is new?) [UPDATES] 12 November 2007

Posted by marisacat in California / Pacific Coast, Culture of Death, DC Politics, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter, San Francisco, U.S. Senate, WAR!.

Ocean Beach

Ocean Beach…

Just some links for anyone interested:

 Sfist.com latest round up [snip]

Your Oil Spill Weekend Roundup

So…ugh. Birds died, gastronomic seasons were delayed. What’s more, it hasn’t even been a week, and already some of your favorite local and national politicos are personalizing the spill, more than ready to point old, spotty white fingers elsewhere. (RIP, acts of God.) How very helpful. Except not really.

Anyway, oil-spill points of interest that happened over the weekend:

— ^&*#%^&*#!: Crab season delayed.

— “Something went terribly wrong,” obvious’d Senator Barbara Boxer (Can it, Babs.)  ::snip::


The ZunaSurf people… it seems to be approaching, hitting Pacifica, which had previously not been hit.  So far it si fumes and dead birds. [I am having problems with their site, it shuts itself down on me, but many good entries]

Also this Live Journal site, Nature abhors a Vacuum… which has such a lovely sort of peripatetic SF sweetness about it… and a nice note about what he might wear to the Obama Wednesday night appearance here… 😉


Marin Independent Journal… most recent is a story on…. cleaning birds.

So far, the Coast Guard is reporting that only birds have been hurt by the spill, which has caused the closure of all beaches in Marin County. Dead birds, heavily matted with toxic oil, are turning up throughout Marin. WildCare’s director of animal care Melanie Piazza says it will only get worse as birds get hypothermic, stop eating and eventually die.

“It’s scary. What we’re seeing is heart-wrenching,” Piazza said. “The hard part is the waiting. We have people out scouting the shorelines and there are so many birds still out in the water. No one wants to just sit there and watch the suffering.”

I have thought that now that the ship is being identified as “Hong Kong owned”, with what is described as a “Chinese crew” (not very specific) and the early chatter is that the officers on the ship are at fault (who knows, and supposedly the NTSB and other reports will take months), I suspect we will soon [be allowed to] see dead floating sea lions and other mammals. 

I think that is what really pissed me off, hiding the film of the dead or dying sea lions at some little cove, Thursday dawn.


Plus you know, everything else in the world.

Madman posted this at the end of the last thread.  Remember:  Blood for Oil.  Or they will settle just for your blood, forcibly drawn from your body.  And you probably just filled the gas tank and emptied your wallet……

Madman in the Marketplace | | |

more out of control police powers:

• As more and more states are now allowing police officers to forcibly extract blood of DWI suspects, the New Jersey State Supreme Court recently took the practice a step further. The court ruled that not only may police forcibly draw blood, they may use extreme force in doing so, including force that inflicts permanent physical damage on the suspect.

Less and less autonomy.  Fewer rights…  Can’t clean the beaches (Muir Beach man cited for cleaning beach) and can’t refuse intrusive, invasive extraction of so called “evidence”…


This too posted by Madman at the end of the last thread:

California Democratic Party to Consider Censuring Senator Feinstein

A resolution has been created to censure Senator Feinstein for her outrageous votes in the last two weeks as a member of the judiciary committee. There are many other votes that she has taken that have made many of us wonder when she became the Joe Lieberman of the West. If you know any people who are E-board delegates and who will attend the CDP E-board meeting this coming weekend, please contact them and ask them to vote for the resolution which follows:

Whereas the Democratic Party stands firmly against racism in any of its manifestations and for gender equality, and Senator Dianne Feinstein voted to confirm Judge Leslie Southwick for a seat on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit despite his record of clear racism and gender discrimination; and

Whereas the Democratic Party abhors torture and stands firmly against its use by the United States at all times and places, yet Senator Feinstein voted to confirm Judge Mukasey as United States Attorney General – thereby elevating to the highest position in law enforcement a men who refuses to renounce the right of the President to resort to torture, or to recognize waterboarding as a form of torture; and

Whereas these examples are far from the only instances where Senator Feinstein, after seeking and securing the support and endorsement of the California Democratic Party, has worked to oppose the policies and principles of our party.

Therefore be it resolved that Progressive Caucus of the Democratic Party of California expresses its disappointment at, and censure of Senator Feinstein for ignoring Democratic principles and falling so far below the standard of what we expect of our elected officials.


UPDATE, 6:12 pm

This from bayprairie was trapped in Moderation for the last thread (very sorry!):

bayprairie |

The port of San Francisco stopped offloading and onloading containers in 2005.

that little java app at http://www.boatingsf.com has the ship exiting the port of oakland.

Port of Oakland

One of the main limitations to growth was the inability to transfer containers to rail lines, all cranes historically operating between ocean vessels and trucks. In the 1980s the Port of Oakland began the evaluation of development of an intermodal container transfer capability, i.e. facilities that would allow trans-loading of containers from vessels to either trucks or rail modes. The Port retained VZM, Korve Engineering and Earth Metrics to perform engineering and environmental studies to allow detailed engineering to proceed.[1] In 1987, on behalf of the Oakland port Commission, Allen Broussard led a group of 72 lawyers and city officials on a 3-week long trip to China meeting the Mayor of Shanghai, Jiang Zemin (Shanghai is twinned with San Francisco)[2]

Completion of the resulting rail intermodal facility occurred in 2002. That brought the cumulative investment of port expansion to over 1.4 billion dollars since 1962, half of which was comprised by the intermodal facility. In the early 2000s, the new intermodal rail facility along with severe congestion at the Ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach caused some trans-Pacific shippers to move some of their traffic to the Port of Oakland (especially if the final destination is not in Southern California but lies farther east). Also, the Port is now reaping the benefits of investment in post-panamax cranes, dredging, and the transfer of military property, which has now been used for expansion.

Port of SF docks are outside the bridge. Port of oakland, inside. i would assume this a new type of container traffic inside the bridge. if so, might it be an indicator of a five year spill.

Nov 12, 5:45 PM


 Evening news has film of Bolinas, where residents took to the water last Wednesday night under cover of dark to try to lay down a boom to protect the inlet.  It failed.  A professionally laid boom also failed and was discarded on the beachBolinas residents just “surged” to the beach today to clean up.  And let me say, it was filthy AND sudsy.

  from 40,000 feet

The Fire Chief at Bolinas, a woman, said she is always told “how valuable Bolinas is”…… but then this.

NOW the skimmers have picked up so much oil at the water level that they are becoming a danger.

Think I saw volunteer cleaners at Emeryville in the East Bay, just drenched in oil.  Not droplets, drenched.

 Way to go Brownie, except Brownie is not around.

Pelosi, Miller, Tauscher, Eschoo (the beloveds, I sure did not see any E Bay Black faces) did stand up comedy at Crissy Field (at the San Francisco Marina District) today:  Pelosi tours oil-soaked SF waterfront

  photo from SJ Mercury News

Oh yeah, for diversity, they had Mike Honda, the rep from Campbell along.


UPDATE, 11:00 am Tuesday

Cosco Busan:

Cosco Busan SF Bay November 7
Cosco Busan SF Bay – Bay Bridge – November 7 2007


    Angel Island
Angel Island – San Francisco Bay – November 7


UPDATE, 12:10 pm Tuesday

CBS news radio reported that tarbells have reached the protected beach at Treasure Island.  Military installation, EPA is cleaning the beach.



1. marisacat - 12 November 2007

Official word is 400 birds dead. I had read an early assessment that for each dead bird in hand, at sea is 10 – 100 more. So do the math.

2. Madman in the Marketplace - 12 November 2007

oh, and who knows how many at beaches and coves they haven’t gotten to?

The piece w/ the little girls trying to bring their raises an interesting question, in this age of Meercat Manor and endless reruns of Animal Planet and all of the Disney/Pixar anthropomorphic entertainment: how many kids are going to be really radicalized by this horrible crime, this indifference, toward creatures that they have learned to love and treasure?

