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I don’t know about you……. 23 February 2008

Posted by marisacat in 2008 Election, DC Politics, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter.

Who is who…

but i am pooped.  Too many weeks of too tightly packed news cycles…   sturm drang up down over out…

so… just a change (there will be change! be happy!) of mask indication to hold up a thread…




1. Hair Club for Men - 23 February 2008

Cool. Rachel Corrie’s journals have been published. Just ordered a copy.


Maybe I can beat the LGF haters to the web with the first review.

2. Hair Club for Men - 23 February 2008

Of course unlike a dirty fucking hippie like Rachel Corrie “Our Troops’ always conduct themselves well overseas.


3. Stanley W. Rogousk - 23 February 2008
4. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

Regarding the GM guy and global warming in the last thread: Now the Pentagon tells Bush: climate change will destroy us

Climate change over the next 20 years could result in a global catastrophe costing millions of lives in wars and natural disasters..

A secret report, suppressed by US defence chiefs and obtained by The Observer, warns that major European cities will be sunk beneath rising seas as Britain is plunged into a ‘Siberian’ climate by 2020. Nuclear conflict, mega-droughts, famine and widespread rioting will erupt across the world.

The document predicts that abrupt climate change could bring the planet to the edge of anarchy as countries develop a nuclear threat to defend and secure dwindling food, water and energy supplies. The threat to global stability vastly eclipses that of terrorism, say the few experts privy to its contents.

‘Disruption and conflict will be endemic features of life,’ concludes the Pentagon analysis. ‘Once again, warfare would define human life.’

The findings will prove humiliating to the Bush administration, which has repeatedly denied that climate change even exists. Experts said that they will also make unsettling reading for a President who has insisted national defence is a priority.

The report was commissioned by influential Pentagon defence adviser Andrew Marshall, who has held considerable sway on US military thinking over the past three decades. He was the man behind a sweeping recent review aimed at transforming the American military under Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld.

FWIW, since the fact that he was part of of the Rumsfeld braintrust doesn’t fill me w/ confidence, but it does jive with other stuff I’ve read about warming’s impact.

The interesting thing about the GM guy going after UCS as not being “real scientists” is how much it reminds me of tobacco execs attacking the scientists in that infamous hearing before Congress. If I was one of his shareholders, I’d want that idiot out on his ass.

5. Hair Club for Men - 23 February 2008

Quote of the decade from Arthur Gilroy


A lot of people in Latin America hate my guts? How the fuck would you know? If Castro heard me play he’d get out of his sickbed and dance like he was young again.

6. Hair Club for Men - 23 February 2008

On for my last Gilroy related post, he’s a self-admitted government operative.


Admittedly I’m no big Jazz fan but I’ve never heard of “Arthur Gilroy”.

Nice racket for the State Department. You take a “musician” who can’t make a living otherwise and pay for their trips to the Middle East on the condition they come back and seed the Intertubes with US government propaganda.

A short State Department-sponsored tour. Now that BushCo is on the way out, the PermaGov functionaries are feeling a little frisky. And there we we were.

7. marisacat - 23 February 2008

“Arthur Gilroy” is not his name. It is his grandfther’s name. A long itme ago mayor of NYC

8. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

omigoddess…..people do take to the streets:


oh and that big govt. operative, Dizzy Gillespie did that same gig for the State dept.

9. Hair Club for Men - 23 February 2008

oh and that big govt. operative, Dizzy Gillespie did that same gig for the State dept.

And Gloria Steinhem originally worked for the National Student Assocation (Which was a CIA front).

There’s a reason the government pays for stuff like this.

Maybe “government operative” isn’t a good word. “Embedded cultural worker” might be more accurate.

I remember someone posted a link to an article about Peter Mathiessen here a few months ago.

The government doesn’t hand people bags of money and say “go write propganda” but they don’t fund the arts out of the goodness of their hearts either.

Why is the State Department funding a Jazz orchestra?

I guess it’s part of the whole Karen Hughes let’s make the Arabs see Americans aren’t so bad tour of the Middle East which in and of itself isn’t really what I’d call evil but it’s one sided.

It’s obvious that “Arthur” doesn’t think Egyptian or Muslim culture has anything to offer except anger and threat. Not exactly Jazzlike, is it?

10. bayprairie - 23 February 2008

oh and that big govt. operative, Dizzy Gillespie did that same gig for the State dept.

yeah he also ran for president in 1964. He promised that if he were elected, the White House would be renamed “The Blues House,” Ray Charles would be appointed Librarian of Congress, Miles Davis would become the head of the CIA, and Malcolm X the Attorney General. He also said his running mate would be Phyllis Diller.

11. melvin - 23 February 2008

4–A global consensus -with well over 90% certainty – of those who actually study the subject that .8° C of warming has already been accomplished, and .6″ more is in the pipeline. Much over that and we are committed to catastrophe that couldn’t be fixed for thousands of years.

You have to wonder if these people, with their 1% doctrine on other matters, carry home and car insurance – against unlikely events – or just assume that everything will be okie-dokie.

12. marisacat - 23 February 2008

I am pretty sure the State Dept has done this for a long time.

I don’t think it is anything new.

13. liberalcatnip - 23 February 2008
14. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Yeah, not new. Cold War jazz tours (Book review of Satchmo Blows up the World: Jazz Ambassadors Play the Cold War).

Apparently Eisenhower got the jazz ambassador thing started. Funding has gone up a little again (under Karen Hughes, et al). According to this CSM article, the Rhythm Road: American Music Abroad program currently gets $1 million a year.

15. marisacat - 23 February 2008

I have been watching the obama/Tavis thing boil for a bit now over this.

I am wondering what is up, why, and how it will shake down.

Tavis … nto sure if he has confirmed it, but he has gotten death threats over his commentary and discussion of this. America… land of the free and the brave.

Obama did not go last year either. Cornel West called him out from the stage, i recall and Tavis tamped it down. Said they had spoken the previous evening by phone and blah blah, etc. Obama called Cornel shortly afterwards and wrangled an endorsement out of him…

Good luck to all!

16. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Cold War jazz ambassador links gone to the Eisenhower mod pod, I think.

17. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Oops – out now! Thanks.

18. marisacat - 23 February 2008

I think it is more than jazz, think the State Dept fields all sorts of cultural missions.

Think I remember reading in Other Voices Other Rooms many years ago, as a child really, of whatshisname (the In Cold Blood author, names elude me) in Russia/USSR in the 50s with the perfromance of an American play.

I have no problme wtih it… is it used as cover, sure I would assume so.

19. marisacat - 23 February 2008
20. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Truman Capote.

Yes, various cultural exchange programs are funded. (According to the CSM article upthread, the 2007 budget for “public diplomacy” was $465.6 million – peanuts, obviously, compared to the various “bombing and killing” programs.)

Here’s the State Dept site:

Beats the hell out of hot war, I agree. Even if the occasional Gilroy (or
worse) rides for free.

21. melvin - 23 February 2008

Crap. I can’t live without preview.

22. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

this guy talks about the 50’s background:


23. marisacat - 23 February 2008


think I got it… .6″ instead of gobbldegook…


24. marisacat - 23 February 2008

20 IB

thanks, yes Truman!

25. melvin - 23 February 2008

23 Thanks – close enough, degrees, inches, you get the picture.

From Proceed At Your Own Risk, which now requires a password (think capital letter acronyms and password):

Penis Frenzy

I wish the explanation was as easy as the Puritan heritage, but I don’t think it is. At some point this nation lost touch with its humanity. Nature is alien to us and hypocrisy is our religion. Can we blame that on a few 17th Century English religious loonies? I have no idea.

But if it has to do with nature, we turn into monsters. Biology, zoology and climatology are the real axis of evil.
George Washington was bisexual and planted seed throughout the colonies while Martha tended her gardens. Jefferson seems to have more descendants of various colors than an alley cat. JFK, considered by most Democrats to have been one of our greatest presidents loved his women–and only Teddy knows how many there were–drugged and silly. Hollywood Ronnie R was in and out of marriages and affairs like a rabbit in heat.
Did Barack Obama get a blow job and smoke crack in the back of some limo in 1999? I hope so; makes me like him more. This nation needs to come to terms with the penis. It’s a happy and friendly little fellow who, like man’s best friend, Fido, is always happy for attention. The penis is not our enemy. The question is who came up with the idea that it is?

Ran across this just as I was warming up to BO a little because of the WU connection.

26. melvin - 23 February 2008

I give up. It might interest you to know, mcat, that I once worked as a proofreader.

27. sabrina - 23 February 2008

I doubt Arthur Gilmore was asked to come home and do what he just did. But when the government pays your way and controls what you see, as he says they did, (he had minders) they can count on soft Americans going into culture shock and combined with all their fear-mongering propaganda here, a few of them are guaranteed to react the AG has, in a frightened, ignorant way and sprinkle a little more fear and prejudice around.

Some less self-absorbed and more enlightened artists, going with their eyes open (AG claims he was innocent when he left) hopefully will see things as they really are. Not sure in the end how it all benefits the PTBS, but I bet someone profits from the program, somewhere.

28. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Found something paradoxical about that Capote thing here: The Complicated Life of Porgy and Bess

In December of that same year [1955], the opera company became the first American theater group to perform in Russia since the Bolshevik revolution. The U.S. State Department refused to pay for the tour, so the Soviets did. Novelist Truman Capote joined the company and wrote about it in The Muses are Heard. Capote, along with many blacks, including some in the cast, were concerned that the struggling, God-fearing, addicted residents of Catfish Row might be taken from the Communist viewpoint as a picture of racial exploitation by southern whites. They were “gratefully” proven wrong.

The director in a pre-curtain speech assured the audience that Porgy and Bess was set in the past and no more reflected the present than it did life under czarist rule. That wasn’t an issue: the entranced audiences in Leningrad and throughout Europe were there to hear black singers singing opera.

Miss D – Interesting stuff at your link. And funny ending. Photographer to CIA: Take my art, please!

29. marisacat - 23 February 2008


WP is pretty basic… if it does not recognise soemthing it throws out that bit of gibberish…

fixed the link…


30. marisacat - 23 February 2008



Muses are Heard… now I remember, LOL more perfectly….

thanks. I read it and did a book report, I think in 8th grade.

31. sabrina - 23 February 2008

Looks like John McCain may be in deeper trouble than having an affair might have caused him. Seems there is a transcript of testimony he gave several years ago in which he contradicts (under oath apparently) what he says now regarding speaking to Paxson before sending the letters McCain sent to the FCC on Paxson’s behalf.

And Paxson himself told the WaPo that he remembers speaking to him also … so big surprise, McCain is not only a liar, but a stupid one.

32. marisacat - 23 February 2008

LOL I just checked in at Pffterpoofters… and see that Gilroy is clocking in the comments … up t 278.

Think last I saw it was around 30.

what a HOOT!

33. marisacat - 23 February 2008

Yes Wapo popped up with Paxson very quickly and the transcript was out as well, early yesterday.



I assume McCain is leafing thru their oppo files.

34. melvin - 23 February 2008


I have long thought of visiting dkos as walking through a kennel full of rabid chihuahuas. pff at first seems more promising, the inmates seem quite a bit brighter on average, but the cage doors are open. It has come to be dominated by the same three or four nuts posting all the time.

35. marisacat - 23 February 2008

pff is loaded with reactionaries, righties, conservatives and whatever else.

And a lot of partisan shape shifters, from donkeytale to FLH to Gilroy to to to to.

but I do blieve, this is just my considered opinion, that the online so called leftischer political discussion opportunities have been PUSHED, relentlessly and ceaselessly, in that direction.

I mean if there was a time there was a chance for furthering progressivism/liberality with out neo liberalism, left ideas it was as a reaction to Bush et alia.

Did nto happen. The party as it always does moved right and forced the narrowing of the broader discussion as well.

They have been very effective.

36. melvin - 23 February 2008

This is why I am afraid of BO the pied piper. Will they follow him anywhere?

No better way to keep the dream alive than by staying asleep.

37. BooHooHooMan - 23 February 2008

BReaking! Meta War!

