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Harvest 6 February 2009

Posted by marisacat in 2010 Mid Terms, Inconvenient Voice of the Voter.


Zhugao, China: A woman picks vegetables while carrying her child [Peter Parks/AFP/Getty Images]

Naomi Klein has a Comment up at the Guardian… a walk thru some of the global protest ongoing…

[P]erhaps the sturdiest thread connecting this global backlash is a rejection of the logic of “extraordinary politics” – the phrase coined by the Polish politician Leszek Balcerowicz to describe how, in a crisis, politicians can ignore legislative rules and rush through unpopular “reforms”.

That trick is getting tired, as South Korea’s government recently discovered. In December, the ruling party tried to use the crisis to ram through a highly controversial free trade agreement with the US. Taking closed-door politics to new extremes, legislators locked themselves in the chamber so they could vote in private, barricading the door with desks, chairs and couches.

Opposition politicians were having none of it: using sledgehammers and an electric saw, they broke in and staged a 12-day sit-in of parliament. The vote was delayed, allowing for more debate – a victory for a new kind of “extraordinary politics”.

The pattern is clear: governments that respond to a crisis created by free-market ideology with an acceleration of that same discredited agenda will not survive to tell the tale.

As Italy’s students have taken to shouting in the streets: “We won’t pay for your crisis!”

If only…


While I was there saw a short take on Davos this year, from Joseph Stiglitz… a dark take.

[T]o this litany of concerns we can add the fear that borrowers, wary of massive American deficits, and holders of US dollar reserves, worried that the US may be tempted to inflate away its debt, might respond by draining the supply of global savings. At Davos, those who trusted the US not to inflate away its debt intentionally worried that it might happen unintentionally. There was little confidence in the none-too-deft hand of the US Federal Reserve – its reputation marred by massive monetary-policy failures in recent years – to manage the massive build-up of debt and liquidity.

President Obama seems to be offering a needed boost to American leadership after the dark days of George W Bush; but the mood in Davos suggests that optimism and confidence may be short-lived. America led the world in globalisation. With American-style capitalism and America’s financial markets in disrepute, will the US now lead the world into a new era of protectionism, as it did once before, during the Great Depression?


Last but not least… the Zinni story is REALLY getting around.  In this, Flynt Leverett and Korb are quoted.  Not inconsequential critics.  Nor is Leverett merely ”a former Clinton” whatever, it was his wife who unloaded on Olberman on how useless the Hillary contingent would be in Middle East (and the interview was cut off)…

“They handled this in an extremely amateurish way and then they compound this by letting the world know that they don’t really care who’s ambassador to Saudi Arabia,” said Flynt Leverett, a foreign policy official under Bill Clinton and George W. Bush, who said the transition had been characterized by such “stumbles.”

“It is astounding to me,” he said. “It does appear like there are some real struggles going on.”


Yet on the lower levels of the transition, many among the army of Democratic foreign policy hands who labored for Obama’s campaign say they have heard little since election day. Lawrence Korb, a top Reagan Defense Department official and senior fellow at the Center for American Progress who headed Obama’s defense policy team during the campaign, sent his aides a memo soon after the election.

“I said, ‘These are the people who really work and they should be involved in the transition and the administration,'” he recalled. “I never heard anything and neither did they.”

“I don’t know who’s doing what, who’s in charge,” Korb said.

Lotta chiefs (Czars, Tsars, Princes of the Purse, Gods of the Armies) is my impression as well… pontificating from my cubby hole.  Hey!  It’s tough being Leader of the Free World.  or Whirled.

Have a heart for our leaders… it likely is all you can afford to give!

“There’s a lot of chiefs and not a whole lot of Indians,” said [Aaron David] Miller. “You’ve just got to make sure that when chiefs interact, the casualty of this interaction isn’t an effectively and seamlessly organized American policy.”

Most Democrats remain hopeful, however, that the process’s frustrations are largely products of the speed and of the administration’s early days, and that ruffled feathers will soon be smoothed. “Part of it of it is the normal bumps in the road,” said Korb. “And you’ve also got two wars going on and a lot of international crises.” Other tensions, though, may not be resolved until the internal pecking order among the administration’s major players becomes clear. “In any administration you get somebody who dominates,” Korb added. “Nobody had ever heard of Kissinger before he went in there, and pretty soon he was running things.”