3. moiv - 12 November 2007

I just heard a news clip from SF on Nova M news, with some glurlurk reassuring us that, while 369 birds are reported dead, “we don’t know that they are all oil birds.”

I guess the rest must have belonged to some avian suicide cult.

4. wu ming - 12 November 2007

i supect it will not be insignificant, madman. i remember reading children’s books in the 70s about how we had polluted our planet so bad that all the people and animals had to escape in a rocket into space, and really being affected by it.

i suspect their experience of global warming’s effects for the rest of their lives will be more influential, though,

5. marisacat - 12 November 2007

this is Madman’s link from the last thread:

Kucinich at Ani diFranco concert

and Gore Vidal on Kucinich in The Nation

6. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007

Kucinich is like the only short Yugoslav in history. The typical Croatian is like 6’4″. Dennis drew the short end of the straw.

Didn’t Ani DeFranco support Nader in 2000?

7. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007

Ani DiFranco looks really good in that clip…

Is she straight or gay? I can never quite remember.

8. melvin - 12 November 2007

Good writeup of events at the port of Oly. Bringing the war home:

Protests spread beyond port into downtown Olympia

Chaos erupted Saturday in multiple areas of Olympia as protests of military-cargo shipments moved from the Port of Olympia to downtown and an Interstate 5 entrance. At least 12 people were arrested, and protesters vowed to continue their resistance.
Paramedics treated several protesters hit with pepper spray, including one young woman screaming in pain. The line of protesters at the port’s gates, some wearing goggles and other protective gear, withstood several sprays. Officers also picked them up and threw them away from the road they had blocked.

Protesters decry treatment

After being pepper-sprayed, Olympia Port Militarization Resistance member Eran Rhodes said, “My face is on fire right now because I was holding a peace sign. Not a single attempt of an arrest was made. They came in beating people up.”

OlyPMR member Matt Lester also criticized the police tactics.

“If this isn’t fascism, I don’t know what is,” he said.

Protesters appeared to be ready for pepper spray, with a group they call “medics” assisting with eye washes of vinegar, Maalox and water.
The protests were part of a weeklong series of demonstrations by the group Olympia Port Militarization Resistance. OlyPMR has been protesting the use of the port by the USNS Brittin, which landed at the port Monday to unload equipment that was used in Iraq by the 3rd Brigade, 2nd Infantry Division (Stryker Brigade Combat Team).

Saturday’s actions by police came a day after protesters were able to halt two trucks from removing military equipment — including a Stryker — that had been unloaded from a ship coming from Iraq.

Olympia police said the department did not have enough officers available to remove the protesters Friday, and that they were unprepared to physically remove several small children who were among about 40 protesters.

9. melvin - 12 November 2007

Oops. More on OlyPMR, and video, at seattle indymedia.

10. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007

That needs to happen all over the country every day.

11. marisacat - 12 November 2007

there have been great protests up in Washington, Olympia, at Fort Lewis… when the Stryker brigades ship out…

Damnit Janet who used to post at BMT would protest there, with Code Pink mostly.

12. marisacat - 12 November 2007

ooo good one, “Whose port? Our Port!”

Supporters also chanted “Whose Port? Our Port!” and other phrases and provided water to people who had been hit with pepper spray.

13. marisacat - 12 November 2007

sigh.. don’t miss third photo over, far right top row. A counter protester holding a sign:

God Bless ISraeli Bulldozers

with the US and Israeli flag. Just merge the flags and be done with it.

14. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007

sigh.. don’t miss third photo over, far right top row. A counter protester holding a sign: God Bless ISraeli Bulldozers

Always nice when Americans cheer on a foreign government that kills Americans.

15. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007
16. moiv - 12 November 2007

The first pic said it all.

17. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007

50 years ago Harry Bridges could have shut the whole coast down and they would have either had to declare martial law or suck on it.


18. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007
19. marisacat - 12 November 2007

well you know shortly after Bush went in, before 9/11, there was a longshoreman/shipping strike out here. A pretty big one.

I assume now, with anti terrorism / terroristic / kill all who offend you laws, it would be declared a traitorous act, in some way treasonous to the War Effort, the mil and whoever else would move in.

Much less Harry Bridges.

20. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007

More Rachel Corrie. More Harry Bridges. Less Kos.

That’s what we need.

21. Hair Club for Men - 12 November 2007

Same as it ever was.

22. marisacat - 12 November 2007


yes that first one is awful, I went to the large version, working my way thru them, about to open the HC links…

23. melvin - 12 November 2007

Gathered up three of the vids at Truth & Progress, also link there to flickr gallery that is free for use elsewhere, includes victims after being sprayed.

24. marisacat - 13 November 2007

Carl Nolte, SFGate.com recreates the events of Wednesday am, Cosco Busan accident. They too state that what is at sfboatist is largely correct.

25. bayprairie - 13 November 2007

so those two huge turns were not supposed to happen.

i read at mercury news earlier that cota had run aground in 2006.

Most recently, in February 2006, Cota was at the bridge of a bulk carrier ship, the Pioneer, when it ran aground in the mud off Antioch. There were no injuries or spills. He was found at fault by the pilot board, however, and received a letter of reprimand.

26. marisacat - 13 November 2007

oh yes, it was fully grounded, I remember it. But wtih no damages and no injuries….

Second piece in the chron… and boy i hope that “seven” is a typo:

As of Monday, seven miles of containment boom had been deployed to confine and collect oil in the water.

About 1,000 people were working on the crisis. More than 20 beaches and lagoons from Point Reyes to San Carlos have been fouled, and hundreds of oil-slimed birds have either died or injured.

27. wu ming - 13 November 2007

the longshoremen stood with the antiwar protesters in oakland in 2003, as i recall. jerry brown ok’d the police to shoot rubber bullets at them.

it’s a pity they didn’t shut the whole west coast down in retaliation.

if you want a general strike, the longshoremen are a good way to start.

28. bayprairie - 13 November 2007

that tug, revolution, wasn’t just escorting either

It was also learned Monday that the Cosco Busan, which dumped 58,000 gallons of bunker fuel into San Francisco Bay after hitting the Bay Bridge, was attached to a tug boat at the time.

The tug boat, an added layer of safety that was not required, apparently was not asked – or may have been unable – to steer the vessel clear of the bridge in time.

29. marisacat - 13 November 2007

the longshoremen stood with the antiwar protesters in oakland in 2003, as i recall.

jerry brown ok’d the police to shoot rubber bullets at them. — wu ming

Yes he did… just as I believe Villaraigosa green lighted the McArthur Park events of May 1 this year.

30. marisacat - 13 November 2007

No matter how many times I read this description, it simply blows the mind:

A new video made of the ship’s course, based on radio signals emitted from the transponder on board, shows it veered dramatically to the left just before it approached the Bay Bridge from the south, then sailed roughly parallel to the bridge before taking a hard right turn and slamming into the bridge support.

The video is posted at http://www.boatingsf.com.

31. wu ming - 13 November 2007

makes no sense, even on a foggy day.

then again, nothing else makes sense these days.

32. Intermittent Bystander - 13 November 2007

Ban on fuel sought after SF Bay spill (AP).

Friends of the Earth start petition drive against use of bunker fuel; report includes quotes from anonymous official regarding Cota’s radio communications; and references to recent study on health hazards of particulate emissions.

Bunker fuel also creates problems in the air when burned. Tiny particles of pollution and chemicals released through ship exhaust were linked to the premature death of about 60,000 people with heart and lung ailments in 2002, according to an article published this month in Environmental Science & Technology, the journal of the American Chemical Society.

“If the fuel burned by ships were cleaner, we would prevent a significant number of deaths annually,” said James Winebrake, professor at the Rochester Institute of Technology who co-authored the study.

33. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

the longshoremen are a good way to start.

Get them and the CA nurses together, convince them that environmental damage is all part of the same thing, the same fucked system. Shut down the Cali ports.

Thank you for the Olympia links, everybody. We all know those pics WILL NOT be on the mainstream infotainment. After all, there is a missing white woman, a dictator overseas AND Kanye West’s mom died!

One interesting thing on CNN this morning. The “he’s crazy!” media/party swipe at Kucinich on UFOs seems to be backfiring. A group of former pilots and government officials has called on the US government to re-open an investigation into claims of UFO sightings.

CNN did one of their online surveys, and it’s running HEAVILY toward people who believe that there are UFOs.

34. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

Science fiction author pays a visit to Creation Museum:

Here’s how to understand the Creation Museum:

First, imagine, if you will, a load of horseshit. And we’re not talking just your average load of horseshit; no, we’re talking colossal load of horsehit. An epic load of horseshit. The kind of load of horseshit that has accreted over decades and has developed its own sort of ecosystem, from the flyblown chunks at the perimeter, down into the heated and decomposing center, generating explosive levels of methane as bacteria feast merrily on vintage, liquified crap. This is a Herculean load of horseshit, friends, the likes of which has not been seen since the days of Augeas.

And you look at it and you say, “Wow, what a load of horseshit.”

But then there’s this guy. And this guy loves this load of horseshit. Why? Well, really, who knows? What possesses someone to love a load of horseshit? It’s beyond your understanding and possibly you don’t actually want to know, even if you could know; maybe it’s one of those “on that path lies madness” things. But love it he does, and he’s not the only one; the admiration for this particular load of horseshit exists, unaccountably, far and wide. There are advocates for this load of horseshit.

Lots of wonderful snark, with an accompaning photo tour full of more.

35. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

that animation of the ship’s movements is disturbing. Is it just me, or does it look like the tug is chasing that ship? Do tugs supporting a large vessel usually FOLLOW them?

I know nothing about ships, just askin.

36. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Madman I’m sending you the bill for my cracked ribs (minus one) after that #34. ;-p

37. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Chevron Ad Smeared up atop Dailykos frontpage again.
People Power!

38. marisacat - 13 November 2007

one thing that I am getting is that EVEN Thursday – and later – most of the so called responsible parties in this morass thought it could be minimised.

Instead they have a huge immense liability on their hands. More than just the ship liability.

A surfer who was at Aquatic Park Wednesday is now ill. No signs were posted, finally the Dolphin Club (a coterie of regular Bay swimmers) posted signs at Aquatic Park, a small protected beach right in town, near Ghirardelli Sq, where families come regluarly, dog walkers etfc… DC posted signs to not swim, not touch anything..

It seems everyone in charge (and clearly no one was REALLY in charge) just freaked. Easier than closing beaches, posting signs, alerting responsible authorties… and so on.

Gavin was supposed to be with Pelosi for the presser on Crissy Field yesterday. I sure don’t see him in the pics.

We are so well served.



thanks for the snip on banning this oil. Which I am sure is produced at Chevron. one of the sad little things I read when I was poking around about Chevron, Richmond CA and last year’s election and the Dkos Chevron ads, the refinery had recently decided to make all things worse (it is a toxic regurgitator and so is the heavy truck traffic [idling issues] related to the ports in the East Bay)… Chevron recently decided to produce a much cruder filthier to produce oil at the site.

The children, mostly minorities, who live in breathing distance of Chevron already have one of hte highest asthma rates and ER room visit rates…

and so on

so I wonder…

39. bayprairie - 13 November 2007

that animation of the ship’s movements is disturbing. Is it just me, or does it look like the tug is chasing that ship? Do tugs supporting a large vessel usually FOLLOW them?

mercury news reported the cosco butan “was attached to a tug boat at the time”. based on the boatingSF java plot which always shows the tug behind the boat some indeterminate distance, never ahead. i’d speculate the butan had a line rigged from the stern to the tug, for a steering assist if necessary. boat begins a turn, tug runs out a bit and pulls hard in the same direction the stern is moving, and yanks the boat’s ass around to a greater degree than unassisted. i think if the cosco butan was a dead ship under tow it would take many more tugs than one to pull it. havent a clue how many though.

what i still cant get over is the speed of the boat in what’s such a small small space, relative to its enourmous size. i assume thats not accidental and that the slower something that large goes, the less control it has over its movements, especially in turns.

would a strict outbound towing policy, plus additional restrictive navigational regulations on outbound hazardous vessels be a good safety move? ah. but then it would be harder to compete on a price points and transit time in and out, with LA and Long Beach then, wouldn’t it?

At some point that’s going to be what this all boils down to, imho. the interviewees seem to be selling it as human error. But whats about the structure of the regulations concerning navigation of container vessels into, and out of, the port of oakland? what kind of navigational regs sets up something like this to begin with? and why does a pilot, who is evidently complaining about many things, the foggy weather, the radar, the ships instruments, plus with a rookie crew, not just lock the boat down at the port and wait for good visability?

the whole thing stinks, the more i read about it. and i bet its all about pricing as low as possible so they can snag container customers from LA and Long Beach. reads to me like cutting corners on a safety first attitude.

The World Shipping Council offers these rankings of U.S. Ports (containers, not total tonnage), with totals shown in thousands of TEUs (twenty-foot equivilent units):

1. Los Angeles – 4,664 total – 1,022 export – 3,642 import
2. Long Beach – 3,091 total – 723 export – 2,368 import
3. New York – 2,803 total – 838 export – 1,965 import
4. Charleston, SC – 1,250 total – 529 export – 721 import
5. Savannah – 1,124 total – 529 export – 595 import
6. Norfolk – 1,093 total – 460 export – 633 import
7. Oakland – 1,064 total – 548 export – 517 import
8. Houston – 933 total – 483 export – 450 import
9. Tacoma – 931 total – 337 export – 594 import
10. Seattle – 815 total – 329 export – 486 import

The Council notes that in 2003, 83% of the total volume of containerized waterborne cargo moved through the top 10 ports, and 61% through the top 5 ports. Los Angeles/Long Beach accounted for more than 36% of all U.S. containerized imports and exports in 2003.

40. marisacat - 13 November 2007

LA Times (think I will referecne this article if I get thru to the Boxer office – and will mention the sea lions):

In reshaping its focus after 9/11, critics say, the Coast Guard has let its relationships with port users, shippers and fishermen deteriorate. That is because marine safety and environmental response strategies require close cooperation. Anti-terrorism tactics, however, tend to be secretive and rigid.

“It’s changed big-time, in the sense everything now is focused on the war on terror,” said Zeke Grader, president of the Pacific Coast Federation of Fishermen’s Assns.

A decade ago, Bay Area fishermen were counted on by the Coast Guard to help mop up oil spills. Dozens of fishing boats and anglers were certified to deal with spills, Grader said. “It was like a volunteer fire department kind of thing.”

But officials let the program lapse, he said. And when the fishermen approached the Coast Guard to help, they were told not to bother, said Larry Collins, president of the San Francisco Crab Boat Owners Assn.

They hit the water anyway over the weekend after the Port of San Francisco stepped up to get Coast Guard permission. In all, 22 boats have participated since Sunday, dragging big, absorbent pompoms to collect the fuel, Collins said, adding: “We’re getting a lot of oil.”

41. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

They’ve yanked the Chevron ad at DK within the last hour…
Who knows what algorithm they run, but the BullSCHEIZZZA that Markos has no control of what is served up is patently evident as the plop o’ brown yum yum that it is…..