1000 People on a Saturday neither making love in the afternoon, NOR watching basketball!

Sirota calls out Ms Laura DH ct and other malodorous types… Food Fight on DK LOL

Boober shows up, MSOC and Armando invoked , one big rubber room free for all! Oh, the ‘Umanity!

38. marisacat - 23 February 2008

I don’t know who else cuaght NOW last night with the Pogrebin mere et fille in a fmaily split between H and O….

I was very interested to note that the daughter, who cleaves to Obama, claims to feel a patriotism she had never felt before. She is ini her early 40s…

hmmm. I am certain that is part of the political calculus on the part of the handlers and the party. (and would have been as well had Barack not picked up speed, late in November, they would have been busy planning for beating hearts in bosoms for the First Lady as pretzeldent)

Now what do they intend to do with it. B ecause the use of that swelling patriotism will nto be benign.

Not at all.

I will be wearing hip waders, goggles and carrying massive bottles of bug spray. For years.

39. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

37.BHHM, I saw the beginning of the “my feelings are hurt” sirota diary, and noticed he called out dana & laura. yesterday? someone posted an “Armando has lost it” diary. It’s all about invoking.

I just saw the Hillary “Shame on you, Obama” video up at CNN. The last time I heard “Shame on you!”, I think I got a spanking after that. (as a child, in other words)

40. melvin - 23 February 2008

39 Working on my Miss Devore Betrayed the Revolution diary now.

41. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

Shame on you, melvin. For wanting a spanking.

42. marisacat - 23 February 2008

LOL Shame on Kerry for wanting McCain as his Veepessa a mere 4 years ago. All the little paid cubicle commenters swarmed thru Dkos exhorting for McCain… Truly gagworthy.

His “fill in” was John Glenn, who went with him to anything involving the mil. So he would not be boo’d

Pity they are all such shameless whatevers.

43. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

ok, I dipped in and found:

“No, it doesn’t. (4+ / 0-)

Recommended by:
Ray Radlein, jerseycorn, sofia, RoscoeOfAlabama

There’s a crucial distinction: I have many times seen DH either accept a criticism and acknowledge error, and add clearly-labeled updates to his posts to correct himself. Similarly I’ve seen him continue to disagree with a criticism but have a friendly, calm exchange of thoughts on a topic. His responses to criticism reflect the tone and substance of the criticism. And that’s where Sirota errs, by responding to thoughtful criticism exactly as he responds to thoughtless criticism.

by MissLaura ”

yep, ya gotta admit that Dana is Mr. Rogers in that neighborhood.

44. melvin - 23 February 2008

43 Christ it’s almost worth going back just to open fire on that lying bitch one more time. She is completely full of shit and knows it.

I’ve seen him delete his own comments and then lie about it.

45. sabrina - 23 February 2008

Watching cable, (which I had not done for over a year) the Repubs are out in force trying to protect McCain, from those nasty lefties who are spreading rumors etc. etc. to try to ‘destroy an American hero’ –

Anyway, what McCain supposedly did pales in comparison to what is being revealed eg, in the Chicago Tribune. I haven’t seen much elsewhere about these investigations.

It’s a long article and it is truly sickening – it leaves little doubt about the corruption, the theft starting even before the war began. Mostly, it reveals how hopeless it was to try to stop them ….

Inside the world of war profiteers
From prostitutes to to Super Bowl tickets a federal probe reveals how contractors inside Iraq cheated the US


Ribbons and badges glittered across Peleti’s pressed green army shirt. “I stand here before you today to convey my remorse and deep regret,” he said, then broke down and wept.

They were partying in Kuwait in ancitipation of the war, preparing to make a financial killing as soon as the bombs started falling on the Iraqi people.

Meantime, here in the US even those who opposed this war, could never have imagined how corrupt they were, and while the flags were waving, what was actually going on.

How anyone can still claim there was any purpose to this war other than pure greed, is beyond me.

46. sabrina - 23 February 2008

Sorry, that link doesn’t work … I’ll try to find it again ….

Lol, MissL has actually seen DHimwit be ‘reasonable’ somewhere? But no one need worry, she has so little credibility. If I wanted someone to vouch for me, I would beg her to ‘please don’t’ …. what a bunch of mediocrities they are, and that’s being kind ….

I’m with Melvin re Miss L a nasty, uninformed, arrogant with no good reason to be, supercilious know-it-all. And she has embarrassed herself repeatedly with her proclamations but doesn’t seem to be aware of it at all. It makes perfect sense that she would team up with the equally despicable DHinMi – birds of a feather ……

47. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

sabrina, I read that tribune article. it is a wonder the candidates don’t go after the “accountability” issue more. NCLB, although underfunded, makes teachers and students “accountable”, but we never see this criteria applied to Blackwater, Halliburton or FEMA. Can’t remember where I read it in the past couple days, but FEMA is suppose to give the proceeds of the unused (tho toxic!) emergency housing trailers back to the government, but instead, the agency bought themselves bigger and brighter SUVs, etc.

48. marisacat - 23 February 2008

well she worked or was a volunteer (I have no idea which) on the hOdes campaign, he was the CM… she used to have pics of him at her former NH blog…

I assume she is in his pocket. Or, perhaps more precisely, he is in hers.


49. melvin - 23 February 2008

Oh brother: DH’s Apologia Pro Bullshit Sua doesn’t address the question of where his emotional deformities originated.

50. marisacat - 23 February 2008

Everythign is trending toward privatisation, thru SEVERAL adminsitrations… from Medicare (Bush 1, Clinton, Bush 2) to NCLB, a biiiig step toward [further] abandoning public education.

LOL The candidates will nto be screwing with the Plan. Not really

I read recently Dyncorp got a new big contract, I forget for which country. They have been discredited for years, since the Yugloslavia, former, battlespace and post open warfare.

51. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

there are lots of online “make your own Jeopardy game” sites–one of my brothers and I have been contemplating doing one for our family [“Mother’s sayings for $50”] but there should be one for the bloggospear.

52. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

Dynocorp got a 4 billion contract for translators in iraq :


a pittance compared to compensating those gay translators the military had to discharge.