Well they promised a lot.  And now the mashed potatoes have LUMPS.  I am sure it will all turn out fine.

Why would it not, God Blesses Us Everyday.  He prays for us first.  He sent his only begotten son, from a white woman in Hawai’i and a son of a village chief in Kenya, to save us.

We are blessed.  Care to dare to say we are not?

(my usual tirade)



1. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Sounds so familiar. Editorial from Sacramento Bee

Editorial: Budget secrecy is no public service

Published: Friday, Feb. 06, 2009 | Page 14A

Ever since Arnold Schwarzenegger became governor, this early advocate of sunshine has relied on darkness to close a budget deal.

The governor has routinely orchestrated “Big Five” meetings that include the Democratic and Republican leaders of the Senate and Assembly.

All five promise to keep the horse-trading secret, ostensibly to prevent outside interests from seizing on a single item and torpedoing the larger budget deal.

Such closed-door sessions might be tolerable if they came at the end of public process, and were used only to sew up loose threads. They’d be easier to accept if they regularly produced fiscally sound deals that were free of gimmicks and special-interest favors.

But that’s not what happens. Last year’s Big Five sessions produced a budget that was months late and out of balance before the ink dried. It was slammed through the Legislature in less than 24 hours. Like automatons, legislators voted for bills and budget provisions they hadn’t read, unwilling to buck their caucus leaders.

The same pattern is happening again. …

Although some lawmakers decry this secrecy, some are happy to be left out of the loop.

The Big Five process shields them from accountability. If constituents raise hell about a pension perk or an environmental rollback that was added at the last minute, legislators can look them in the eye and say, “I didn’t have a hand in that.”

Voters, however, shouldn’t fall for this pablum. …snip…

2. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Pardon me while I laugh. Bring on the Recovery! If it is anything (IMO bi partisan neglect abandonment and classism/racism) like the NEW ORLEANS Recovery we are screwed.. at high noon and in the public square.


He hit the word “hope” hard. Republicans on Capitol Hill took that as a presidential implication that if they don’t pass his stimulus bill, they don’t care as much about the jobless.

“It is inexcusable and irresponsible to get bogged down in distraction and delay while millions of Americans are being put out of work,” the president said. “It is time for Congress to act. It is time to pass an Economic Recovery and Reinvestment Plan to get our economy moving again…The American people did not choose more of the same. They did not send us to Washington to get stuck in partisan posturing, or to turn back to the same tried and failed approaches that were rejected in the last election. They sent us here with a mandate for change, and the expectation that we would act.” …

AND the Republicans sure heard Obey thsi am (I commented n it last thread, and Tapper links to NPR):

Responded one Republican congressional aide: “The president switched to partisan mode two days ago when the Gallup poll came out.”

Was he bothered at all by today’s speech?

“I thought the speech last night was much more offensive. But no one’s here going to pick a fight with him.

Not with (House Appropriations Committee chairman, Wisconsin Democrat) David Obey saying, ‘So what?’ about the waste in the bill.

Not with (Senate Majority Leader) Harry Reid saying, we’ll do this with you or without you. We got much easier targets over here.” …

3. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Instapundit says that Bredesen is being vetted for HHS. Earlier today he quoted B as saying “staying put, not packing”.

Sounds like Bredesen knows the ropes.. as I say often, he cut TENN Care at the same time Haley Barbour cut Medicaid rolls in MS. They did it, both, by about the same amount.

Remember to vote.

4. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

Bredesen would be a high noon screwing with jester cap and ankle bells, from what I’ve read.

Out of the Daschle and into the coalpits of hell!

5. marisacat - 6 February 2009

via TPM

Done Deal?

CNN reports that the Senate has a reached tentative deal for a $780 billion stimulus package.

6. marisacat - 6 February 2009

ABC says there is a deal. “tentative”.

7. marisacat - 6 February 2009

KGO says that education stimulus was cut from the Big Stim Bill … and CA was counting on it. Part of how they got to 780 Bgahbillion.

8. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

I smell freshly ground pony. NBC Nightly News bit on tentative deal indicated that health care assistance, help for state funding, etc., were non-JOB-producing items and therefore getting “trimmed.”

