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Honk for peace… it’s easy! 18 August 2008

Posted by marisacat in 2008 Election, Democrats, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter.

honk for peace

Obama reaps big bucks at S.F. fundraisers

Christine Pelosi, daughter of Speaker Nancy Pelosi, and Kim Clark lead an S.F. crowd in a cheer. (Lacy Atkins / The Chronicle)

Obama was here for a fundraiser at the Fairmont Hotel… pulled in 7.8 million. Apparently a record amt for a SF fundraising event and possibly a record for anywhere. So they say… The main event, a dinner, was the usual 2,300/4,600 cash entry … the VIP after event was 14K for the DNC. Not reported in the TV news but reported in print, the VIP event was for South Asian and Pacific Islander supporters. Someone named Pigeon (no, really) from Ob Finance made sure to get in front of cameras to tell us that they raise “80%” of their COH from the little people, ”under 100USD per donation”. To be frank, I just stopped believing that sometime ago. They are too desperado to tell me that..

Craig Newmark of Craigslist was stopped going in, his comment some mumble (I am not kidding, he was close to incoherent), that we need to “get away from the darkness”. LOL, he would only admit that he paid in the “low thousands” to attend.

I did see that as Ob left, he waved, rather evocative of QEII, to the assembled multitude.

I laughed pretty damned hard at this, from a guy still struggling (so they say) to be perceived as an American, or, not “The Other”… :

Obama told the group – which included many Indian and Pakistani immigrants – that he is not only familiar with their cultures – but also proud of his lifelong association with them.

“Not only do I think I’m a desi, but I’m a desi,” he said, using a colloquial term that describes South Asian immigrants. The remark was greeted with laughs. “I’m a homeboy.”

He said that when he went to Occidental College, his first roommate was Pakistani. And in his dorm, he said with a laugh, “Indians and Pakistanis came together under one roof … to cause havoc in the university.”

To applause, he said he became an expert at cooking dal and other ethnic dishes, though “somebody else made the naan,” the trademark Indian bread.

“Those are friendships which have lasted … for years, and continue until this day,” he said. “I have an enormous personal affection for the people of South Asia.”

“I’ve also had an orientation toward Asia and a recognition … that over time we are going to see … more economic growth” and an economic partnership with the United States that is strategic.

I realise it is pro forma to burble happily to the specific audience (drip honey on their pocketbooks, in fact drip that honey anywhere it works), but that is not really the situation with Obama.

From playing patty cake with Rick Warren, to fronting apologies for T Boone, to assuring the S Asian and Pacific Islanders, millionaires and multi-millionaires, that things will go on, just as they have.

We are so blessed. No, we really are. La Nan says so:

He was warmly received by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, who called him “a leader that God has blessed us with at this time.”

Got that? God sent him. To us.

You cannot make this shit up, nor do we have to: They serve it to us in Dixie Cups.


Tapper has a different take on the fundraiser, different number$ and what event (of three) was for who. Life is tough.

Last, please god let it end. I cannot take any more public displays of the American Man Hug. No mas!



Impeach them all!

[I snitched this from a diary of buddydrama (sp?) at PFF, better than the one I had used before, of Impeach day at San Francisco’s Ocean Beach.]



1. diane - 18 August 2008

…pulled in 7.8 million….2,300/4,600 cash entry … the VIP event was for South Asian and Pacific Islander supporters.

sounds like not just any, South Asian/Pacific Islander, supporters….

so, so sick of watching the purchasing of legislation….

so sick of receiving emails soliciting money in exchange for letting us weep on their patronizing shoulders about injustice they don’t ever intend to rectify.

such a cesspool

2. marisacat - 18 August 2008

so sick of receiving emails soliciting money in exchange for letting us weep on their patronizing shoulders about injustice they don’t ever intend to rectify.

Yup. the close of the SFGATE article…

“I don’t need to convince this room of the nature of the changes that are needed. … We’ve got an economy that is not working,” an energy policy that is “killing the budgets of American families” and “a foreign policy that has been based on bluster and bombast.”

“We are going to go out there and run the best presidential campaign that you have seen. …We are going to win this election. We’re going to change the country and we’re going to change the world … so keep your stress to a minimum.”

Peter Shah, a certified public accountant from Salinas – and one of the Asian Pacific Islanders who paid $14,000 to meet Obama – said he made the investment because he is still undecided in the race.

“I want to look into his eyes, and make sure … maybe God will give us a president who will help the common man,” he said.

Big big con. the candidate and the exhorters, party whips and supporters, esp at this level.

I did laugh, media asked Kamala Harris, our DA and a big ob supporter, about the NYT article on money people, big fundraisers and elected Dems worrying about ob, saying to get specific on hope (snicker)… she was irritated. Said he HAS been specific and in so many words, Shut up and get with the program.

All you can do is laugh.

3. diane - 18 August 2008

last I heard, for those who believe in a God, $14,000 was not a necessity to communicate with that God…matter of fact, quite the hindrance, further, an enormous offence against that God…..

so disgusting…

4. diane - 18 August 2008

I’ve been told I should grow up…get with it….


5. marisacat - 18 August 2008

Not too many friends left for the Edwardses.

6. NYCO - 18 August 2008

A new member of the Mickey Mouse Club:

Jim Goldstein, 38, a Web strategist from San Francisco, said he signed up for the text messages because they offered a direct channel to the Obama campaign. The prospect of being one of the first to hear about the vice-presidential pick was especially enticing, he said.

“It’s not often in this day and age that a voter is made to feel like they’re being put first versus the press, big donors and lobbyists,” Mr. Goldstein said.

Are Americans really that needy for attention that they think this is a big deal? Oy.

Reminds me of A Christmas Story where the kid sent away for his secret Ovaltine decoder ring and breathlessly used it, only to find out it spelled out “DRINK MORE OVALTINE.”

7. marisacat - 18 August 2008

The Caucus looks at the stupid aftermath of the Warren Question Hour. What a fucked mess. What they leave out is that Ob people felt he did poorly (more than one report around on that) and they hustled to send out the Big Info that the sick old dodderer was not in a cone of silence. Andrea Mitchell got the fax and hustled to help band-aid for Ob. She says she jsut reported. LOL.

Can you imagine the whining and angst if Ob flubs one f the debates?


Over and over it is all about Ob. Crashing bore and in danger of maxing out peoples’ patience, much less INTEREST.

8. NYCO - 18 August 2008

Oh, and from the same story…

Campaign officials say they want text messaging to feel like a dialogue. When subscribers reply and ask questions about basic political issues, the software sends an automated answer; other questions may receive replies from a campaign staff member.

Q: What feels like sex, but isn’t actually sex?

9. marisacat - 18 August 2008


Reminds me of a NYT article on Ob fundraising a few months ago. The last line said the little people would keep pungling up — as long as they felt they were part of a movement.

10. marisacat - 18 August 2008



it’s a MOVEMENT. Get with the script!

11. diane - 18 August 2008

This is new? …and do I whiff Aquino?

Army spends $4 million towards developing gadget to translate thoughts

The collaborators are such a shock:

University of California, Irvine; Carnegie Mellon University; and the University of Maryland.

Thinking of Gloria Naylor’s 1996 ……

They have so much power now they’re normalizing all the vile shit that’s been going on for years, and pretending it’s new and quite normal technology…

Yes, we are so fucked….

12. diane - 18 August 2008


jeez, and I love Ovaltine,closest thing to a malted I can think of…

13. lucid - 18 August 2008

Q: What feels like sex, but isn’t actually sex?

His name should be Barak Orgasma.

14. NYCO - 18 August 2008

Hilarious dKos post of the day.

Look, Petraeus is a man with a mission. A mission we don’t like and that should not have been given him but it became his job nonetheless. His position is to do what he is told to the best of his ability. I don’t (necessarily) hold what he has been asked to do against him.