53. marisacat - 23 February 2008

Who is IOZ proves that reading Dkos is dangerous to your health.

Long ago in Dkos donkey years, I sued to wonder at all those drippy Why I Am a Democrat diaries. They never made sense. Full of espousements tht the party had no use for. And would quash, liketysplit.

My best answer used to be, I am not a Republcian. LOL

54. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

I have to say that so far, I’m getting a lot more laughs out of the Gilroy-Goes-To-Egypt Commentpalooza than I am out Sirota’s Sheep Dipped Hanky Party.

Who can resist gems such as these:

I’m actually not responding directly TO you, Mr. Gilroy, but writing for people who may not fully understand how limited your understanding is and how truly ignorant you are of Egypt, Arab culture, Islam, or anything that doesn’t involve playing your polka music.


whats a pwoggie? (0.00 / 0)
Most people are idiots. But don’t tell them. It’ll spoil all the fun for those of us who aren’t.
by d3n4l1 @ Fri Feb 22, 2008 at 21:23:11 PM PST

or finally

I just jammed a kilo of cocaine up my nose. Then I consumed a ham and Elmer’s Glue sandwich, followed by a 90-minute dump.

Bet on it.


(Your Momma)

Thanks for the ChiTrib link, sabrina.

BTW, I think both Serbia and Iran are saying “Shame on U.S.” today.

55. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

“Why I am a_______” was the precursor to “_____________for dummies” or maybe Reader’s Digest “I am Joe’s Foot”

56. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

the Shame on you video:

We’re here to fight for Harry Truman’s dream?

57. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Bit risky to emphasize that Obama can fight Rove-style, while (in general) deriding his ability to go up against the Scary GOP Monsters in the general. Aren’t some listeners thinking, Good! Our Champion must be a Royal Bastard too!

(t to mention the obvious hypocrisy of the dogwhistle fight. Obviously.)

Like the red outfit, though. Who was the nervous background nodder?

58. sabrina - 23 February 2008

IB, were you able to find the story from that link? Miss D said she read it and it is in todays online version. I am seriously handicapped with this laptop regarding posting links as I still haven’t had a chance to get a mouse and can’t figure out how to copy and paste …

But Miss D’s point about the candidates not making more of this massive corruption is so true. Then again, how can Hillary do so when she voted for it and still will not apologize or admit she should not have? What’s so frustrating in this country is how candidates have to be so ‘PC’ – when really, this should be their opportunity to get the attention of the people for issues like this. For some reason, other than Kucinich and Gravel (not even Paul mentioned the corruption airc) it seems taboo to bring up Republican corruption …

59. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

Bit risky to emphasize that Obama can fight Rove-style, while (in general) deriding his ability to go up against the Scary GOP Monsters in the general.

That campaign has been throwing desperate attacks like monkeys throwing poo at the exhibit glass.

60. sabrina - 23 February 2008

‘Shame on you, Barack Obama’ – sad to see that video … it won’t help her at all. I can understand her feelings about anyone attacking her to an extent, on the healthcare issue. I don’t know the details of what happened when she tried in the nineties to get a universal healthcare program going and the Repubs shot it down, but she did try –

But talking to another Dem candidate as though he were a child is not good strategy. If I were advising her, I’d suggest she save that for Republicans … I’d love to see her, or any Dem go after Republicans like George Bush and Cheney, eg, that way. But I don’t think that’s ever going to happen …..

61. marisacat - 23 February 2008

it seems taboo to bring up Republican corruption …

I find it very simple. The Republicans have subject, page, verse, line on where the Dems colluded.

62. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Sabrina – Actually, I thanked you in advance of clicking, so had to scurry around a bit to find it, but here it is:

Inside the world of war profiteers.

63. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

56.I think the nervous nodder is Gov. Strickland of Ohio, who the Clintons bailed out some time back. thought I read abt. it in a nytimes article, but can’t find it now.

64. marisacat - 23 February 2008


I am 3/4 of the way thru the Gilroy thread. What a scream!

I take breaks from it.

65. marisacat - 23 February 2008

I read that if Strickland cannot deliver Ohio for Hillary (and how could he) having won in a landslide.. then neither side wants to bother with him. It’s tough out there for a pol with no machine… LOL

Oh politics is so krule.

66. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

(I suspect the weather sucks everywhere today):

“I will not vote. (39+ / 0-)

Recommended by:
pb, Sean Robertson, IhateBush, Avila, penncove, fink, nevadadem, Christopher Day, DaveV, chuckvw, az, kitebro, casablanca, gmb, Aquaman, ccr4nine, demkat620, musikman, djscincy, Philoguy, sheddhead, jabbausaf, Diggs, ZinZen, PointGuard, Debbie in ME, charlestown dem, Joshua Lyman, joyful, ayawisgi, gchaucer2, brklyngrl, fromdabak, haruki, FudgeFighter, snackdoodle, Rorgg, Renie, gxy2008

by Delaware Dem on Sat Feb 23, 2008 at 02:58:15 PM PST”

(with respect to Hillary shaming the big O)

67. Intermittent Bystander - 23 February 2008

Don’t look now, MCat, but I think melvin’s link to the DH Blogger Ethics Treatise at 49 includes some de-li-cate alluuuuuuusions . . . hint hint . . . wink wink . . . .

But I refuse to read the comment thread! Enough is enough!

68. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

Slouching towards Petroeurostan By Pepe Escobar

It was a discreet, almost hush-hush affair, but after almost three years of stalling and endless delays it finally happened. Now more than ever, it may also signal a geoeconomic earthquake, a potentially shattering blow to US dollar hegemony.

The Iranian oil bourse – the first oil, gas and petrochemical exchange in the Islamic Republic, and the first within the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) – was launched on Sunday by Iran’s Oil Minister Gholam-Hossein Nozari, flanked by Minister of Economy and Financial Affairs Davoud Danesh Ja’fari, the man who will head the exchange.

Officially called the Iranian International Petroleum Exchange (IIPE), it is widely known in Iran and the Persian Gulf as the Kish bourse, named after Kish island, a free zone (declared by the shah) in an ideal laissez faire setting: lots of condos and duty-free malls, no Khomeini mega-portraits and hordes of young honeymooners shopping for made-in-Europe home appliances.