9. marisacat - 6 February 2009

yeah agree (ground up pony).. Brooks on TNH is saying that “moderates” about 15 Dems and 5 republicans holed up yesterday in the Dirsksen blding… the cuts (bringing it down to 780 frm over 900 gabillion) came from them. He clearly says they had Obster over a barrel (unspken in my opinion is that obster is WITH that group) and they got the cuts they wanted.

Makes sense to me. LOL OF course Brooks is now saying htat R “were working, based on principle”.


10. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

LOL. NBC is now doing a piece on the resurgent demand for and ramped-up production of (actual, canned) SPAM. They’re calling it a “recession favorite.”

11. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Via the schnauzers.. (Roll Call is behind sub wall)

$140 Billion Cut as Part of Stimulus Deal [Mark Hemingway]

Roll Call:

Bipartisan negotiators appear to have reached a compromise on cutting as much as $140 billion from the Senate economic stimulus bill, but the plan needs to be vetted with rank-and-file Democrats before an official deal can be announced.

Senate Democrats convened a special caucus meeting to discuss the compromise at 5:30 p.m. Friday.

Aides said the rough outlines of the deal would pare the package from nearly $920 billion to $780 billion through a combination of cuts to overall government spending and a reduction in the amount of tax cuts in the measure.

If a deal is reached, Democrats expect at least three Republicans to join them in passing a bill. It was unclear if a vote could be held on either the amendment or the bill as a whole on Friday night, given that some Republicans were expected to request additional debate time.

“There’s a sense that progress has been made,” Sen. Kent Conrad (D-N.D.) said. “There’s enough to talk about with the caucus.”

The Senate will begin voting on amendments to the measure around 7 p.m. A vote on final passage could occur after that if Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) believes he has the necessary votes.

“We’re going to have votes later tonight. I apologize for having nothing more definite than that, but at this time that’s all I can do,” Reid said in a brief floor statement.

02/06 06:21 PM

One fo the schnauzers had reported a couple days ago that it might reach a deal tonight… as there is an upcoming CODEL to Germany and they need to get going.

As I recall, point man, Biden (that schnauzer) is being sent to Germany as well.

Dontcha love it.

12. marisacat - 6 February 2009


I am getting a ton of spam. Really awful. Gmail catches almost all of it. Tons of it gets thru AOL.

13. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

Supposedly Teddy K is heading in for the vote.

14. marisacat - 6 February 2009

That says it is close.. last I heard (couple days ago) he was in FL, doctors orders rest following the seizure.

And Franken not allowed in, Gregg recused.


15. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

I did mean the gelatinous pink stuff, but I hear you on the electronic version too.

16. marisacat - 6 February 2009

oh real canned Spam.. got it.

Well McDonalds claims to be doing well. Wal-Mart too… and supposedly one of the big single day crashes on the DJ Industrial, only Campbells Soup went up.


17. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

Plus, Geithner’s gotta lay out a “comprehensive plan” to “stabilize the financial system” on Monday.

From Reuters:

“In the address, Secretary Geithner will discuss the Obama administration’s strategy to strengthen our economy by getting credit flowing again to families and businesses, while imposing new measures and conditions to strengthen accountability, oversight and transparency in how taxpayer dollars are spent,” the Treasury said in a statement.

18. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

Bet someone’s working on a squirrel cookbook (with slingshot tips) right now.

19. marisacat - 6 February 2009

LOL meanwhile they have a running shortfall of 78 mil from first tranche of the TARP.

Oh hard to believe.. I pop on Ellen as she comes right before the local 5 pm news… I get about 15 or so mins of her from time to time. She is calling for “more good news” now that the country is all better. Let’s hve “less bad news”. And Jennifer Aniston chimes in, “the country had a bad boyfriend for a while and now e have a different boy friend”. [applause]

hmm. I say, let’s have the news. No matter what.

20. marisacat - 6 February 2009

We are regaled. Snips from Biden speech this morning before the assembled [likely hung over] Democrats:

Anybody remember a time when we’re talking about, if we don’t make some real changes, deficits that are a trillion two hundred billion dollars a year for as far as the eye can see, if we don’t, ah, get it right, which you guys have already?