Beyond that, I know nothing of his politics. But for sheer audacity and Republican head-exploding – I like it.

15. diane - 18 August 2008

Oh really?

Potential for Conflict Grows With Government’s Use of Contractors

”For years, Science Applications International Corp. served as an adviser to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission on the development of rules for when radioactive materials could be released from nuclear facilities for recycling.

At the same time, SAIC worked as a contractor on just such a recycling project at a Department of Energy facility, but it did not disclose the conflict as required by federal regulations, according to evidence gathered by the Justice Department. A company executive also helped run an association that advocated for favorable recycling standards, and the firm was planning a business that could have been affected by rules it was helping to write, Justice documents show. …

16. diane - 18 August 2008

The bolding tags seem to get funky sometimes across sentences, had intended to bold this in my last post (currently 15):

At the same time, SAIC worked as a contractor on just such a recycling project at a Department of Energy facility

17. diane - 18 August 2008

Honk for peace indeed:

NYPD seeks to screen vehicles entering Manhattan

The New York Police Department is working on a plan to track every car, truck or other vehicle entering Manhattan and screen them for radioactive materials and other terrorism threats…..

18. cad - 18 August 2008

Are there any liberals left at DK? It looks like a circlejerk of libertarian democrats, Kos included.

And from that Patreus thread, SarahLee, everybody’s favorite anal post hall monitor, chimes in to control the unruly tags:

Fixed your name tags (0+ / 0-)

The Tagging guidelines request that when names are used both the first and last names should be included (with no titles), and in cases like the George Bushes – the middle initials are essential.

Also you cannot put punctuation like exclamation marks or question marks or quotation marks in tags so fixed the “snark!” tag as well.

Healthcare for ALL! NOW! & OneCare at MySpace

by SarahLee on Mon Aug 18, 2008 at 12:31:46 PM PDT

19. diane - 18 August 2008

Great read by Stupiddy at pff The American Psychological Association, APA, is Mentally ILL

….The APA ethics office wants to know if interrogations of innocent people who have been kidnapped, imprisoned and never charged with a crime by an illegal invading army can be interrogated in an “ethical” manner. So says Stephen Behnke. Stephen Behnke is a disturbed personality. He views interrogation without context. And that’s a kind of denial and intellectualized rubbish common among people who go around masquerading their disturbances by obtaining degrees in psychology and then joining “ethics” committees which further obfuscate some perverse inner criminal urges…..

20. diane - 18 August 2008

Too rich, the updated anthrax story: FBI had, then tossed anthrax type used in attacks

….FBI Assistant Director Vahid Majidi said Monday the initial anthrax sample that Ivins took from his Army lab in February 2002 and gave investigators did not meet court-ordered conditions for its preparation and collection.

In a briefing for reporters, Majidi said the sample kept at the FBI lab was destroyed because the bureau believed it might not have been allowed as evidence at trial….”

21. wilfred - 18 August 2008

Programming note for those of you with HBO. The documentary about Helen Thomas, “Thank You Mr. President” airs tonight at 9pm.

22. wilfred - 18 August 2008

NYCO, are you familiar with the new film “Frozen River”? I saw it yesterday in NYC and thought of you. It’s all filmed near Plattsburgh and features the Mowhawk Nation and they credited the Oneida in the end credits.

23. NYCO - 18 August 2008

22. Yes, I have heard of it and really want to see it; but ironically it’s not playing anywhere around here yet. Thanks for the added recommendation!

24. marisacat - 18 August 2008

LOL Who said this:

“I left the country convinced that Russia’s invasion of Georgia may be the one of the most significant event to occur in Europe since the end of communism.”

“The outcome there will determine whether we realize the grand ambition of a Europe that is whole, free, and at peace.”

The motor mouth of the paper tiger. (He also said the US needs to help Georgia rebuild.)

We are so fucking screwed.

25. wilfred - 18 August 2008

#23 It has 2 very good lead performances (by women!) and it spoke to a lot of different issues. Sorry, spelled Mohawk wrong in that post.

Also an interesting article in today’s NY Times about windmill farms in upstate NY and how the corruption and self-interest abounds.

26. wilfred - 18 August 2008

He also said the US needs to help Georgia rebuild.

New Orleans first.

27. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008


and money is the laxative. Gonna be an unpleasant burning feeling afterward, though.

28. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008

Bill Would End Ban on Photos of Returning Military Dead

Of course, the impact of the returning bodies will become obvious just in time for the War Criminal in Chief to be out of office.

29. marisacat - 18 August 2008


New Orleans has devolved to be little more than a ICE, and DHS, experiment of waging war on a US city.

30. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008

Speaking of ICE:

Iowa Town Becomes “Open Air” Prison for Wives and Children of Detained Undocumented Workers

The town of Postville, Iowa, population 2,000, has been turned into an open-air prison. Jerry Johnson, who works at nearby Luther College, called it something out of a bad science-fiction movie or the kind of thing a 1930s totalitarian regime might have cooked up.

“This was not only a grievous injustice but a shame on the state of Iowa and the federal government,” said Mr. Johnson. “These were good, decent people who were also the most defenseless.”

On May 12, immigration officials swooped in to arrest 400 undocumented workers from Mexico and Guatemala at the local meat-packing plant, a raid described as the biggest such action at a single site in U.S. history. The raid left 43 women, wives of the men who were taken away, and their 150 children without status or a means of support. The women cannot leave the town, and to make sure they do not they have been outfitted with leg monitoring bracelets.

“The women are effectively prisoners,” said Father Paul Ouderkirk at St. Bridget’s Roman Catholic Church. “The difference between them and anybody who is in jail is that in jail the government pays for them, but if they’re on the streets we pay for them.

“What kind of a government makes prisoners of 43 mothers who all have children and then says, ‘You can’t work, you can’t leave and can’t stay?’ That boggles the imagination.”

A spokesman for Immigration and Customs Enforcement said the law does not provide for work authorization for illegals.

Since the raid, St. Bridget’s, with a staff of four, has raised $500,000 to pay for rent, clothing, food and other necessities of life. Donations have come from other faith groups and individuals who have read about the raid.

Fr. Ouderkirk, who has spent 50 years as a priest and had been in retirement for five years, was called back to active duty by the parish when the crisis hit. “It is the most difficult, most challenging situation I have ever faced. And yet, strangely, the incident that has been most strengthening of my faith. It shows there are a lot of compassionate people because if there weren’t, we wouldn’t be able to do what we’re doing.”

31. marisacat - 18 August 2008

Il oved all the sloppy retail sales gibberish Ob and his spewed about Iowa. BAR reported over and over and over the color line inequity of their prison (indoor) numbers. Highest incarceration (iirc) per capita of blacks in the nation.

32. marisacat - 18 August 2008

Catching a Rev Joel Hunter on TNH… with a congragation outside Orlando… he will officiate one night at the Dem party convention.

EVANGELICAL. (He preaches “whole life” bullshit)

I’d like to leave the revival tent. Again.

33. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008
34. marisacat - 18 August 2008

Rev Richard Land (also on Lehrer) loves to point out that Ob is not doing as well with evangelicals as KERRY did.

Hunter jumps in to say he can improve these numbers by emphasising CHOOSING LIFE.

Revival Tent! Not only will they bring back the old panels for abortion access (banned as unconstitutional) but they will be RELIGIOUS.

35. marisacat - 18 August 2008


I have been running from that story for two days.

36. marisacat - 18 August 2008

The Rev Hunter finishes up by saying that babies can be saved by convincing mothers to carry to term.

There was no mention of gays or gay marriage – at all.. As predicted in the past, abortion will remain the dirty filthy thing to hang women over.

37. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008
38. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008

Oh, dear Gawd, do they listen to themselves:

Update II: NBC News reports Biden is the leading contender “partly due to his working-class roots and foreign policy expertise.”

Biden is the son of a millworker? Oh, no … looked it up. Son of a CAR SALESMAN, now wholly-owned Senator of the credit card usurers. Carrying on the family tradition of selling lemons.

39. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008
40. marisacat - 18 August 2008

If you read the full text of Biden’s comments after returning from Georgia, he will work to overshadow Ob. LOL And with the stammer and the deer in the headlights stuff it won’t b hard.

41. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008

Can’t wait for B&O, the wonder team!

At JFK Airport, Denying Basic Rights Is Just Another Day at the Office

There was one British tourist in the group. Paul (also not his real name) was traveling with three friends who had passed through customs soon after their plane landed and were waiting for him on the other side of the metal barrier; he suspected he had been detained because of his dark skin. When he asked if he could go to the bathroom, one of the guards said, “I wouldn’t.” “What if someone has to?” I asked. “They will just have to hold it,” the guard responded with a smile. Paul began to cry. I watched as he, over the course of four hours, went from feeling exuberant about his trip to New York to despising the entire country. “I speak the Queen’s English,” he said to me. “I’m third-generation British. I came to America because I’ve always wanted to come here, and now they’ve got me so scared that all I want to do is go home. We’re paying for your stupid war anyway.”

To be powerless and mocked at the same time makes one feel ashamed, which leads quickly to rage. Within a few hours of my arrival, I saw at least 10 people denied the right to use the bathroom or buy food and water. I watched my traveling companion duck under a barrier, run to the bathroom and slip back into the holding section — which, of course, someone of another ethnicity in a state of panic would be very reluctant to do. The United States is good at naming enemies, but apparently we are even better at making them, especially of individuals. I don’t know if it’s worse for national security — and more embarrassing for Americans — that this is the first experience tourists have of our country, or that some U.S. citizens get treated this way upon entering their own country.

It’s time for people to realize that it isn’t their country. The lesson in this is that if someone w/ authority and/or a uniform decides you’re other, then that is what you are, until they decide otherwise.

42. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008

After four hours, I finally demanded to speak to the guards’ supervisor, and he was called down. I asked if the detainees could file a formal complaint. He said there were complaint forms (which, in English and Spanish, direct one to the Department of Homeland Security’s Web site, where one must enter extensive personal information in order to file a “Trip Summary”) but initially refused to hand them out or to give me his telephone number. “The Department of Homeland Security is understaffed, underfunded, and I have men here who are doing 14-hour days.” He tried to intimidate me when I wrote down his name — “So, you’re writing down our names. Well, we have more on you” — and asked me questions about my address and my profession in front of the rest of the people detained. I pointed out a few of the families who had missed their flights and had been waiting seven hours. His voice barely controlled, his lip curled into a smirk, he explained slowly, condescendingly, that they need only go to the ticket counter at Jet Blue and reschedule so they could fly out in an hour. One mother responded with what he must have already known: Jet Blue goes to most destinations only once or twice a day and her whole family would have to sleep in the airport.

A large crowd began to gather. Everyone wanted to voice complaints. I explained to the supervisor that his guards had been making people afraid. He flipped through the green files, tossing the American passports to the front of the pile. “You should have gone first, before these people. American citizens first — that’s how it should be.” In the face of dozens of requests and questions, he turned and left.

The guards processed me then, ignoring the order of arrivals, if there ever had been one. They refused to distribute more complaint forms or call the supervisor back down at the request of Arab families. One officer threatened, “I’m talking politely to you now. If you don’t sit down, I won’t be talking politely to you anymore.” One announced that because “the American girl” had gotten angry, the families would have to wait a few more hours. “The supervisor is not coming back.”

43. NYCO - 18 August 2008

30. Clearly, Fr. Ouderkirk is mentally ill…

44. marisacat - 18 August 2008

Ouderkirk makes the case, the very real one, for faith outreach (so did many of the faith and church groups that went to NO in the aftermath) but he is not the norm.

Shamefully. He shuld be the norm.

45. NYCO - 18 August 2008

Yes, but I don’t believe Ouderkirk is doing “faith outreach.” He’s just living his faith… playing out his mental illness, I suppose.

Which illustrates a point: Only crazy folks are going to have the strength to stand up to the might’n’majesty of Caesar (whatever their form of madness takes, religious or secular…).

A not totally related thought…

The problem with this year’s crop of Democrats is that they are so sane and reasonable. The netroots is like the classic nice guy who never gets the girl and whines that he’s everything that girls say they want, but they never go for him. Democrats: Stuck in the voters’ Friend Zone.

46. marisacat - 18 August 2008

i agree.. I just meant when outreach in a community comes from a church or church group.

Did nto mean Office of Faith Based Initiatives. Which, whether under Ob or W, is a fucked game.

47. marisacat - 18 August 2008

Obama is screwwed. or scrwed himself. I am listening to an entire day, off and on, of excuses for Ob (it is really resonating that he did poorly at Saddleback), via local, SF KGO call in radio.

B-b-b-b-b-but God sent him to us. La Nan said so.

48. diane - 18 August 2008

Interior starts counting off 30-day comment period on Endangered Species act

The clock has started ticking down for anyone who wants to comment on the Department of Interior’s proposed overhaul of the Endangered Species Act, which could cut out the independent reviews of whether a government decision will affect species in danger of extinction.

The notice was posted in the Federal Register on Friday, giving anyone who wants to weigh in on the changes until Sept. 15.

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service will accept comments through the eRulemaking portal [ http://www.regulations.gov/ ] but won’t accept e-mail or faxes.

Public comment periods are often extended on controversial issues. But the federal government’s reluctance to accept e-mail comments has itself engendered controversy. Federal officials say they can be inundated with mass mailings from well-organized interest groups. In the past, land management officials have gone so far as to say they give greater consideration individual letters and discount campaign e-mails and letters…..”

49. marisacat - 18 August 2008

LOL Joel Hunter is a registered Republican. Via TAP:

The pro-life contingent that has been pressing the Democratic Party to embrace “abortion reduction” now includes not just life-long Democrats but Republican Catholics and evangelicals who want to shift their focus away from overturning Roe v. Wade and toward, as they frame it, making abortion less frequent.

In a conference call with reporters on Tuesday, a group including the Rev. Jim Wallis of the evangelical group Sojourners, the Rev. Tony Campolo of the Party’s platform committee, former Reagan administration official Doug Kmiec, and the Rev. Joel Hunter, who has described himself as “to the right of Attila the Hun,” all lauded the new (or rather, not so new) platform language.

Can I leave the Revival Tent again? These people are not mild moderates, they are people with a CLEAR AGENDA.

50. diane - 18 August 2008

So who does everyone have their money on for VP choice?

I’m still betting it’s Hillary…to make our “GIFT” complete…

What are people guessing on that station marisa?

51. marisacat - 18 August 2008

Oh don’t worry about the Endangered Species Act or the EPA, the religionists are on it. Ob will restore all, with Jesus holding his hand. Joel Hunter says so:

So, as Christians, we are caring for God’s environment, we’re caring for the poor, we’re caring about healing ministries. Now, that’s always been a part of who we were, but, in process of voting and evaluating who we’re going to vote for, those have recently become more important.

Of course fucking evangelicals had to be FLOWN up to the retreating ice mass to prove to them it ws shrinking. Couldn’t god call them?

52. marisacat - 18 August 2008


as state polls tighten (RCP charts looked dire for ob in battle ground, as of this am, McCain ahead in too many) the push for Hillary increases.

I don’t see any good choices out there (including Hillary, tho as moiv said, don’t they just deserve each other, LOL) He might have to choose Kaine to make sure he is not out shined. Or whatever the appropriate word is.