Transactions at this early stage will be in Iran’s currency, the rial, according to Nozari, ending worldwide speculation that the bourse would start trading in euros. The Iranian ambassador to Russia, Gholam-Reza Ansari, has said that “in the future, we’ll be able to use the ruble, Russia’s national currency, in our operations”. He added that “Russia and Iran, two major producers of the world’s energy, should encourage oil and gas transactions in various non-dollar currencies, releasing the world from being a slave of the dollar.”

69. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

Sunday follies:

Sunday Talk

MTP: Ralph Nader; roundtable of NYT’s David Brooks, historian Doris Kearns Goodwin, NPR’s Michele Norris, and NBC’s Chuck Todd

FTN: Charlie Black (McCain campaign strategist); Gov. Jennifer Granholm (D-MI); Gov. Janet Napolitano (D-AZ)

This Week: Sen. Joe Biden (D-DE) and Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchinson (R-TX) on foreign policy; roundtable of WaPo’s E.J. Dionne, WSJ’s Peggy Noonan, ABC’s Cokie Roberts and ABC’s George Will (ugh!)

FNS: Gov. Tim Pawlenty (R-MN); Gov. Mark Sanford (R-SC); Gov. Tim Kaine (D-VA); Gov. Jon Corzine (D-NJ); McCain campaign manager Rick Davis

Late Edition: DNI Mike McConnell; Gov. Ed Rendell (D-PA, Clinton supporter); Gov. Kathleen Sebelius (D-KS, Obama supporter); Sen. Chuck Hagel (R-NE); Gov. Tim Pawlenty (R-MN); Robert Bennett (McCain’s lawyer); roundtable of Bill Schneider, Amy Walter and Suzanne Malveaux

70. sabrina - 23 February 2008

IB, thanks for the link …..

Re Pff and Melvin’s comment above …. and marisacat’s regarding how the conversation on blogs has been pushed to the right. That is true, but from my observation, starting when I first discovered blogs and they were mixed between rightwingers and lefties, the lefties gave in often, and left the sites to the rightwingers …

Same thing seems to be happening on Pff but isn’t that the fault of lefties who don’t seem to have the same stamina (or maybe the righties are paid which would give them more incentive, don’t know) to stay around and expose the lies they tell …. I’m just not sure we can always blame someone else for the failures of the left. How many, eg, stood up for Cynthia McKinney on the various ‘liberal’ blogs when she was being attacks. Not many, but no one was stopping them airc …

Just my thoughts – since no one is being banned at Pff, as they are at the other ‘netroots’ blogs ….

Anyway, just waded through some of the comments on that thread at DK ….

Why does Sirota care about DK? Hasn’t he figured out that no matter how badly they act, or how unpopular they may be, and those two FPers are certainly unpopular and untalented, Kos will keep them there …. the blog is dying a slow death.

Jealousy is definitely behind their attitude towards him, imo. MissL who cannot post a word without sounding like Nurse Wretched, not to mention the ignorance she routinely displays when she does offer an opinion, (the minority blogging disastrous postings where she was thrashed beautifully for her condescending and totally uninformed defense of DK comes to mind) and DHinMi whose writing is yawn-inducing not to mention his general attitude, are the kind of people who will never amount to much although they desperately want to.

So, they are extremely jealous of anyone who does succeed, as DS has done. Why he wastes his time there is a mystery to me …. otoh, he may just have wanted to go after those two, which got him nearly 400 recs ….

Watching Miss L in action is like watching a SNL skit featuring a very proper schoolmarm finger-wagging at the popular ‘kidz’ because she just can’t understand why the world doesn’t see how ‘bad’ they are.

Her lecturing, boring style is devastating to her ambitions …. someone who cares about her ought to try talking to her about consistently making a fool of herself.

71. marisacat - 23 February 2008

Wonder if Del Dem flounced his feathered fan and stomped his high heeled dance shoes when he said that.

Threw his spangled boa to the ground and exited. Stage right.

72. marisacat - 23 February 2008


TW looks like a very bitchy round table. Think I will drop in there.. if I am awake……..


73. wu ming - 23 February 2008

dear god, of the thousands of historians in this country, the only one they can find to comment on anything is goodwin?

74. marisacat - 23 February 2008

well what I saw of ORGANISED waves at Dkos, the hard reality is that people just damn well wear out. (as they do in the RW, RL as well)

Plus what are th blogs for? Kos is a former R allied with NDN/Simon Rosenberg and in my best opinion the blahgs like Dkos Mydd, Open Left, Left Talk etc are product push. I long ago called MLW and BMT butterly nets.

What is the point of fighting it out. In a fake landscape.

Peeder is hardly some lefty, and if you ask me (nor does anyone have to) it has long STANK to high heaven the Israel Firsters at Dkos love to direct traffic his way. With links. He braked for “white nigger” and gay sex pics but kept up naked or up ended women being peed on.

KEEP IT ALL UP. FFS. Or take it all down.

More frat boys metaphorically sucking off eahc other to be brutal.

Where there is odor there is usually burning rot.

Many people have left the blogs. And rightfully so.

Generally speaking they are bullshit. Mindless lecturing, propaganda, waves of party fleas and operatives.

One should stay?

For what?

To attend as they do Rahm’s business? to propp up some fake and mind numbing lefty responsibilyt.

By now the only responsiblity is remain human and not get mind fucked.

To be blunt.

75. marisacat - 23 February 2008

MissL strikes me as the classic lousy third tier academic.

World is loaded iwth them.

76. marisacat - 23 February 2008

It’s hard out there for a NV caucus process, LOL:

Now, the Sun reports, they’ve shut the thing down — without electing delegates.

The Clark County convention wrapped around 4 p.m., after supporters from both campaigns voted to suspend the presidential delegate vote.

When convention chair Bill Stanley initially moved to suspend voting earlier in the afternoon, the assembled delegates revolted and voted the motion down. The campaigns then met with supporters in separate rooms to explain why suspending the vote was necessary.