It seems to me they probably run it in the marquis /club spot position for any unique first visit of the day, then back it off for return hits…Chevron’s media buyers certainly aren’t foolish either, they must realize the cultish “disciple” factor attraction as well as the incentive to cheat on page views…Given dope or shall we say “scoop” run out of 29 Broadway…

Markos figures fuck San Francisco Bay.
His servers , patrons, and Hillary-us services are centered in New York. His west coast presence is more powder and puff on a mirror….Remember the flirtation with “moving” and relocating over a year ago??? LOL it wouldn’t look so good if was actually living in the care takers digs at the Clinnton’s…..

42. marisacat - 13 November 2007

It seems to me they probably run it in the marquis /club spot position for any unique first visit of the day, then back it off for return hits…Chevron’s media buyers certainly aren’t foolish either, they must realize the cultish “disciple” factor attraction as well as the incentive to cheat on page views…Given dope or shall we say “scoop” run out of 29 Broadway…

Markos figures fuck San Francisco Bay.

——— BHHM

ugh. That makes a lot of sense. Rigging its appearnce, tho I am totally ignorant of online tech realities.

As for “Fuck the Bay”… he did just that in his last voting, I mean Nov 2006. IIRC people said he [bragged about] voted NO all thru the props. I assume, no matter what he said, he did what Big Dems told him and voted for Arnold.

Achtung! little fella.

argh. The Today Show is discussing “sex with an ex”……….

can we sink lower?

43. marisacat - 13 November 2007

From page 2 of the LAT:

Ron Bare, president of Ocean Blue Environmental Services, one of the Port of Los Angeles’ largest environmental-response contractors, said spills are more easily contained in the twin harbors’ tighter channels than wide-open San Francisco Bay — and insisted the Coast Guard still could be counted on.

“It’s true, they have shifted toward security because it is where the dollars were spent after 9/11,” he said. “But they are still capable.”

Grader, of the Pacific Coast Federation of Fisherman’s Assns., does not agree. He said reports from his fleet indicate that the Coast Guard and the shipping company failed to act swiftly enough to stem the troubles after the massive container ship nudged a tower of the Bay Bridge, ripping a lengthy gash on its port side.

Compared with the 11 million gallons that spilled from the Exxon Valdez, “this one in the scheme of things was fairly minor,” Grader said. “But it was made major because they didn’t get the containment out there in a timely manner.”

By Monday, the spill had tainted beaches nearly all around the bay, and escaped through the Golden Gate to blacken shorelines as far north as Point Reyes National Seashore, far up the Marin County coast. So far, more than 900 birds been found blackened by oil, though 545 have survived with the help of wildlife rescue crews.

Some with inside knowledge of the Coast Guard say it has lost the institutional knowledge to quickly assess spills and react swiftly.

Equipment also is aging. In some regions, the rubber bladders used to store recovered oil are at the end of their service life. Crews are hesitant to use them for fear they’ll burst.

44. lucid - 13 November 2007

The Today Show is discussing “sex with an ex”……….
can we sink lower?

I take it that is rhetorical….

This accident in the bay is just mind boggling. Really, pretty much everything these days is mind boggling. Nice to see that at least there are some people around who take things into their own hands.

45. marisacat - 13 November 2007

SF Chron editorial:

In a meeting with our editorial board Monday, Allen also was forthright about what he did not know – and those unanswered questions include the issue of why Coast Guard investigators did not realize the magnitude of the spill until after 4 p.m. The president of the bar pilots, who went out to investigate, had noted a substantial flow of oil pouring out of the Cosco Busan before 9 a.m.

Also, the report that the Coast Guard turned away a San Francisco fireboat that went out to assist the unfolding disaster seems to defy the claim of an all-out response. [Gavin has popped up with this tidbit -Mcat]

The Ocean Conservancy’s Warner Chabot, who has helped craft oil disaster-response plans, said the key is to get booms into place before the tides and winds start spreading the oil – and time is of the essence.

“If there is one word that applies here it is … containment,” Chabot said, adding that he would like to see a detailed chronology of when and where booms were deployed. “The failure to contain is why we now have 1,000 people cleaning the shoreline.”

46. cad - 13 November 2007

It’s only slightly ironic to see all the Dk front pagers demanding CLEAN WATER BILLS, ECO-POWER, GREENGREENGREEN all while that bloody Chevron banner flaps atop the bad ship Kos…

But then Kos lives in the hills, away from the li’l people in the black bay.

47. lucid - 13 November 2007

cad – what is bizarre to me is that one of my main clients has now been reborn as an eco-warrior… This was an owner who I haggled with for 6 years to spend the money on a water filtration system so that we weren’t tossing silver waste down into the sewer system [which is also incidentally against the law]… All of the sudden, it’s our mission to save the planet – no expense is too much. Recycled everything, eco-friendly detergents, no more bottled water or disposable cups. Air filtration systems for worker protection in the shop – etc., etc. I mean, I’m not complaining because everything I suggested eons ago is coming about, but I must ask myself, why the change?

I think it is that ‘Green’ has become marketable – the business community itself realized they could make money from it. It is now a brand. And of course we’ll just be putting a band aid on an oozing, pussing sore rather than treating the infection.

48. marisacat - 13 November 2007

Arnold has suspended all fishing (for human consumption) and crabbing til Dec 1, Executive Order of the gov.

49. marisacat - 13 November 2007

Green washing. As Gore just joined a big VC firm down in Silicon Valley… he will mastermind their Big Old Green Investments…

wooo hoo.

Won’t be affecting, for instance, the massive heavy trucking off the ports. Much of it on 40 and 50 year old freeway ramps…

A side issue in the E Bay ports and the Chevron refinery.

Just to bring up Chevron AGAIN.

50. lucid - 13 November 2007

Arnold has suspended all fishing (for human consumption) and crabbing til Dec 1, Executive Order of the gov.

Hmm – why not spend the extra money to try to stop the spread of the oil before it was too late, instead of absorbing the economic consequences of being incompitent.

51. marisacat - 13 November 2007

BTW, the last two Davos events, people were very excited about Green. Esp the marketing. But preach the mission.

[insert sarcastic tone of voice as you read the above]

52. marisacat - 13 November 2007


oh it seems just everyone fucked up.

Plenty of blame to go around.

53. marisacat - 13 November 2007

This seems a little overly hopeful, but it is from the fellow at Lenin’s Tomb…

[I]t is estimated that some 36 million people took part in 3,000 anti-war protests across the globe in the months leading up to the 2003 invasion of Iraq.

And the momentum has continued to swing against the occupiers of Iraq, who today are in a state of disarray over where to go next.

Yet despite this record, some on the left have raised doubts about the efficacy of the anti-war movement. The radical commentator Alexander Cockburn recently argued in the New Left Review that the US anti-war movement was close to dead, because it had effectively been co-opted by the Democratic Party.

The source of this despair may seem specific to the US, but such sentiments have been expressed in Britain too. Some argue that the movement has got bogged down, having failed to stop the invasions or end the occupations of either Iraq or Afghanistan. ::snip::

54. bayprairie - 13 November 2007

on the lighter side of news today, it appears an earnest investigtion of racism at dkos may have begun.

Yeah, I missed that too. (0 / 0)

I will have to investigate.

by Delaware Dem on Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 10:35:32 AM PST

careful you don’t trip over the sexism, dude.

55. lucid - 13 November 2007

I think the whole ‘brand Green’ thing occurred to me as I started seeing more and more advertisements for green products & massive corporate sponsorship of ‘green events’. Maybe the first I noticed was the whole BP oil campaign 3-4 years back… Global capitalism cannot be green, no matter how hard they sell it. Thus the new ‘green’ illusion is born & we do away with the pesky anti-capitalists and eco-terrorists in one fell swoop!

56. lucid - 13 November 2007

it appears an earnest investigtion of racism at dkos may have begun.

Perhaps I should dust off the whitosphere diary & repost?

57. marisacat - 13 November 2007

Listening to an otter guy on NBC affiliate… the oil outside the Golden Gate now is headed south, very much so, the wind has changed direction (it had been northerly at the time of the spill)… and the otters are south of SF on the coastline.