53. marisacat - 18 August 2008

hmm a lot of talk yesterday about Bayh. Biden today. FWIW, NTIM, LOL

54. marisacat - 18 August 2008

More from PBS/Lehrer linked above (#51):

REV. JOEL HUNTER: That certainly is. The life issue is the key issue.

Now, how you parse it — I think, if there is room for him to give a case that thousands or hundreds of thousands of babies can be saved by supporting mothers who decide to carry their babies to term, that may be enough, when you talk about the other lives that could be saved, through the issues of AIDS, there’s millions of lives there, the creation care, also lots of lives, 30,000 a day die from poverty. And so that could be a strong life issue, also.

LOL “creation care” is the earth, environment, poverty.

55. diane - 18 August 2008

Of course fucking evangelicals had to be FLOWN up to the retreating ice mass to prove to them it ws shrinking. Couldn’t god call them?

now, now marisa…(and no leaving the clown tent NO EXIT)…guess we can all have a bleak laugh when they go on their Caribbean vacations and get nailed by lion fish, if they manage to avoid the jellies….

56. diane - 18 August 2008

On a serious note, if these false prophets really cared about life, we wouldn’t still be in Iraq (would’ve never gone), the raging domestic abuse against females would have been addressed, and there would be a roar heard about the inability to support even a one child household for millions of Americans….The churches that are actually doing something beneficial, should get together and call the fakers to task, loud and clear…………….

57. diane - 18 August 2008

I don’t know why, but I was just reminded of Sharon Stone’s ex being bit by some rare lizard, on an exclusive $pecial person’s only, Birthday Gift, one on one audience with said lizard……

(and yes I am getting sick of all of our Special Folk…color me jaded)

58. marisacat - 18 August 2008

it’s all

WORSHIP THE BABY!! … the foetus, the cell mass, the zygote, the blasto-whatever [i can t spell it]

59. marisacat - 18 August 2008


oh what a stupid event that was. It was the publisher of the SF Chronicle (SFGate.com). Special zoo night for donors and local celebs. I thnk SS has moved on from SF, as their marriage went kaput. I used to see them around.

60. diane - 18 August 2008

I used to see them around.

weren’t you blessed, hope you had sunglasses on…;0)….I hear sunglasses won’t even work in the face of Brangelina…..

61. diane - 18 August 2008


Related mentality with smoking: save your babies, but make absolute parriahs out of smoking adults (CIGARS and PIPES a moneyed exeption), while admitting it’s the most addictive substance there is; allowing the tobacco companies to steadily jack up nicotine levels, along with likely cough suppresants and whatever; and making millions of tobacco taxes.

I’m familiar with one rather influential Children’s Hospital, which had investments that included the tobacco industry….

62. marisacat - 18 August 2008

yeah I could care less about banning cigarettes (where they are headed, in SF now they want to restrict them from sales in “pharmacies” so now we must debate, “what si a pharmacy”… Jeeebers) or labeling alcoholic beverages warning every pregnant woman on earth from breathing near the open bottle.

Lunatic nation. No common sense. In lvoe with prohibitions. Sin taxes. Wages of finger pointing sin.

It is just endless.

63. Madman in the Marketplace - 18 August 2008

.The churches that are actually doing something beneficial, should get together and call the fakers to task, loud and clear…………….

and it only goes to show them up as frauds too that they don’t.

64. diane - 18 August 2008

I love the incandescant bulb ban (which I believe Harman sponsored) those energy savers are many times not sealed properly, and loaded with mercury, unfortunately, I bought way too many of them….


I think many of those churches are likely overwhelmed, I’ve met some really decent (and highly intelligent, though that hasn’t ever been an indicator of kindness) people who go to church…I’d be an absolute fool to discount them.

65. CSTAR - 18 August 2008

Life before birth–life after death?

Who cares, if there’s not much life for the living.

66. marisacat - 19 August 2008

hmm Ben Smith…

August 18, 2008
Categories: Barack Obama

Wake up early…

The Times reports that Obama’s planning an early morning text alert to supporters of his running mate.

Not, we and the Times both think, tomorrow morning. And we don’t seem to know which morning. But morning it is

KGO was saying “in two days”, which would be Wed. But, who knows.

67. marisacat - 19 August 2008

what fun. Tavis Smiley has on some descendant of Niebuhr, who has a book out on what else, RELIGION. He says religion in the 21st c will be what ideology was in the 20th.

There is no getting away from it.

68. marisacat - 19 August 2008

This gave me a chuckle. In a way, in a very roundabout way, they get it. The party, and party aligned orgs (it’s a long list) is not there for women.

[E]very member has her own plans for November, including for a few, voting for Obama. Co-founder Amy Siskind, a former Wall Street exec and Clinton fundraiser, told me, “I won’t vote for Obama, but I’m not sure what I’ll do.” Cynthia Ruccia, a Democratic activist from Columbus, Ohio, who twice ran against Republican John Kasich, is supporting McCain — and organizing other Democrats in her swing state to do likewise.


DNC chairman Howard Dean has called Ruccia twice. “He was just waking up to the thought that women around the country were upset over the treatment of Hillary,” she told me. Ruccia tends to doubt that putting Clinton’s name to a roll-call vote will mollify many of the female holdouts. “The train left the station a long time ago,” she said.

Howard will be the single best known DNC chair, and the most disgraced. All day today, as the excuses for Obama raged across the local so called liberal phone lines, over and over I heard about the youth vote, it would LOL save us and they would vote for ob.

One thing about women and older women, for decades they showed up and voted.

I think the youth vote historically does abut what can [reasonably] be expected of it (for a party that cares nothing for youth), in smallish increments they DO show up. But you can’t necessarily build on it. The Democrats TALK more aobut the youth vote than they care abou tit, in real ways..

69. marisacat - 19 August 2008

oh… and this was the close to the Harrop article (above)… gave me a chuckle:

For many of these women, whatever nice things Clinton says about Obama in Denver won’t matter much. They have decided that they can live with McCain, and they’re already inoculated against the crude anatomical references that left-wing bloggers will send their way. (There’s not one they haven’t heard.) Hillary can’t do much to change their feelings — even if she wanted to.

70. marisacat - 19 August 2008

hmm FWIW Clemons says signs point to Biden. I think somtimes Clemons is too impressed with – and by – the people who whisper to him… but LOL he took heat on the post on Clark… and stood up to it.

Who knows.

71. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Bloomberg on all the boards and other association of Bayh wif.

72. NYCO - 19 August 2008

You won’t get any argument from me on false prophets. But what’s at work in closed systems in churches (abusive churches and the like) is also at work in other, secular closed systems. It’s not a “religion” problem, unless you see religion present in certain secular systems (which I do). “Religion” meaning any system of belief, be it a belief in Olympic glory or the power of the presidency or what have you.

73. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Well I don’t like Jack Welch any more than I do US Catholic bishops.

Both are running our lives.

74. JJB - 19 August 2008

MCat, no. 24,

I left the country convinced that Russia’s invasion of Georgia may be the one of the most significant event[s] to occur in Europe since the end of communism.”

“The outcome there will determine whether we realize the grand ambition of a Europe that is whole, free, and at peace.”

Since Senator HisMind’sOnVacationButHisMouth’sWorkingOvertime is apparently going to be either Veep or Secy of State in the Obama administration, someone might want to tell him that Georgia is in Asia, not Europe (“Senator, if it’s east of the Urals or south of the Caucasus . . .”).

Speaking of Georgia, it seems the Russians are behaving like the Israelis in Lebanon/Gaza/West Bank:

Russian soldiers in armed personnel carriers blockaded the main commercial port in the Black Sea town of Poti on Tuesday and took Georgian soldiers prisoner.

An explosion could be heard from the port, where Russian troops sank Georgian ships earlier this week. An Associated Press report said 22 Georgians were being held.