The lights are up, the balloons are coming down and a horde of angry Democrats have left the building. ::snip::

77. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

the only one they can find to comment on anything is goodwin?

I suspect she has a book coming out soon that her publisher’s PR firm is pushing. It’s been a couple of years since the last one.

78. Miss Devore - 23 February 2008

off topic–fuck the rain in the Bay Area!

79. marisacat - 23 February 2008

they just said that 4700 have lost power, in the Richmond district, west of me…

80. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

time to ban him from Little Orange Footballs:

Kucinich to Investigate 9/11 Insider Trading

Kucinich said that he had personal questions about the implications insider trading had.

“I’ve indicated a long-standing interest in gathering information and trying to get to the bottom of exactly what happened with respect to all the stock activity that took place preceding 9/11.” Kucinich said.

Kucinich said it was the bizarre record-level put options that caught his attention initially. The odd trades heavily indicate prior knowledge of the September 11 attacks and have raised a number of questions that Kucinich hopes to probe.

“First of all, I’m not afraid to ask questions about 9/11,” Kucinich told the Alex Jones Show.

“From my own personal standpoint, I’ve had long-standing questions about why this volume, why those airlines, why that time, who made the buys, why did they buy them, who told them to make the buys, who was involved? There are questions there that need to be answered as part of an effort to get to the truth,” Kucinich said.

He made clear he was not yet pointing the finger. “I don’t know what happened. I’m not alleging anything here. But I sure want to find out how it happened.”

But Kucinich hopes that inquiries in a committee hearing would clarify the information and answer questions.

“I think we need to talk to the people who were involved in making those transactions in order to try to figure out why they were made, for example, American Airlines and United Airlines stock.” Kucinich said.

81. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

Essence dot com: Cynthia McKinney: The New Face of the Green Party

By now we all know there is both a woman and a Black man running for President of the United States. But most folks may not be aware of another candidate who embodies both of these characteristics. Former Georgia congresswoman Cynthia McKinney is also in the running as a candidate representing the Green Party. A lifelong Democrat, McKinney was a staunch supporter of the party’s involvement in anti-war and human rights legislations. And while these causes are still on her list of priorities, McKinney is now rolling with a new team of policy makers who she says are right up her alley. She recently spoke with essence.com on her underdog bid for the White House.

Essence.com: Why should people consider taking a harder look at the Green Party?

Cynthia McKinney: As I travel, talking to Americans across the country, I’ve learned that there is life outside of the two-party paradigm. We have a generation of folks who watched in horror as young people protested the Vietnam War outside of the Democratic National Convention and saw how they were subsequently treated. That was a tipping point for a lot of people. Today, some feel that their votes won’t be counted because of election integrity. There are people who want to see an end to the war, and that hasn’t happened, despite the Democratic majority in Congress. So you have all these different people who have reached the same conclusion that the two-party paradigm doesn’t serve their interests anymore. But let’s not withdraw from it; let’s change it.

Essence.com: You’ve been a Democrat all your life. Why switch to Green now?

C.M.: You know, I never really got the chance to know the members of the Green Party across the country before. Now, I’m getting to know the most wonderful, idealistic, patriotic people who have made me feel at home. It’s just wonderful to be with people who have thought through the process and how we can work to make it better.

Essence.com: How many votes do you need to be considered?

C.M.: The Green Party needs 5 percent of the votes in the 2008 election to be institutionalized as a third force in American politics.

Essence.com: Why should we consider voting for you?

C.M.: If people feel deep within their hearts that there is still something structurally wrong with the limited choices we have in our two-party system, then I want people to say let me be a part of the 5 percent that changes the structure of our country. Right now, public policy is made in a room where the door is locked. The people are outside; only two representatives [Democrats and Republicans] are in that room hammering out policy. Somebody gave the corporate lobbyists a key so they can come and go as they please. The Green Party will open the door for people who care about impeachment, the war, civil liberties, and economic justice. We will pull up a chair and be a part of the conversation. You’ll get different results and people won’t feel as if they were marginalized out of the process.

Essence.com: You’ve done a lot for the people in New Orleans and the Gulf States after the Hurricanes. Why is their cause still so important to you?

C.M.: I’ve been very active in the treatment against Hurricane Katrina survivors. After having participated in the International Tribunal on Hurricanes Katrina and Rita and visited New Orleans and the Gulf States several times, I have helped to put together a 10-point plan for the survivors, which is based on the Reconstruction Movement and the Reconstruction Party [in Canada]. This 10-point plan includes an electoral system that allows for integrity and voter choice, full employment including the right to organize, reparations, a budget for human needs, policies against police brutality, a way to end the drug war and prisons for profit, means to protect the environment, end militarism and continue to stand for peace. There’s a lot more that our country can do in its own borders and in the global community.

Essence.com: What are some issues you plan to tackle in your campaign?

C.M.: I haven’t visited a single city that isn’t reeling from overpriced housing and gentrification. We want to demystify the phenomenon known as gentrification and that’s a project that I’ll be working on in the days ahead. I want to be at the ground floor of exposing what’s happening to innocent people.

Essence.com: What do you think of the two Democratic frontrunners, Sen. Obama and Sen. Clinton?

C.M.: It’s interesting that you asked me about them and not the Republicans. The issue for those of us who decided to take a third path is not about the individual characteristics of a candidate because there are wonderful Democrats and activist Republicans like Ron Paul. But we should be asking ourselves, what are the limits of these parties? We have to look beyond the candidates to see what the party itself stands for. So issues like reparations while it’s a part of the 10-point plan is also a part of the 2008 Green Party platform.

Essence.com: You introduced articles of impeachment against President Bush, Vice President Cheney and Secretary of State Rice for manipulating intelligence and lying to justify the war. Why would you do that?

C.M.: Because it was warranted! These people have lied to the world. They have taken our country to war and they have violated US and International laws with crimes against humanity, peace and torture. The Democratic majority in Congress has failed to provide secure elections so we don’t have to deal with these outdated election machines. They have yet to repeal the Patriot’s Act. These issues that we’re talking about now, will be the issues that must be confronted by the new administration in 2009. They are not going away. They won’t melt into the fabric of America. If anything they are going to soil the fabric of America.

82. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008
83. NYCO - 23 February 2008

Look at the NYT website right now. Why the big huge “spread” on how awful and autocratic Putin is?

I mean, why run this NOW?

84. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

via theopinionmill dot wordpress dot com:

What happened to the widows

As the first anniversary of 9/11 neared, Beamer was beginning to rethink her spot on the public stage. She had done everything asked of her. She had delivered the approved lines or tactfully refrained from retracting the ones that had been placed in her mouth. And yet, the media madonna was increasingly being painted as a media hound. She tried her best to defend herself. “In those mind-numbing days after the crash I had (and still have) no desire for publicity,” she tried to explain in her 2002 memoir. She wanted nothing for herself, just “some small public record of who Todd was . . . for the sake of our children.” But nothing Beamer said seemed to diminish the bitter snipes, and by the time she began her book tour in the late summer of 2002, she seemed ready to retreat. How did she feel about her “public persona”, a Los Angeles Times reporter asked. “It’s sort of another thing I have to deal with,” Beamer replied wearily.

“I guess, for me, I’m sort of done reshaping September 11.”

So were many of the other anointed widows. AR Torres, who was eight months pregnant when her husband died in the World Trade Centre, recoiled from being typecast as “grieving widow with a post-9/11 baby, a newly minted American icon”, as she put it. “I cynically imagine a request from Playboy to pose on red, white and blue satin, patriotically baring myself to suckle my post-9/11 son. And then I seriously wonder who will be the first among the families to do it.” Deanna Burnett, whose husband died on Flight 93, came to distrust the hosannas. “In the beginning, everyone asked, ‘Aren’t you proud of him? Aren’t you happy that he’s a hero?'” she said. “I thought, my goodness, the first thing you have to understand is, I’m just trying to put one foot in front of the other. I’d much prefer him to be here with me. As selfish as that is, it’s the truth. Use Thomas Jefferson as your hero, not my husband.”

Glick was having similar thoughts. She began to sicken at the Purple Hearts and hero-worship memorabilia that kept arriving in the post. In her memoir, Your Father’s Voice, written as a series of letters to her newborn child, she wrote: “I wanted to say to them, this is not what Jeremy and I were about. Jeremy didn’t sign up to fight terrorism … He did what he did because he wanted so very badly to come home to his wife and baby daughter.”

After a while, Glick lost her willingness to stick to the script. “Although it had been flattering to hear President Bush express his personal gratitude for what Jeremy and the other passengers did to ‘save’ the White House,” she recalled, “I knew when he said it that this simply wasn’t true.” If the plane hadn’t crashed, the air force “was preparing to blast my husband and 40 other civilians out of the sky”, she pointed out. And anyway, she wondered, shouldn’t the real question be why there were no efforts made to save her husband and the other passengers of Flight 93? Their plane was the last to be hijacked, yet “for almost an hour [from the time of the first hijacking], nothing consequential was done”. She began to say what she really thought. “In interviews, when someone lobbed what they thought was a soft question at me about whether I was proud that Jeremy saved the White House, they’d get a big surprise. I’d reply that I wasn’t, because he didn’t save it.” The media inquisitors, Glick came to understand, weren’t interested in her version of the truth; they were interested in their own fiction, “this wonderful story, a national myth to elevate our grief”.

Widows who didn’t contribute to the “wonderful story” found themselves dropped from the media dance card. Widows who openly flouted its terms were treated far worse – they found themselves the objects of widespread censure. This was the lesson learned by one group of women in particular. As the wives of the most vaunted “heroes”, the firefighters’ widows were at first the most exalted – “perfect virgins of grief”, New York magazine called them. That is, until the day the virgins began throwing off their habits, and – armed with an average $2m to $3m (£1.5m) in compensation and charity cheques – began to exercise some economic and personal independence. Their private affairs – what they shopped for, where they chose to live, whom they dated – attracted public scrutiny and public reproach. The widows were said to be spending “blood money” on what were invariably referred to as “lavish lifestyles”.

85. bayprairie - 23 February 2008


found guilty as charged!. the epitaph for the BBB written. all ducks floating in the watery row blown clean to pieces by dead-eyed annie oakley.

close the grave over them. they’re toast in any legitimate way.

champion balloon fencer indeed!!

86. marisacat - 23 February 2008

well like a lot of other people, I remember all of those women, and their faces.

Sorry they did nto get it that the husbands were fallen State heros.

And no longer theirs.

87. raincat100 - 23 February 2008

Madman @ 84: Thanks for that link.

88. StupidAsshole - 23 February 2008

83: Why? Because Russia is standing up to the West’s violations of international law on Kosovo. The NYT should also consider doing a piece entitled “When Killing and Ethnically Cleansing Gypsies and Jews is OK.” After all, that’s what our buddies, the KLA, did, while NATO turned a blind eye.

89. liberalcatnip - 23 February 2008

the Shame on you video:

I hide in the closet when mom and dad fight. (lol)

90. StupidAsshole - 23 February 2008
91. Madman in the Marketplace - 23 February 2008

raincat … yvw.

#90 – SA

who knows? I just think discussions should be explored.

92. wu ming - 24 February 2008

we seem to be dodging the worst of the rain and wind out here, thankfully. they just barely got done cleaning up after that big january storm.

93. liberalcatnip - 24 February 2008

Same thing seems to be happening on Pff but isn’t that the fault of lefties who don’t seem to have the same stamina (or maybe the righties are paid which would give them more incentive, don’t know) to stay around and expose the lies they tell ….

It’s not a matter of “stamina”. pff is an inconsequential blog with a bunch of raving loons – left and right (with maybe one or two exceptions on the “left” side). Surely you don’t take it seriously…?

94. liberalcatnip - 24 February 2008

Miss Laura shows her colours and kos steps in. What a sideshow that place is.