Pacifica had expected to be hit as they have seen dead birds and had fumes but no discernible oil..

Oh yes, Newsom left town Thursday (local news is confirming.. Way to go Gavin. heckuva job. He got back SUnday night.

58. marisacat - 13 November 2007


makes me think of mashed potatoes investigating white rice.

59. cad - 13 November 2007

San Franciscans are just as prone to political stupidity as any other city. Witness the love for corporate poster boy Newsom.

60. lucid - 13 November 2007

Oh yes, Newsom left town Thursday (local news is confirming.. Way to go Gavin. heckuva job. He got back SUnday night.

Was he having a snortathon in Tahoe?

61. marisacat - 13 November 2007

LOL lucid

i Remember the BP campaigns… what a hoot. The CEO was on Charlie Rose several times to push all of that, years ago.

It got submerged but part of his fall last year, apparently he is gay. Just one more thing. I only caught the edges of his fall at BP as other things were going on.

So much hypcrisy.



oh we are a mess politically. Gavin just drives me esp nuts, I must say. Like Difi decades ago, he too was my district supe.


62. ms_xeno - 13 November 2007

DiFranco called for “safe” states to vote Nader in 2000.

Myself, I always thought that was all a bunch of bullshit. What state is “safe” from the kind of shit we read about here and in other quality mud wallows each and every day ? Vote the candidate of your choice or not. Period.

Never went in for vote-trading, either. Both because it seemed mealy-mouthed to me and untrustworthy.

Speaking of music, every time I see one of Kos’ freshly-annointed Neo-Populists in a wheatfield, all I can think of is k.d. lang. I don’t know why. :p I mean, she can’t even run for office here. She’s on catnip’s side of the border… :/

63. ms_xeno - 13 November 2007
64. lucid - 13 November 2007

Ms_x – is that a scene from the lesbian version of Brokeback?

65. marisacat - 13 November 2007

tarbells have reached a protected, isolated beach at Treasure Island. they have EPA cleaners on the beach.

The beach, even tho at an island in the bay, there is turned away from the oil spill, and IS very protected.

This stuff will get everywhere.

66. ms_xeno - 13 November 2007

lucid, c’mon. Absolute Torch and Twang. I thought you were totally down with them gay folks. Tsk.

BTW, the ILWU (longshoremen) were the folks who organized Powell’s Books, which is the largest non-corporate chain in the region;so far as I know. They just celebrated the 5th anniversary of the successful organizing drive. I was down there during the drive for a May Day march one year and learned a valuable lesson: It’s very good to be surrounded by longshoremen in a demo. Cops are extremely reluctant to rush people their own size.

Meanwhile, Blooooooooo Oregon is still full of twittering mini-fascists whining that Ghandi would never have been tazed or sprayed by the Portland police in a demo because he was A Nice Man and those icky modern malcontents are Not Nice People.

Shit. Maybe I should go back to N.J. “Progressives” my fat Hungarian ass. >:

67. lucid - 13 November 2007

Blooooooooo Oregon is still full of twittering mini-fascists whining that Ghandi would never have been tazed or sprayed by the Portland police in a demo because he was A Nice Man

I guess they forgot that gandhi used to routinely get the shit kicked out of him by South African thugs.

and ms_x… a joke [though I must confess to not being a huge KD Lang fan, but I liked Melissa Etheridge when I was 13, does that count? ;)]

68. ms_xeno - 13 November 2007

To forget, lucid, they’d have to have known it in the first place.

As I told mr_xeno last night when I caught him reading that drivel, we live in a city full of ignorant hicks who think they’re better than their kin in Alabama because they’ve been to a Decemberists concert and have eaten sushi.

Maybe they need to have their arms broken in a DUI while the cops extract their blood. Ho hum.

69. lucid - 13 November 2007

Speaking of which, doesn’t that DUI crap blatantly violate like 3 amendments? [The 4th, 5th and 8th] Even in this ridiculous SCOTUS, I don’t see how that would hold up [in fact I think even Scalia would vote down that law].

70. aemd - 13 November 2007

Other things of interest tappin’ at the window…IOZ on the orange view of the “moderates” (well , really, centralist, not “moderates”)


Snowe is a New England republican not a “Kos” democrat. She’ll sit snuggy-wuggy in the middle and watch one side try to hammer round pegs into square holes and the other side hammer square pegs into round holes. She will offer to help. Bless her heart. She’ll guarantee her state can produce the biggest bestest hammer for the job..for a few of those earmarks.. 🙂

The Kos gang thinks they are first to figure out there is big money to be made in politics..LOL..amateurs..

71. ms_xeno - 13 November 2007

Maybe somebody should ask Ron Paul, lucid. I’m pretty sure he believes in bodily integrity for everyone not dumb enough to be capable of childbearing. :p

Womb possessor = Not part of “the State.” 😀

72. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

The other thing that’s amusing – not that I have a jackass in the race – so OVER IT — Anyways, this whole Barack “insurgency”, is a Clinton front IMO also.

From the planted questions

and its predictable apologia

to planted spoiler candidates…. it really is no big CT Leap here, its just Machiavellian PoliSci 101.

73. lucid - 13 November 2007

but, but, but, Barak is so revolutionary. He is such a pwogwessive! How can you say that?

74. marisacat - 13 November 2007

ugh… there is a really laughable article running around out here (talk about thin gruel served up as “churn” political writing) that Barack can ‘break thru’ if he releases his inner Tiger [Woods].

Bangs head against brick wall and does not notice the pain.

75. marisacat - 13 November 2007

hmm there is a reason there are 20 EPA workers on the beach at Treasure Island. Arnold just had a presser there with CG chief.

Ziss vill not hoppen again!

76. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

I’ve been poking around Skadden Arps and their funnels into the campaigns. This “The” huge Mergers and Aquisitions Law Firm in the US. In between selling off everything that isn’t nailed down in the country they are funneling scads of dough into Dem # 1 and # 2.

Funny how Obama’s big pusher their, played the same role for Hillary in her Dem Sen Funding. All on the FEC.

From CBS story looking acroos the board into bundlers a few weeks ago:

We can only speculate as to whom because campaigns are secretive. They usually don’t advertise bundler events. Thompson’s campaign won’t even say WHO his bundlers are. The rest give out names and general categories – like more than $50,000 – but no specifics. For example, the Clinton campaign said the infamous bundler Norman Hsu was in the category of raising “over $100,000”. But when Clinton went to return the money he raised, she turned over far more – $850,000. That’s why transparency matters. If the public can find out who has raised the MOST for the candidates, it gives all of us a better sense of who might have the most influence in the next administration.

At first, we thought one campaign would break ranks. Senator Barack Obama’s spokesperson told us they would release a list of bundler amounts to CBS News. Today the campaign says due to pressures on its finance team to finish the fundraising quarter, the amounts are not ready. But they say they’ll have something to show in a few more weeks.

We’ll be waiting.

77. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

LOL lucid, you kidder you…

They can trot the Big Dawg out to the rubes but the the “Aw Shucks” gig was long forfeited for candidate H. “No Rap” Clinton. Thus just with the fluff message and matching doo —
( did you know Edwards was the son of a millworker??? Huh did ya? LOL) and Wonderful Tragic Life (like anybody else) Packagability, given any dough, the Edwards were the people to worry about as the anti Hill and Bill. They knew he was going to run…..

Thus,(double and triple team thus) Barack on the Block was then veritably laminated to Edwards’ ass during Wal Mart Protests, New Orleans Feel-Your-Pain(c) slobbers, and then sent Forth as the only begotten Son during the 2006 midterms high fivin with Harold “Whitey” Ford – Then he’s Mr Cordiality with the snooze button while Hill builds “Momentum” churns to the lead but, no, wait!
You must pay attention people. God forbid you doze off on a Clinton Production with obama as understudy…. Again with the “Stay Tuned” Draaahma and irreversible ass lamination between Obama and Edwards

Well Johnny, you were the darling once having willingly voted for the AUMF.. He who lives by the sword ……and all that….