The situation was evolving, but if Russian forces have seized control of the port it is further evidence of continued Russian military activity on Georgian territory despite reassurances that they would withdraw.

The situation was tense, with a ring of Georgian police officers surrounding the port. Russian forces have patrolled the area regularly since entering Georgia from the west 10 days ago.

Since the Kremlin claimed on Monday to have begun withdrawing troops from Georgia, there has been little evidence of change on the ground. Further east from Poti, Russian soldiers continued digging in to positions along the highway approaching the Georgian capital, Tbilisi, showing no sign of pulling back from the severest confrontation between Russia and the West since the collapse of the Soviet Union.

In addition, Russian troops were building new checkpoints on Tuesday a few miles north of the central Georgian city of Gori, using backhoes to cut deep trenches at the edge of the town of Karaleti and using cranes to stack concrete blocks into barricades.

The checkpoints in Karaleti seemed to be in line with information the Russians released a day earlier, which clarified the scope of their proposed withdrawal. A 1999 document written up by the Joint Control Commission, an international body that monitored tensions in South Ossetia, gives peacekeepers access to a long piece of land that extends about nine miles into Georgian territory, and right through Karaleti.

The Russian president, Dmitri A. Medvedev, has said Russian peacekeepers would pull back from other Georgian territory but remain inside that area.


On the ground in Georgia, about 25 miles outside the capital along the main highway, four Russian armored personnel carriers passed a Russian checkpoint at the village of Igoeti on Monday and headed in the other direction, toward Tbilisi. Soldiers were piled on top, cradling Kalashnikov rifles.

As they drove by, one old man, Koba Gurnashvili, stepped into the road and yelled at them, “Where do you think you’re going!” One of the soldiers yelled back, “To Tbilisi.”

But they did not, instead turning up a side road leading to a village near the border with South Ossetia. They stopped at an intersection blocked by Georgian police cars.

The Russian commander climbed off his tank and began arguing with the Georgian police officers. He said he had orders to move up the road; a Georgian officer said he had orders to remain on the road, and asked to call his superiors for guidance. The Russian said, “You have three minutes to move your cars.”

The two argued for a few minutes more. Then the police officers stepped away from their cars, stone-faced, with their keys. The tank smashed aside the cars and kept going.

That incident described after the snip makes an interesting contrast to what out troops’ behavior in a similar situation in Iraq would probably be.

75. NYCO - 19 August 2008
76. marisacat - 19 August 2008

hmm maybe Nelson of FL. Ob needs to win states. Latest head to head (in fact for weeks) McC is ahead in FL having spent nohting on ads, ob has spent 6 mil on FL ads.

77. marisacat - 19 August 2008


Obviously I agree… all I could think of is that the language was a sop to Saakashvilli. Who I read flies the EU flag alongside the Georgian one.

A lot of expectations are not going to be met. LOL Suppose these states/countries/former bits of USSR, any of them, had belonged to NATO.

Good luck to someone.

78. JJB - 19 August 2008

Madman, no. 38,

The new definition of “working class” for politicos and media mavens appears to be “anyone who works for a living.” I first became aware of this phenomenon while watching a Billy Joel “Behind The Music” (remember them?) special a number of years ago. The announcer said Joel hailed from the “tough, working class town of Hicksville, NY” (then as now a middle-class bedroom community for NYC commuters, although at the time there were still some farms, as well as a huge Grumann plant where the workers made what were very nice salaries for the time), and they showed pictures of him as a child in a backyard that looked identical to the one my Hicksville cousins grew up in (their father was a commercial photographer/filmmaker), possibly on the very same street. The town did have its downscale area, but even that was safe enough for a woman to leave her toddler son to sit at the bar of his grandfather’s tavern, consuming pretzels and ginger ale while she shopped at the nearby shopping center.

Anyway, any number of people in politics and the media have sought to cover up the comfortable circumstances in which they were raised, Bill O’Reilly being the most absurd example I can think of (daddy was an accountant for a big oil company). Tim Russert’s claim to being “a blue-collar guy from Buffalo” also seems a stretch to me. His father certainly was a blue-collar guy, but he managed to make enough money to raise his kids in a fashion that was at least one cut above working class.

IIRC, the late Michael Kelly described himself in this way, in spite of the fact that his father was an editor or reporter of high stature at the old Washington Star. MoDo has also coyly claimed working class roots at various times, despite growing up in Chevy Chase Circle.

I guess the idea is that it somehow makes you seem more authoritative, more genuine (whatever that might mean) than if you simply admit you’re a child of the middle class.

79. marisacat - 19 August 2008


Think Bill O Reilly likes to claim Levittown as his manger.

80. JJB - 19 August 2008


Yes, he does. Levittown was no working class area at the time he was growing up, nor is it now. And it seems he may really have grown up in Old Westbury, which is quite a few notches above Levittown on the socio-economic scale.

81. JJB - 19 August 2008

Things sure are going great over in Afghanistan:

Taliban insurgents mounted their most serious attacks in six years of fighting, one a complex attack with multiple suicide bombers on a United States military base Monday night, and another by some 100 insurgents on French forces in a district east of the capital, killing 10 French soldiers and wounding 21 others, military officials said Tuesday.

Three American soldiers were wounded and six members of the Afghan special forces in the attack on the base in the eastern province of Khost, bordering Pakistan, the Afghan military spokesman, General Zaher Azimi, said. The battle lasted all night, 10 suicide bombers were killed or blew themselves up, and the insurgents were repulsed without entering the base, he said.

The heavy fighting in the two places marks a sharp escalation in insurgent operations in what is already Afghanistan’s deadliest year since the United States’ intervention in 2001.. . . Before the attack Monday, 173 foreign soldiers had been killed in Afghanistan this year, including 99 American soldiers and 74 from other nations. The number shows an increase in the rate of killings over 2007, when the total for the year was 232, the highest number since the war began in 2001.


The fighting in the district of Sarobi, east of the capital, Kabul, Monday night involved an unusually large insurgent force and resulted in even heavier casualties. Ten French soldiers were killed and 21 wounded, a statement issued by the NATO force in Kabul said, making the fighting the most deadly for foreign troops in Afghanistan since fighting in 2005.

French troops have only recently taken over from American forces in the area, as part of the expanded French deployment in Afghanistan under President Nicolas Sarkozy.

82. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Obama’s war to be … Afghanistan.

I heard about the 10 French soliders this am… and something that slipped by me about 10 Afghanis as well.

On and on it goes.

83. marisacat - 19 August 2008

LOL Ben Smith has an ’88 ad from Biden in hsi run.

A classic Joe Biden ad from 1988, which begins:

“The White House isn’t the place to learn how to deal with international crisis, the balance of power, war and peace, and the economic future of the next generation. A President has got to know the territory, but that’s not enough.”

Experience was a major theme of Biden’s pitch in the primary (take the above, and add 20 years), and it’s a contrast they’ll have to aim to avoid if he’s Obama’s running mate.

84. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Lovely. Russians took possession/hostagae of Georgian troops, 20 of them, and apparently made off with US Humvees waiting to be shipped back to the US. Well that is what the radio update said.

Here it is:

POTI, Georgia – Russian soldiers took about 20 Georgian troops prisoner at a key Black Sea port in western Georgia on Tuesday, blindfolding them and holding them at gunpoint, and commandeered American Humvees awaiting shipment back to the United States.

The move came as a small column of Russian tanks and armored vehicles left the strategic Georgian city of Gori in the first sign of a Russian pullback of troops from Georgia after a cease-fire intended to end fighting that reignited Cold War tensions. The two countries on Tuesday also exchanged prisoners captured during their brief war.