95. liberalcatnip - 24 February 2008

Someone’s ego took a little hit:

Look around the site now, how many of the (17+ / 1-)

Recommended by:
Jim J, hester, derridog, Beet, PaintyKat, ironheel, nyceve, high uintas, denise b, andgarden, kitchen sink think tank, panicbean, churchlady, Asinus Asinum Fricat, doinaheckuvanutjob, homerun, ZhenRen
Hidden by:
kid oakland

familiar writers are not posting here now? I used to spend way too much time here, reading some very good diaries from people like Kid Oakland, who has now became only a shill for Obama, like Kos, who has done the same. We have also been invaded by people with only one purpose, and that’s to push their candidate, and now probably 90% of the people here are for Obama, and if anyone else has an opposing view, or support another candidate, then they are subjected to hate that would fit right in on the RW sites.
I hope that the site will get back to what it was prior to the primaries, and the one issue new people will go back to where ever they came from.

JE in 2012

by ichibon on Sat Feb 23, 2008 at 01:29:12 PM MST

96. marisacat - 24 February 2008

those people give me a nosebleed.

97. liberalcatnip - 24 February 2008

I think I’m about to be banned.

98. melvin - 24 February 2008

97–I think they should have a titty fight. The two disputants’ arms are tied behind their backs and their shirts removed. The winner must slap the loser to death using only her two breasts as a weapon.

If Sirota feels insufficiently endowed, he may nominate a second to fight in his place.

99. JJB - 24 February 2008

MCat, no. 7,

Apparently, “Arthur Gilroy” was already an ex-Mayor by 1895. A Google search turned up this tidbit from the NY Times:

EX-MAYOR GILROY HOME; He, His Wife and Children, Greatly Benefited by the Trip Abroad. HE MET MR. CROKER IN LONDON The ex-Mayor Says He Has No Plans — He Declines to Comment on Political Events — He Tells of His Trip.

Even then the family was noted for foreign sojourns. Must have been his great-great granddad, at the least. No CIA back then, maybe the Pinkertons footed the bill.

100. marisacat - 24 February 2008

Not exactly a shock… (MTP doesn’t come on out here for an hour and forty mins):

US consumer advocate Ralph Nader – a candidate in the 2000 and 2004 White House races – announces he will run for the presidency again.

For more details: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news

101. marisacat - 24 February 2008


Works for me! LOL



thanks for that… ugh I just finished the thread to his Egyptian/State Dept trip diary over at Pff.

102. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008

Timmeh is just going back to the spoiler thing over and over again. Ralph is doing pretty good.

103. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008
104. melvin - 24 February 2008

103 — lmao

105. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008
106. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008

He’ll fuck you up!

I’m feeling particularly blasphemous today.

107. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008
108. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008
109. liberalcatnip - 24 February 2008


The President and the Holy Father will continue discussions, which they began during the President’s visit to the Vatican in June 2007, on their common commitment to the importance of faith and reason in reaching shared goals.

That discussion about reason ought to be short and sweet.

110. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008

I thought it was in keeping with my morning blasphemy theme.

111. Madman in the Marketplace - 24 February 2008
112. marisacat - 24 February 2008

Well. I did not know abou this case…but I had figured out in the 90s that Hillary’s vaunted history ‘working for the chilluns’ was a bit of a put up job. Brushed off and bronzed in the first run to give her a good “story”. Wonder if the Wright-Edelmans really face what they did in the 92 campaign. She of Childrens’ Def Fund and he appointed to HHS and resigned over welfare “reform”.

found the Newsday article thru Politico.

113. sabrina - 24 February 2008

Catnip #97 – you said it very well … but they’ll have to ban a lot of people from that thread – probably all 400 or so who rec’d it, as they have threatened to do in the past. Though I doubt they can afford to ban people the way they used to anymore.

Re taking Pff seriously – or any other blog for that matter … not the way I used to, when there was some hope that they could have had some effect on what was happening mainly by spreading information which the US media was covering up ….

Blogs are like newspapers, some with a larger readership than others. I never thought of them as ‘movements’ …. and in the beginning because they brought big groups of people together to go after politicians on their votes, eg, or to help those who were putting themselves on the line and I think they did help, which may be why a decision was made to block them with sites like DK.

Even a small site like Pff has the potential to help spread correct information rather than the propaganda this country is flooded with. Or it can be left to the propagandists …. so if everyone does what they can, no matter how small the effort may be, it can accumulate and eventually have some effect.

We are pretty starved in this country for information so I take it from wherever I can find it and then pass it along to others … but the forces working to suppress information were and are pretty powerful, and overall not much has been accomplished regarding the most important issues, such as the war in Iraq.

114. sabrina - 24 February 2008

Interesting to read that case – #112 Marisacat – I hadn’t heard of it either …. not sure if Hillary could have refused to take it. The article says she did not want to …..

The bottom line is that if any of them cared about children, they would not be supporting unnecessary wars. I wonder if any of them have had the courage to look at the photos from this war, of the dead and wounded children. Or if they care ….

115. marisacat - 24 February 2008

oh I don’t think any of them support children. None of them.

LOL The so called (and always fictitious) red blue divide has been unified: Abortion god guns and gays. Obama merely brings up the rear of the parade with his Elmer Gantry bullshite (it really is over the top).

The Dems are nearly as bad on the whole of it. A soft winger supporting policy on all counts, at the end of the day.

116. Miss Devore - 24 February 2008
117. Hair Club for Men - 24 February 2008

I wonder how long this Kos user is going to last.


118. Hair Club for Men - 24 February 2008

Was cut from Hillary’s campain due to budget difficulties and is currently trying to get a job with McCain.


119. marisacat - 24 February 2008

nu thred………………


120. sabrina - 24 February 2008

Miss D. #116 – I don’t know who is advising her, but she sounds like DHinMi when he tries his pathetic snide tactic …. and look at the comments sectrion. People are just so turned off by that kind of mockery, unless they are Musings et al from DK, who believe in ‘mocking and shaming’. Come to think of it, is Hillary getting advice from the DK troll patrol? I think these last two videos will finish whatever chances she had left ….

Marisacat, #115 – no, I don’t think they care much about children – M.Albright basically said it – that the deaths of so many Iraqi children was ‘worth it’!

121. StupidAsshole - 24 February 2008

117: I believe Eiron is an Israeli. That’s certainly an Israeli name. Not that that will stop them from banning him if he continues not to toe the party line.

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