And later:

But let me move for a second to what I was supposed to talk about. I was asked to talk about foreign policy. You know that old joke, you know, an expert is anyone from out of town with a briefcase? I’m out of town, but I don’t have a briefcase, and I know a lot of you know as much and more about foreign policy as I do, but it’s like that old joke, I hope you Texans aren’t offended, but in Delaware that old joke about the Texan who said ‘I don’t now much about art but I know what I like?’ Well, I may not know much about it, but I know what I think, and I know what I think we have to do.

I’d call that the known knowns.

21. NYCO - 6 February 2009

10. Fried Spam is actually rather good. Done correctly, it’s like bacon without the fat. And try it with a bit of honey. Mmmmm.

(I go camping a lot… that is usually our first course at breakfast)

22. NYCO - 6 February 2009

As for the bailout… I’m not even paying attention to the details. It’s all BS. It won’t help. We’re still in the “pouring the gasoline on the clusterfuck” stage. Saving my energy and ignoring it.

That’s a skill that more people are going to have to develop. Learning to ignore the irrelevant “news.”

23. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

Opposition politicians were having none of it

What’s that like? Having opposition politicians, that is.

24. marisacat - 6 February 2009

I am not expecting anything from the Stimulus. A few months ago I ”hoped”, in a sense, that things were so bad that congress and ObRama would manage a few things. For people. Even if by accident.

Not going to happen. Can’t imagine why I ever thought that by accident something thrown at the wall might stick. Other than congressshits throwing their sticky drooled upon toys around in the play room.

25. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

10 – woo hoo! Spam!

26. catnip - 6 February 2009

I thought the stimulus bill total was $815 billion. Suddenly, it was $920 and now it’s down to $780?

Really though, once you get into billions, what’s a few extra here or there?

(This is truly nuts.)

27. BooHooHooMan - 6 February 2009

LOL. NYCO, last thread I was calling David Obey a raccoon. The eyes, the whiskers, the running from humans…LOL.

28. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

21 – I’ve heard good things about Hawaian spam treatments, too.

24 – Other than congressshits throwing their sticky drooled upon toys around in the play room.

You must have caught some of Specter or Lieberman on CSPAN!

27 – All depends on the raccons and the humans, BHHM!

(Some humans have been known to feed some raccoons M&Ms by hand, after inviting them into the living room.)

29. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

Oops . lost an “o” in recounting that raccoon tale.

30. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

Jay Rosen pretty good on Moyers tonight, regarding the media/DC powerlock.

31. Intermittent Bystander - 6 February 2009

Aha! The other dude on Moyers is Greenwald.

32. mattes - 6 February 2009

#17 IB…mo’money…

33. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

Why Shovel-Ready Infrastructure is Wrong (Right Now)

From Buzzword to Multibillion-Dollar Policy

So what exactly is a shovel-ready project? As the Washington Post recently pointed out, the term “shovel-ready” may have been introduced in the 1990s by New York-based electric utility Niagara-Mohawk Power, which later became National Grid (it is the current owner of the URL shovelready.com). There are no specific parameters or requirements that define shovel readiness. But according to civil engineers, the idea behind this new buzzword could help scuttle the stimulus bill’s highly publicized, though secondary, goal of infrastructure reform. At issue is that 90-day restriction stipulated by Congress, an even narrower window than the bill’s original 180-day limit. “They’re well intentioned, and they know their infrastructure sucks, so they’re trying to do immediate reactive management to what is a very deep, endemic problem,” says Robert Bea, a professor of civil and environmental engineering at the University of California, Berkeley. “If you want to patch some potholes in the road, this is a good program. But if you’re hoping for anything long-term with this approach, throw away all hope. It can’t happen.”

The programs that would meet the bill’s 90-day restriction are, for the most part, an unappealing mix of projects that were either shelved after being fully designed and engineered, and have since become outmoded or irrelevant, or projects with limited scope and ambition. No one’s building a smart electric grid or revamping a water system on 90 days notice. The best example of a shovel-ready project, and what engineers believe could become the biggest recipient of the transportation-related portion of the bill’s funding, is road resurfacing—important maintenance work, but not a meaningful way to rein in a national infrastructure crisis. “In developing countries, there are roads that are so bad, they create congestion, because drivers are constantly forced to slow down,” says David Levinson, an associate professor in the University of Minnesota’s civil engineering department. “That’s not the case here. If the road’s a little bit rougher, drivers will feel it, but that’s not going to cause you to go any slower. So the economic benefit of those projects is pretty low.”