However, Russian soldiers took Georgian servicemen prisoner in Poti and commandeered the U.S. Humvees. An Associated Press photographer saw Russian trucks and armored personnel carriers leaving the port with about 20 blindfolded and handcuffed men riding on them. /snip/

85. NYCO - 19 August 2008

Joe Biden ran for president umpteen times and America didn’t want him umpteen times; why would they want him as vice president? He’s past his sell-by date.

I imagine this has to be an agonizing decision for Obama because his VP pick can’t be rearranged as easily as his own issue positions. Which means that Obama’s VP is… (drum roll)… Mr. Potato Head. You heard it here first folks.

86. lucid - 19 August 2008

85 – he should enlist that ficus plant Michael Moore ran for Congress back in 2000. It was extremely adept in the debates.

87. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Puh-leezze. Ob’s VP is a mirror. LOL or that would be Ob’s best choice…

Oh Biden is senate left overs. But no matter who goes in, we are getting DEFUNCT US SENATE.

Spreading the poisonous non-joy.

88. lucid - 19 August 2008

87 – well, he is a rock star after all. He needs to make sure his hair is just right.

89. marisacat - 19 August 2008

via KGO

the geeks are finding out a couple of things. If it matters. ObamaNelson forwards to BarackObama.com..


ObamaSibelius is owned by BarackObama.com


90. marisacat - 19 August 2008

please god no.

Tim Kaine is saying his grandparents and Ob’s come from teh same small KS town.


91. CSTAR - 19 August 2008

Huffpost headline


Isn’t this a little indecorous? Of course when I first read it I missed “ANNOUNCE HIS”.

92. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Does Michelle know?

93. JJB - 19 August 2008

Counterpunch today has two pieces that discuss the very real possibility that the imbroglio in the Caucasus could lead to nuclear war. As unlikely as this seems, as I still think it is, it’s all too possible that the escalating rhetoric, as well as Russia’s refusal to do what the Western powers (specifically the US and France) believe it has promised to do, could end up setting off a chain reaction of events that builds quite literally to a critical mass in which the nukes really do get heaved back and forth. Mind you that both of these come from CPunch‘s right wing contributors. First, Michael Lind:

It almost passes belief to think that the Bush administration, bogged down in two wars and planning a third (with Iran), might move toward a confrontation with Russia. Yet that is what the White House appears to be doing. The August 11 Cleveland Plain Dealer reported that

President Bush called the violence unacceptable and Vice President Dick Cheney…said Russia’s actions in Georgia “must not go unanswered”…

Asked to explain Cheney’s comment, White House spokesman Gordon Johndroe said, “It means it must not stand.”

That phrase should send cold chills down the back of every American. It precisely echoes President George H.W. Bush’s statement in response to Iraq’s invasion of Kuwait, a statement that led to war. The White House cannot be unaware of the parallel, which means it is threatening war with Russia.


. . . [T]here is nothing America can do to defend Georgia except threaten nuclear war. We could send in a small “tripwire” force of a battalion or two – God help us if we do – and dare the Russians to attack it. But if they called the bluff – and I think they would – what then? It is impossible for the United States to wage conventional war with Russia in her own backyard. We would have to go nuclear, or back down and accept defeat. It is all too easy to guess which alternative the Bush administration would select.


The Bush White House tells itself American power knows no limits. All that is required is that they show sufficient “will,” and the rest of the world will buckle.

Not this time. Russia has taken all it is going to take.

It beggars the imagination to think that America could find itself in a nuclear confrontation with a post-Soviet Russia. But if the White House acts in accordance with its rhetoric, the next few weeks or even days may witness just such a strategic catastrophe.

Next, Paul Craig Roberts, in a piece in which he rambles a bit more than he usually does, which gives it an air of worried menace it might not otherwise have:

Back during the Nixon years, my Ph.D. dissertation chairman, Warren Nutter, was Assistant Secretary of Defense for International Security Affairs. One day in his Pentagon office I asked him how the US government got foreign governments to do what the US wanted. “Money,” he replied.

“You mean foreign aid?” I asked.

“No,” he replied, “we just buy the leaders with money.”

It wasn’t a policy he had implemented. He inherited it and, although the policy rankled with him, he could do nothing about it.. . . Nutter did not mean merely third world potentates were bought. He meant the leaders of England, France, Germany, Italy, all the allies everywhere were bought and paid for.


The American-educated thug, Saakashkvili the War Criminal, who is president of Georgia, was installed by the US taxpayer funded National Endowment for Democracy, a neocon operation whose purpose is to ring Russia with US military bases, so that America can exert hegemony over Russia.

Every agreement that President Reagan made with Mikhail Gorbachev has been broken by Reagan’s successors.


Recognizing that the US had no intention of keeping any of the agreements it had made with Gorbachev, Putin directed the Russian military budget to upgrading the Russian nuclear deterrent. Consequently, the Russian army and air force lack the smart weapons and electronics of the US military.

When the Russian army went into Georgia to rescue the Russians in South Ossetia from the destruction being inflicted upon them by the American puppet Saakashvili, the Russians made it clear that if they were opposed by American troops with smart weapons, they would deal with the threat with tactical nuclear weapons.

The Americans were the first to announce preemptive nuclear attack as their permissible war doctrine. Now the Russians have announced the tactical use of nuclear weapons as their response to American smart weapons.

It is obvious that American foreign policy, with its goal of ringing Russia with US military bases, is leading directly to nuclear war. Every American needs to realize this fact. The US government’s insane hegemonic foreign policy is a direct threat to life on the planet.

Roberts touches on a lot of other points in this very interesting piece, including his analysis of why Musharraff was forced to resign, i.e., we insisted he send his army into the autonomous tribal areas, and when they didn’t squelch al-Qaeda and the Taliban, we started undertaking missions there ourselves, which the locals blamed on Musharraff. This, combined with the way he alienated virutally everyone else, sealed his fate. He also discusses how even the right wing Committee On The Present Danger members think the neo-cons are dangerous lunatics.

94. diane - 19 August 2008

Wedding Bells Are Ringing?

95. diane - 19 August 2008

Have no clue why, but Burton is resounding through my head:

A law was made a distant moon ago heah…July and August cannot be to hot!………

And there’s a legal limit to the snow heah! ………in Camelot!

96. diane - 19 August 2008

fuckin imp in the tags, jeez, now the whitespace is fucked up.

A law was made a distant moon ago heah…July and August cannot be to hot!………

And there’s a legal limit to the snow heah! ………in Camelot!

97. diane - 19 August 2008



98. NYCO - 19 August 2008

ObamaCaine! Makes you drool and talk funny and not notice you’re being drilled screwed!

99. CSTAR - 19 August 2008

Why not just make it ObamaMcCain and every can go home,

Or some variant McBamaCaine

100. diane - 19 August 2008

Here’s an image for use after the name is finalized.

101. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Very sorry!


up thread at 93, languished in Spam file…

102. diane - 19 August 2008

jeez, speaking of imagery (and false prophets), a poster named ran scott posted some hilarious photshopped, or not, images,…. although I think those shoes need some work yet:

Benedicto XVI asombra al mundo con nuevos atuendos

103. diane - 19 August 2008


Some bleak humor…and here everyone was all in a tither about who the new vp candidates would be…when there may actually be none they need to worry their pretty little heads about….

One thing’s for certain, Cheney most deliberately stirred an enormous Hornet’s Nest which he certainly had the inside info on as to just what the effect would be……………

104. wilfred - 19 August 2008

PBS has “Wide Angle” on tonight, with Aaron Brown interviewing displaced Iraqis who now live in ghettos in Syria and Jordan.

It’s way overdue coverage from the American media.

105. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

91 – so Michelle’s his beard?

106. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

on the nuclear war tip, don’t forget about Condi complaining about Russian bombers flying near Alaska, which they’ve apparently been doing again for months:

Rice said Russia has raised questions about its place in the international community through the invasion and other actions, including the resumption last year for the first time since the 1991 collapse of the former Soviet Union of air patrols near the Alaskan coast by Tu-95 strategic bombers, code-named Bears by NATO.

“We’ve had Russian strategic aviation challenging in ways they haven’t, even along our borders with the United States, which I might note is a very dangerous game and perhaps one that I suggest the Russians want to reconsider. This is not one that is cost-free,” Rice said.

She did not elaborate on a U.S. reaction to the flights, which have been widely seen as an attempt by Russia, flush with windfall oil profits, to reassert itself as a global power despite serious problems with its military.

Since the flights resumed in August 2007, U.S. and Canadian fighters have intercepted the Russian bombers and escorted them away from the U.S. coast.

U.S. officials have previously attached little real significance to the flights by the turboprop-powered Cold War relics, and defense officials said Monday that recent flights did not provoke concerns within the Pentagon.

Ooooo, boogity boogity.

107. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

Our worthless centrist governor gets a convention slot:

Here is a comment from Doyle, issued this afternoon.

“While the national economy falters, we have worked very hard here in Wisconsin to keep moving forward and to create jobs. Our basic promise in this country has to be that we can go as far as our hard work and talent will take us. I am honored to address such an important issue before a national audience and help chart a new course for America.”

Meanwhile, Doyle is to be in Milwaukee tomorrow night to help open the main Obama campaign office here. He’ll be joined by Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett, U.S. Rep. Gwen Moore (D-Milwaukee) and others.

Nice bs statement, from the worthless guy who panders to the burbs and blocks his own party’s movements for universal healthcare for the state and mass transit (seriously, the man never saw a highway expansion that didn’t give him a woody).

108. marisacat - 19 August 2008


LOL Who knows!

109. JJB - 19 August 2008

MCat, no. 101,

Had the worst time getting that comment posted. Every time I tried I got the standard “cannot find that webpage” page from IE (work computer). I also wanted to put up a link to this NY Times story:

NATO foreign ministers strengthened their ties to Georgia on Tuesday and called for Russia to observe a cease-fire and withdraw its troops immediately, vowing that until it does the alliance “won’t continue with business as usual” in its relations with Moscow.

But the NATO ministers, at a rare, emergency meeting, failed to agree on any specific punitive measures, despite pressure from the United States that it at least threaten Russia with unspecified “consequences,” and pleas from the Czech Republic, Poland and NATO’s Baltic members that it take a tough stand.

Instead, NATO issued a tepid response, promising to establish a NATO-Georgia Council to strengthen ties — a far cry from Georgia’s goal of full NATO membership. And it ignored pleas from nervous Eastern European members for a strong, “don’t even think about it” warning against military intervention there.

All of which raised a critical question: What, exactly, is membership in the nearly 60-year-old alliance worth today?

“It is worth what it has been worth since 1949,” the NATO secretary general, Jaap de Hoop Scheffer, snapped when a reporter posed the question during a news conference. “That’s my short answer.” He called it “pathetic” that Russian officials had threatened to aim ballistic missiles at a NATO member, Poland, in response to the Bush administration’s plan to locate an antimissile base there.

The trouble is, back in 1949, the alliance was formed with a central tenet of collective defense. The famous Article 5 of the NATO Charter stipulates that an attack on one NATO member is an attack on all, a principle that assured Western Europe during the cold war that America would come to its defense if Moscow encroached.

But the notion of collective defense is a more complicated matter now that NATO has expanded to include 26 countries, foreign policy experts said, including former Soviet republics like Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia, not to mention the Czech Republic and Poland. Although some said that NATO might at least try to rustle up a defense for those countries if they were attacked, the concept of collective defense falls apart completely in the case of Georgia and Ukraine — both smack in Russia’s backyard and sphere of influence — even if they were NATO members.

“If Georgia was in NATO now, would we be defending them? I don’t know,” said Charles Kupchan, a senior fellow with the Council on Foreign Relations. “The alliance needs to make sure that when it takes on pledges of collective defense, it is prepared to stand by them.”

110. marisacat - 19 August 2008


thanks for letting me know… I thought i hd been missing it in Spam File, but maybe it wafted around in the mysterious mess that is the back pages of WordPress then landed…

111. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

GOP leader seeks to push Barr off Pa. ballot

A Republican Party leader filed court papers Monday aimed at getting Libertarian Party presidential candidate Bob Barr taken off the Pennsylvania ballot.

In a petition filed in Commonwealth Court, Victor Stabile alleged that the Libertarians misled people who signed their ballot petitions because they listed Rochelle Etzel of Clarion County as the presidential candidate even after the national party picked Barr at its convention in May.

Barr is a former GOP congressman from Georgia who some Republicans fear could hurt presumptive GOP nominee John McCain in a close election this year. The Libertarian Party formally substituted Barr’s name on the Pennsylvania ballot just last week.

Stabile, the Cumberland County GOP chairman and a Harrisburg lawyer, acknowledged that state election laws allow such substitutions as long as they are made within the allotted time, but said he thinks this case “crosses the line.”

“I don’t like to see anything taint that process,” he said.

Oh, how I hate them.

112. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

the Nation, poor, sad, hackish shadow of its former self.

113. marisacat - 19 August 2008

RE: The Nation

ugh If I NEVER hear the phrase “game changer” again I will be happy.

Nomenclature that means nada. And more nada.

114. marisacat - 19 August 2008

I don’t have the hheart to go look but according to Cursor.org… billmon again posted at DKos.

In his ‘Anatomy of A(nother) Fiasco,’ Billmon finds that

“Even after the fiasco in Iraq, the bloody failure in Lebanon, the downward spiral in Afghanistan and, now, the futile posturing in Georgia, there’s absolutely no evidence the U.S. foreign policy elite is inclined to moderate its ambition to re-organize the world along American lines.”

But yes, let’s all follow EITHER McC or Ob to more war. Mush!

115. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

Sexism rears its ugly head in so many unlikely ways.

116. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008
117. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

Donohue’s homo bookmarking

Wild Bill Donohue, the irascible fruitcake head of something called the Catholic League, is upset that a website “with homosexual tendencies” has been awarded media credentials to report from next week’s Democratic National Convention in Denver.

So he’s demanding that Leah Daughtry, who’s running the convention, dump the blogger.

Why? Because the site’s proprietor wrote a blog post citing a report in the Manchester Guardian that Joseph Ratzinger is the first pope in 40 years to dress himself up in ermine-trimmed robes and hats, complete with what seems to me some entirely fair commentary comparing Ratzinger’s fur bearing proclivities with several of his other infallible policy positions.

Also, because it “shows men in jockstraps and underwear” (although, mercifully, Joseph Ratzinger is not among those, ermine-trimmed or otherwise). But so do store catalogs, don’t they?

118. marisacat - 19 August 2008

As long as i can still post my cartoons (and his more hilarious photos, no need to photoshop!) of RatzyTheNazy… I say let Donohue go at people who provide support (however fake leftischer it may be) for the Democratic party.

Plenty of Donohues in the Dem party… squashing women… let the cheeky sites SLAM THEM


119. NYCO - 19 August 2008

115. A lot more will be done to decrease sexism in academia when women faculty, themselves, wake up and realize that being given lots of prestigious committee duties (as women faculty so often get) is not exactly “advancement,” since it is essentially scutwork that doesn’t lead anywhere. Asking “Where exactly is this assignment leading?” is something that ambitious women all too often don’t do.

The best way to deal with sexism is to focus on the fact that true leadership is rare — among either gender. Achieving a high position is not necessarily a sign that you’ve achieved leadership. And a preponderance of males in high positions is also not necessarily a sign that they’re doing any actual leading.