78. Hair Club for Men - 13 November 2007

Shit. Maybe I should go back to N.J.

Hmm. You might want to rethink that.

Xtian wingnuts in New Brunswick have started a round the clock protest/vigil against a stem cell research center that *wasn’t* funded.

And they show no signs of going away.

79. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Anyone who wants a real astro turf laugh


Real Centrist apologist slop put up to placate the kiddies at the time over Robert’s confirmation Jesus its like a full time job just to perpetuate the con of opposition….

Two Diaries on the account..hmmm.

Given the caveat posted by Armando, I don’t doubt Armando took the Liberty of writing it himself..

Update [2005-9-30 10:38:41 by Armando]: From the diaries by Armando. Since it is not our normal practice to promote diaries from our representatives, I think I should explain why I chose to promote Senator Obama’s diary. Simply put, Sen. Obama’s diary addresses in substance an issue that has been a major focus of discussion in our community. Given the source, the topic and the specific thoughts, and the discussion sure to ensue, it is my judgment that promotion was the right thing to do.

LMAO. Doing a lot of that lately….

The Obama slop re Roberts SCOTUS confirmation is priceless
then the follow up diary, the typical
“Love ya but couldn’t stick around to chat ,had a flight, meeting, etc.”
What third rate attorney writes this stuff for him?

This is an anecdotal, personal observation but my Dad was home everynight at 5:30. Definitely accessible but not a meddler either, definitely there on “the Big issues” . I know its extrapolation, but so So many of the VERY TWEAKED dailykos crowd must have never had either formative relationships, collegial or Significant Other relationships built on mutual respect and trust. I think you have to have had that at some point along the way to know what you’re missing, as well as the strength to go it alone when you find betrayal in its place.

At this point, WRT to the blog audience, I don’t think there are many left who are going to be able to make “the Leap” and put the reality together. Only Hunger Pains will do that. It’s not “Denial” or “optimism” that keeps these sheep coming back. I mean, I was a real stupidder, LOL – die hard Dem, but I think at this point, the bloggorube audience is either emotionally incapable or simply too stupid to recognize the interwoven factors in their own personal decline with the illusion of “democracy”, the illusion of their own political influence…How can you claim to be a progressive, Peace and Justice loving Democrat, politically informed , semi well read on the economy, all the while living in the US and not object on a real visceral Fuck Them ALL, Fuck this Shit, I’m Shoppin’ My Options Level???

80. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Rethinking EVERYTHING. Definitely US Citizenship…

Over the Weekend , from CNN

Intelligence deputy to America: Rethink privacy

Privacy no longer can mean anonymity, says Donald Kerr, the principal deputy director of national intelligence. Instead, it should mean that government and businesses properly safeguard people’s private communications and financial information.

“Those two generations younger than we are have a very different idea of what is essential privacy, what they would wish to protect about their lives and affairs. And so, it’s not for us to inflict one size fits all,” said Kerr, 68. “Protecting anonymity isn’t a fight that can be won. Anyone that’s typed in their name on Google understands that.”


“Our job now is to engage in a productive debate, which focuses on privacy as a component of appropriate levels of security and public safety,” Kerr said. “I think all of us have to really take stock of what we already are willing to give up, in terms of anonymity, but [also] what safeguards we want in place to be sure that giving that doesn’t empty our bank account or do something equally bad elsewhere.”

And from the slop in the last line.
“Bad– What am I – Five?:
And what’s with the indecent proposal: Your money or Your Wife or your lover or your friend on the bedroom “security cam” available for the boys and gal thug cops to view at their discretion??

I think all of us have to really take stock of what we already are willing to give up, in terms of anonymity, but [also] what safeguards we want in place to be sure that giving that doesn’t empty our bank account or do something equally bad elsewhere.”

81. ms_xeno - 13 November 2007

But, Hairclub, I can barely find black-and-whites here. Or a fresh bialy. And when I do find them, they’re awful. 😦

82. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Redundant clip at the end of my last ….what a creep.
Yeh The RW Agenda is at Bay. .Sure.

They are going to grant immunity to TelCos and ISPs.
They are going to remove any credible threat of civil liability..

83. Hair Club for Men - 13 November 2007

Looks like Glenn Greenwald’s going to lose his password to the Townhouse mailing list and his access to the kool kids and join Chris Floyd and Arthur Silber under the bleachers with the rest of the misfits.

You Just Do Not Disagree With David Neiwert

He’s like the Anglo Redneck Ellie Weisel from Idaho who understands racism like the rest of you peasants can never hope to.

84. Intermittent Bystander - 13 November 2007

Brrrrrreeeeaaaaakkkkking! Look who is gonna join Newsweek for Horseblanket Coverage of Campaign 2008!

85. Hair Club for Men - 13 November 2007

But, Hairclub, I can barely find black-and-whites here. Or a fresh bialy. And when I do find them, they’re awful.

True, and when you want to have somene’s thumb broken, those Hells Angels just aren’t as efficient as the wiseguys we have here in Jersey.

86. Hair Club for Men - 13 November 2007

Wow. I’m important. Howard Dean himself just sent me an e-mail.

You see, with organizers on the ground in every state and an energetic base of people like you, we’re confident that Democrats can win in any state, at every level.

If you’ve ever wondered where your money goes when you donate to the Democratic Party, read this memo. I think you’ll see that your $10 or $20 donation to strengthen our national party goes a long way.

87. Intermittent Bystander - 13 November 2007

MCat – I meant to drop off this link from Indybay a couple of days ago, in the first aftermath of the spill. It’s a statement from Seaflow about the (now obvious) consequences of allowing heavy shipping lanes in such close proximity to state and national marine sanctuaries.

“The federal government is running a superhighway through our Yosemite on the sea. Every cargo vessel and oil tanker that enters San Francisco Bay passes right through at least one of our three contiguous National Marine Sanctuaries and through or alongside critical state marine protected areas,” warned Robert Ovetz, Ph.D., executive director of Seaflow.

The federal government has a system of 13 National Marine Sanctuaries, the ocean equivalent to our national park system, which protect the most sensitive and biologically diverse of our national waters. California has 4 along its coast—the Channel Islands, Cordell Bank, Monterrey Bay and the Gulf of the Farallones National Marine Sanctuaries. There are also dozens of state Marine Protected Areas (MPAs) along the California coast.

“The deadly little secret of the Cosco Busan spill is that our National Marine Sanctuaries and state MPAs are being used as on ramps for the global economy. The thousands of vessels that annually enter the Port of Oakland are threatening the very integrity of these invaluable marine habitats and the San Francisco Bay,” Ovetz added.

88. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

Thanks Bay for # 39. I really know nothing about boats, ships etc. There was an ep of This Old House last year that showed how they brought huge cargo ships into Boston Harbor, and they had to come in under the control of a pilot on board with much of the power provided by a tug (IIRC).

89. marisacat - 13 November 2007

just let

Intermittent Bystander




out of moderation (sorry for the delay!)

90. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

NPR interviewed a crab fisherman who works with a group trying to help with the cleanup. He sounded so broken-hearted and defeated. Listening to him list the species of birds they’re finding dead is just terrible.

91. marisacat - 13 November 2007

the crab fishermen are very upset… One said his boat spent 9K in fuel costs to get down here and just had a very weak salmon season.

The fishermen and their boatst just began to help, even having been rebuffed when they offered. I hope their associations can apply to some agency for some form of pay for helping..

92. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Regarding Obama’s Organic Nature
From WaPo today

For Obama, a Handsome Payoff in Political Gambles
Presidential Hopeful Has Friends, Successes and Precious Few Battle Scars

[ No Battle Scars – WHY? All I can say is hmmmm. – BHHM ]

By Peter Slevin
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, November 13, 2007; Page A03


……Yet one of the singular aspects of Obama’s rapid political rise is that he accomplished it without becoming controversial, without being bloodied — indeed, with hardly a scratch, even in rough-and-tumble Chicago, one of America’s most famously political cities. He cut a path largely independent of the Democratic machine, its ward bosses and its byzantine rules of succession. Apart from one disastrous decision to run for Congress, he advanced with strong campaigns and some fortuitous implosions by his rivals.

Bill Daley, the politically minded son and brother of Chicago’s longest-serving mayors, is a former member of President Bill Clinton’s Cabinet who defected and became a valuable Obama adviser. He likes Obama because he is “hometown” and “the ultimate change guy — the look, how he came up in politics, everything.”

But, he added: “I would not say he comes from Chicago politics.”

Blow me.

93. marisacat - 13 November 2007

ugh… for some reason zunasurf.wordpress.com causes everything open in IE to crash. Tried AOL it disconnected me…

but before that happened, i saw that at Bolinas/Stinson Beach they have sand crabs, dungeness crbs and fish now dead ont he beaches.

Somday someone is going to talk about the dead sea lions at some cove Thursday am. 4 on the beach and about 7 or 8 floating still and mostly belly up in the water right at the cove.

AND that same early am (it was about 6 am) NBC affiliate report said “58K was now looking to be a conservativ estimate”.

And the oil is fully at Pacifica, not a lot but goo and tarballs arriving.

94. marisacat - 13 November 2007

gee Michelle was iirc 10 years in the Daley office. And frankly I could see her “community relations” spot at UChicago as Daley affiliated.

thanks but no thanks.

95. marisacat - 13 November 2007


thanks for the seaflow. Succinct.

I think we are stuck tho. It feels like the years of begging for reinforced cockpit doors.

I mean Pelosi is nattering on about double hulled everything now. I wish. Be nice if the fuel tanks were not along the wall of the ship.

96. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

Speaking of which, doesn’t that DUI crap blatantly violate like 3 amendments?

It’s been upheld in several states by several courts, much of it built around the SC case that allowed the police to set up sobriety checkpoints. I don’t know how far up the court system anybody has challenged them (sadly WI is a state that has ruled for some of this shit, which is funny considering that we’re one of the drunkest states in the whole country, and damned proud of it).

There were some links at some of the stories linked at the Reason post above.

97. Intermittent Bystander - 13 November 2007

Sealion cam at Pier 39. (You can click on the photo to move the camera and use Zoom drop-down menu to hone in.) Apparently quite a few still slouching around, at sunset. 8)

98. marisacat - 13 November 2007

TNR on Warship Hillary contra the media.

Not behind a sub wall

99. marisacat - 13 November 2007

the planted question story … Ari Melber in The Nation.

NEWS UPDATE: Muriel Gallo-Chasanoff, one of the Grinnell students who asked a staged question from the Clinton Campaign, spoke to CNN today about the incident. In the interview, she explains how a Clinton operative showed her a list of “typed out questions” with one planned specifically for a college student. Gallo-Chasanoff told me on Saturday that the media attention had “just been an awful experience” and she wanted “nothing else to do with it.” She added that she “officially hate[s] press people now, all kinds.”

Oh sweetie, try to include Hillary (and the others) in that emotion.

The article has lots of embedded links.. including to the CNN interview

100. marisacat - 13 November 2007

somewhere today (sorry no link, lost in the oil sludge) I read that Mattzei of MoveOn.org is moving on to some big new Dem Party fundraising org that is being set up. Big donors behind it already… Bing and others.

Bloomberg on the divide, anti war base vs party…:

Nov. 13 (Bloomberg) — When the Democratic Party called up recently to ask Myrna Burgess for a campaign contribution, she answered with an emphatic “no.”

“Nothing has been done as far as the war is concerned,” said Burgess, 72, an Amtrak worker from Levittown, Pennsylvania.

More than a year after anti-war voters like Burgess helped give Democrats control of Congress, there are more troops in Iraq, lawmakers have approved almost $100 billion in new war spending and congressional approval ratings are at record lows.

Democrats now worry that their inability to make good on campaign promises to end or slow the war in Iraq will have consequences. The disaffection has already fueled at least four anti-war primary challenges to party incumbents, raising fears among some lawmakers of an intra-party fight that could drain momentum before next year’s elections.

“They want someone to be held accountable,” said Representative Lynn Woolsey of California, a leading anti-war Democrat in the House. :::snip:::

101. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

I’m messing around with the Miro open-source video player I downloaded (there is a link at BoingBoing.com), and found this nice little doc about a water project done by Engineers without Borders in Africa.

Needed a little break from the gloom.

102. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

subMedia: It’s the End of the WORLD as we know it and I feel FINE Episode #23

Hair will especially enjoy the section, #8, about Ron Paul.

103. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

oh, the actual numbered links are to supporting stuff … you have to download the video. The Ron Paul section is about at minute six, and followed by an interview with Ward Churchill.

104. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Mirror Mirror on the wall……zzzzzzzzzzz

I really believe that he feels threatened by talent (5.17 / 6)
One thing he never wanted to do was allow his site to be taken over by anyone else stealing the show. He was OK with good writers as long as they didn’t possess force of personality and independence. His ideal is someone the suburban nosepicker will find “interesting” but leaves him as top banana. He’s interested in a manageable herd of clydesdales and no stallions.

Armando was the biggest exception to this, but Armando’s psychosis had Markos as the prince figure that Armando’s duty was to defend at all costs. Had Armando snapped out of that he could have overwhelmed Markos very easily, although those were still the days when Markos enforced a monopoly on the weekdays.

In the open format Markos is quite susceptible to being rendered irrelevant by someone with even a shred of star power, and if they were also telegenic Markos could bring about his own ruination as a media figure. He can’t risk that.
by peeder @ Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 16:40:36 PM CST
[ Parent ]

105. marisacat - 13 November 2007

The News Hour: sales tax income and gambling revenues for the state are both down, biggest down since the post 9/11…

oops PS, that is for NV

106. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007
107. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

In the Hands of the Military By Chris Hedges

The last, best hope for averting a war with Iran lies with the United States military. The Democratic Congress, cowed by the Israel lobby and terrified of appearing weak on defense before the presidential elections, will do nothing to halt an attack. The media, especially the electronic press, is working overtime to whip up fear of a nuclear Iran and tar Tehran with abetting attacks against American troops in Iraq. The American public is complacent, unsure of what to believe, knocked off balance by fear and passive. We will be saved or doomed by our generals.

The last wall of defense that prevents the Bush administration from targeting Iran, an attack that could ignite a regional conflagration and usher in apocalyptic scenarios in the Middle East, runs through the offices of Secretary of Defense Robert Gates; Adm. William Fallon , the head of the Central Command (CENTCOM); and Gen. George Casey, the Army’s new chief of staff. These three figures in the defense establishment have told George W. Bush and the Congress how depleted the U.S. military has become, that it cannot manage another conflict, and that a war with Iran would make the war with Iraq look like an act of prudence and common sense.

The reliance on the military command, however, to be the voice of reason in the debate about a new war is not a healthy sign for our deteriorating democracy. Compliant generals can always be found to carry out the Dr. Strangelove designs of a mad White House. Those who resist implementing decisions can easily be removed. The protective cover provided by these figures in the defense establishment could vanish.

The White House, isolated and reviled at home and abroad, believes it is on a higher mission to save the world from itself. The instability in the Middle East could undermine Gates and his generals. A limited Israeli strike on suspected Iranian nuclear production facilities, currently under discussion in Jerusalem, could trigger retaliatory strikes by Iran on Israel and U.S. targets in Iraq and the Persian Gulf. The clamor for revenge, fueled by a rapacious right-wing media, coupled with our feelings of collective humiliation, could sweep aside all reasoned objections to war with Iran. It happened after the attacks of 2001. It can happen again.