120. diane - 19 August 2008

Some good news for those who’ve kept their old records and are worried about turntable repair/replacement in the future:Vinyl Records Making a Comeback

121. lucid - 19 August 2008

Sexism rears its ugly head in so many unlikely ways.

I was about to say, they’ve never studied with Agnes Heller… but then I noticed this curiousness in the wiki entry.

Heller’s philosophy continued its neo-liberal postmodernisation which began with its repudiation of Marxism for a functionalist and market-based theory of society and ended with a conversion to a kind of neoconservatism under the influence of the events of 911.

Agnes was one of my MA thesis advisers – and I always took one of her fall courses, probably 4 in all. She oversaw my orals, in which I directly took on her book ‘A Theory of Modernity’ specifically with respect to her reading of Marx, endeavoring to show that the ‘grand narrative’ she described was actually an historicization of Aristotle’s notion of final cause, and while it was the grand achievement of Hegelianism, it was in fact broken down by Marx’s transformation of the idea of the dialectic. And it was precisely broken down due to elements she illuminated in her earlier work – namely the focus in Marx on the individuism as universality…

She was extremely entertained… the orals actually ended up being a 45 minute debate between the two of us on this point, in which I continually pointed to texts like Grundrisse [a text she taught me] to elicit the idea the Marx’s universalism was not based on a limited notion of the final cause, and that the idea of ‘the end of history’ simply reflected an economic analysis in which the illusions of capitalist economy could no longer be maintained because, in her words, ‘the flower had born the seed’.

I got a high pass…

When I read something like that in Wiki, I wonder. I haven’t had any interactions with Agnes since 2001, so I don’t know where she is now [though I do know she’s 79]. It again makes me question wiki as a source, because I cannot ever see Agnes embracing neo-conservatism. There is no reference for it, and the only things she’s written since 2000 are articles on Shakespeare. I had my political battles with her over 6 years, but none would leave me to believe that is possible.

But in light of the parent quote – no one ever fucked with Agnes Heller. I saw her eviscerate Derrida, no holds barred, eating the tripe from his abdomen, spitting it out, and smiling at the end. Just another day at the office…

122. lucid - 19 August 2008

Diane – I am a vinyl snob… and we can only hope, because as a musician and engineer, the lowered expectations for sound quality in the CD and MP3 generations really pisses me off…

123. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

well, my ears are shot, and it’s too fucking hard to hit the groove w/o screwing up the record @ 2 AM and I’m drunk and I just have to hear THAT SONG, RIGHT NOW.

I wouldn’t trade in my iPod full of my transferred CDs for all the vinyl in hipsterland.

I can’t afford the equipment to really appreciate it, anyway.

*** ducks and runs ***

124. diane - 19 August 2008

Lucid – So am I, I’ve been lugging what seem like tons of albums everywhere I go, to hell with the furniture, and was really happy for that bit of news.

125. marisacat - 19 August 2008

turntables are nto that expensive. Of course this is SF and I admit they almost never stopped being for sale here. Even the big box stores carried at least one model… I have all my records and two old turntables. Even good needles are not that much.

But I agree for some things modern [well.. post modern?] technology works better…

126. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008
127. diane - 19 August 2008

quick..catch him Lucid…before he gets away….I’ve got him sandwiched between us…

128. marisacat - 19 August 2008

PS I was appalled … a friend f mine gve up ALL of her records. Mostly Jazz instrumetnal and masses of Sinatra. I am nto that big a fan of his, this song or that song or a live performance from the Palladium… but to give them all up….

Blew me away!

129. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

Also, I have to say that nothing beats walking home after seeing Lucinda Williams, plopping down on a bench down the block and putting her songs on random play, putting on the headphones and looking up at the stars, pleasantly buzzed and happy.

130. CSTAR - 19 August 2008

Re Neoliberalism…

But first listen to some samples from Mariana Montalvo, exiled from Pinochet’s Chile in the early 70s here — you’ll have to click on the audio sample link

Then read about the Milton Friedman Institute

And finally, maybe, cry for a few minutes.

131. lucid - 19 August 2008

Mitm – it is funny that nerds like me are now somehow hipsters… 😉

A decent turntable will cost you about $300. An acceptable one will cost you about $125… and the vinyl is cheap – you’re near Chicago. You could walk out of there with 100 records for $400.

Hwll, I’m finally going to give in and get an iphone soon, for a whole host of reasons, but it doesn’t mean that I’m abandoning vinyl… and more imporatnatly it doesn’t mean that when I have the money and space, I won’t build a studio based around a Studer 24 track. There is just so much more that you can do sonically when you’re dealing with analog. The Darkside of the Moon drum track is the perfect example. Not possible in digital. To get the precise compression on the drum overheads that give them the distortion they have on the album cannot be replicated in the digital realm – it’s all about slamming those mics to tape.

The ear can hear it.

132. marisacat - 19 August 2008



133. Madman in the Marketplace - 19 August 2008

here’s the thing … I’ve had friends w/ good setups over the years, and I had a fairly good amp/speakers/turntable for a while, and while I agree that the modern digital stuff has a sometimes harsh sheen to it, as I got older I just couldn’t hear enough of the difference to mean a lot to me. Of course, my attention span has gotten more scattered as I’ve gotten older, and I multitask constantly, so I don’t listen as closely as I did when I was 20, so that might be part of it.

I feel bad that I can’t/don’t hear it. I also feel bad that I can’t pick up the meter of most poems by reading them until someone TELLS me what the meter is. It bugs me that I was a mediocre drummer and not really able to get the way musicians communicate with each other when they play. I’ve always been jealous of that. Shakespeare made no sense on the page until I saw it performed. Big blind spots, I know, but I pretty much just skate on the surface of the world, afraid that I’ll miss something if I stop too long in one place. Vinyl is for slowing down for ONE thing, and I don’t seem able to do that.

134. marisacat - 19 August 2008

Those aren’t blind spots… your brain and whatever chemistry is just working that way……………..

Just like I failed miserably at all maths for the whole of my schooling. Massive, my brain jsut goes the other way, when math appears. But you know, not really a failure. have to say I never missed it. And there might be a god, after all, somehow i got a decent (not good but decent) score on the SAT math section. A miracle!

135. lucid - 19 August 2008

No judgments Mdaman. It’s a personal issue for me because I am an engineer and musician. This is a bad example, but when I first opened my studio to the public [and it is now closed to the public], I had all sorts of hip hop and R&B ‘producers’ climbing up my armpits to get work done. It consisted of the most horrendously recorded backing tracks with ‘live’ vocals I would record here – and then mix. I’m pretty damn good with excavations. I can take a terribly recorded live board tape of a band and make it sound respectable. I’m just sick of people accepting this shit when I can help them sound like an album from the ’70’s, if they only pay me just a little more and are willing to put in a little more time.

And I see it indicative of what the audience demands in sound quality.

136. lucid - 19 August 2008

afraid that I’ll miss something if I stop too long in one place

But there is beauty in that – seeing one place, timeless. I used to think I had an unnatural preponderance for deja vu, but then I realized it was a recognition of single moments. There is nothing to miss in the world, however slow or fast one chooses to go. It’s all perception.

137. marisacat - 19 August 2008

nu thred…


………………. 8) …………

138. diane - 19 August 2008

jeez, step away for what seemed like a few seconds and I’ve got tons to catch up on….


Not the Blue Notes Marisa, say no…..poor thing. A turntable replacement is in my plans, first delight on the list, will be listening to Lee Morgan on Tell It Like It Is and Petty Larceny from Art Blakey and the Jazz Messenger’s badasssssssss album Freedom Rider

139. diane - 19 August 2008

Gee Madman, all of us get Blind Spots…at certain things… when I’ve got a lot on my mind, I can read something and seconds later, not remember anything from it if my life depended on it.

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