There is a petition circulating that was put together by Marcy Winograd from the Progressive Democrats. The petition is addressed to the Joint Chiefs of Staff and all U.S. military personnel. It urges them to defy orders to attack Iran. It points out that a pre-emptive war with Iran is a war crime under international law. It reminds military personnel of the statute in the Army Field Manual 27-10, Section 609, and Uniform Code of Military Justice, Article 92, that states: “A general order or regulation is lawful unless it is contrary to the Constitution, the law of the United States. …”

The petition notes that any provision of an international treaty ratified by the United States becomes the law of the United States. The United States is a party and signatory to the United Nations Charter, of which Article II, Section 4, states, “All members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state. …”

Iran has not attacked the United States. The U.S., as a party and signatory to the U.N. charter, would be in clear violation of international law and the laws enshrined in the Constitution if it went to war with Iran. If the citizens and their representatives in Congress refuse to resist and uphold the rule of law, perhaps the military can be prodded to halt our slide into despotism. It is not the best option, but it may be the only one left.

We live now at the mercy of events. A provocation by Iran, aided by a bellicose White House, could plunge us into another war. It could unleash the primitive chant for violence and revenge that rises up from a population that feels vulnerable, uncertain and afraid. There are forces in our society ready and willing to fan the blood lust for a wider circle of war and mayhem. The Iranians, like us, are cursed by their leadership. President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is as primitive, inept and paranoid as George Bush. They are the perfect dance partners for a waltz into Armageddon.

108. wu ming - 13 November 2007

i’ve been getting into bossa nova recently for the same reason, madman. gotta have some small corner of light in all this murk.

oh, and CA state government is panicking about revenues also. my dad’s concerned that they’ll be pressuring them to retire early to cut costs, and as this housing bubble collapses i wouldn’t be surprised if they start pushing people out the door, golden parachutes or no.

next budget is going to be fugly.

109. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007

i’ve been getting into bossa nova recently for the same reason, madman.

I’ve been listening to a lot of Kelly Willis and Patty Griffin, myself.

110. Hair Club for Men - 13 November 2007

subMedia: It’s the End of the WORLD as we know it and I feel FINE Episode #23

I totally agree with almost everything on that clip. Even if the most radically anti-statist candidate gets into the White House he’d never have the power to break up the bureaucracy.

But Ward Churchill was at the end and Meteor Blades tells me he’s not a good man.

111. Hair Club for Men - 13 November 2007

Ward Churchill is a very bad man who doesn’t believe in electing mobetterdemocrats.

Meteor Blades says so and Meteor Blades is an Indian, a Holocaust survivor who can trace his origins back to the Mayflower and who was at Woodstock, after, of course, helping to liberate the south from Jim Crow with Schwerner Cheney and Goodman and a brief detour to end the Vietnam War.

So if he thinks Ward Churchill is a very bad man, who am I to disagree?

112. marisacat - 13 November 2007

please don’t forget his CO abortion clinic stories. Trotted out anytime women post much of anything at all. But certainly in every abortion diary.


113. Hair Club for Men - 13 November 2007

Didn’t Meteor Blades actually drive Jane Roe to the abortion clinic?

114. marisacat - 13 November 2007

new thread…



115. marisacat - 13 November 2007

He is also Sarah Weddington, that atty before the SC.

116. Madman in the Marketplace - 13 November 2007


Can anyone remember anywhere in all of modern history, large numbers of lawyers leading the resistance as they did on the streets of Pakistani cities way ahead of the workers, peasants and even the university students?

Pakistani police and troops rounded up the mass protests of lawyers and pushed hundreds of them into trucks on the way to the prison. Lawyers were willing to go to prison and endure beatings, while demanding the re-establishment of the rule of law and the independence of judges right up to the Supreme Court, a rare display of professional courage and duty.

What about lawyers in the United States standing up to the Bush regime’s regular violation of our Constitution, the imprisonment of thousands of people without charges and without attorneys, the assault on due process, probable cause, habeas corpus, the spying on Americans without court approval and the defiant, illegal use of torture?

No demonstrations yet. No resolutions by bar associations saying that Bush and Cheney should resign or be impeached.

Except some dozens of active civil liberties’ lawyers, law professors and the former head of the American Bar Association, Michael Greco, the 800,000 or more practicing lawyers have been pursuing business as usual. Given their canons of ethics and their status as officers of the court, this looking the other way is not very professional behavior.

117. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

HC 110, 111

In a forward to Ward Churchills book, Agent’s of Repression, he cites Timothy Lange aka Meatier Take A Dissident Paper in CO and Do an ESOP With It Ultimately Leaving It Broke and Sold To Scripps IIRC Blades as a “friend”.

Some Friend. This cartoon sums it up..
AIM considers Ward Churchill a Fraud

In no uncerrtain terms heres what those close to Peltier think of Churchill and the Op run out of Colorado…they essentially are saying that Churchill & Co, and his “Colorado” AIM shtick served as informants provacateurs and disinfo agents for the FBI.

This sheds some light on the split of the “movement” :

The sorry part of this is Ward Churchill has fraudulently represented himself as an Indian, and a member of the American Indian Movement, a situation that has lifted him into the position of a lecturer on Indian activism. He has used the American Indian Movement’s chapter in Denver to attack the leadership of the official American Indian Movement with his misinformation and propaganda campaigns.

Ward Churchill has been masquerading as an Indian for years behind his dark glasses and beaded headband. He waves around an honorary membership card that at one time was issued to anyone by the Keetoowah Tribe of Oklahoma. Former President Bill Clinton and many others received these cards, but these cards do not qualify the holder a member of any tribe. He has deceitfully and treacherously fooled innocent and naïve Indian community members in Denver, Colorado, as well as many other people worldwide. Churchill does not represent, nor does he speak on behalf of the American Indian Movement.

So Much for Authenticty ….
Now Meatier is Living in Cali. Running Static on the Progressive Line yet again. What a fucking meal ticket. Very vague on the Arest Records BTW. What scheisse. Still Running.

Some more insight into Ward Churchill , white dude playing Indian People Powered Leader IN MINERAL AND GAS RICH COLORADO–get the picture????


David Horowitz vs. Ward Churchill


That question lingered above all others for some academics upon learning that David Horowitz, a conservative writer and social activist, would debate Ward Churchill, a professor of ethnic studies at the University of Colorado at Boulder, on Thursday night in Washington about whether politics belong in the classroom.

And many observers were still asking the same question after the relatively substance-free debate ended. “I think they both would have gotten a failing grade in a high school debate class,” said Jamie Horwitz, a spokesman for the American Federation of Teachers.

The debate, which lasted for just under two hours, was sponsored by Young America’s Foundation, a conservative national student group. The organization seeks “to expose students to conservative principles and bring balance to the campus debate through [its] conferences, seminars, posters, and lecture programs.” Churchill said that he was not paid to participate in the debate.

118. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

Two peas in a pod. I think the notation re Churchills ref to MB is in the Acknowledgements also an indexed ref to Tim Lange though unscanned online. Doesn’t matter, Churchill and his buddy Meatier are both full of shit.

119. BooHooHooMan - 13 November 2007

I’m out

120. ms_xeno - 14 November 2007


True, and when you want to have someone’s thumb broken, those Hells Angels just aren’t as efficient as the wiseguys we have here in Jersey.

Well, I think we all know who leaves the smaller carbon footprint, considering that the Angels have to run over your thumb a couple of times with the ol’ Harley. :p

Also, I hear that Motley Blab is really the inspiration for Michael J. Fox’es character in Back To The Future. He went back in time to teach Chuck Berry’s cousin all about rock ‘n roll.

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