That might be acceptable to people focused purely on fostering rapid job growth‹but, ironically, such stimulus spending could fall short on that measure, as well. “In the 1930s, when you were literally building with shovels, that might have made sense. That was largely unskilled labor. Today, it’s blue collar, but it’s not unskilled,” Levinson says. “The guy brushing the asphalt back and forth is unskilled, but the guy operating the steamroller isn’t. And there’s an assumption out there that construction workers are interchangeable between residential and highway projects. But a carpenter isn’t a whole lot of help in building a road.”

34. marisacat - 6 February 2009

LAT/Top of the Ticket blog

[G]roundskeepers have set out several traps for the nocturnal creatures, using bipartisan bait — cat food, apples and peanut butter, presumably untainted. So far to no avail on the well-manicured acreage that resembles any welcoming urban park, save for the lack of blowing refuse, the heavily armed patrols, motion detectors, secret tunnels and video surveillance of every square inch. Still, no prisoners.

If captured and confirmed by the Senate, and their tax records found up to date, the First Raccoons will experience rendition to a wooded area in an unidentified location, Burton said. He didn’t actually say the Senate part, but it’s better than being thrown under an administration bus like some others these days. …

35. marisacat - 6 February 2009

FYI… for who ever can stnd it…

Mark Halperin, David Brooks, Jeanne Cummings, Al Hunt and more will ruminate about the president’s third week in office on Friday evening’s “Charlie Rose.”

36. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009
37. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009


To me, comedy writers should be anarchists, not liberals. Hell, I’ll take a reactionary jokesmith over some soppy lib still wearing an Obama button. At least that person has an edge, however lunatic it might be. Part of my stupid problem is that I grew up when comedy offended people, pushing past boundaries of taste. Whenever I got a glimpse of the minds behind the bits, they almost always looked rumpled, ragged, crazy, fucked up. That inspired me. There was place where freaks like us fit in.

But when comedy exploded all over the 1980s, that was it. I started meeting comics who dressed straight, their humor in line with their attire. Hanging out in writers’ offices at MTV and Comedy Central was fun but hardly electric. The guys there may as well have been working for an insurance company. When Tom Schiller had me up at the SNL offices, it was so quiet and corporate. “You should’ve seen this floor back in ’77 or ’78,” Tom told me, surveying the scene. “Crazy. Loud. But this . . .” He’d simply sigh. O’Donoghue was the same way. “Comedy writers should frighten you,” said Michael. He blamed Lorne Michaels for purging the show of misanthropes and outcasts. “The Harvard laugh factory fucked it all up.”

I swear, the fucking Ivy League is one of the major sources of our problem. ESPECIALLY Harvard and Yale.

38. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

Silber: No, No: My Armageddon Fantasies Are the Best!

This is deeply admirable. You wouldn’t want to extort money from American citizens, proceed to shovel their money to delusional fantasists, and then demand that the fantasists hire people that their delusions proclaim to be evil. That hardly seems sporting. What the hell are delusions for, if not to torment, torture, flay and burn those who decline to partake of them? You don’t “want to rush a decision on such a complex decision” (sic, sick, you choose). Besides, there’s an auto-da-fe scheduled for tomorrow morning!


Oh, Christ, Allah, Buddha, all you guys (you’re all guys, wazzup wid dat? as if I didn’t know…): this is so buttfuckingly fantastic! The Office of Faith-Based Bullcrap is going to work with the National Security Council — and they’ll all “foster interfaith dialogue with leaders and scholars around the world.”

This is almost as good as drugs. Maybe better. I dunno, I’m kinda overwhelmed right now. Just think of it: the U.S. government will take your money, now earned with lots of your blood, sweat, tears and all that terrible stuff, give that money to the Office of Let’s Pretend, and then use that money so that a bunch of people from around the world can compare fantasies.

“My God says the infidels must be killed!”

“No, no! My God says we must first try to convert the infidels. If they persist in error, then they must be killed!”

“Let’s get real. We torture and murder non-believers because that’s one of the major ways we maintain our power and make sure the otherwise uncontrollable people remain subservient and obedient. We’ve always done it, and we always will. It’s the way the system works! And, of course, it is God’s will!”

Christ, I love this shit.

39. catnip - 6 February 2009
40. catnip - 6 February 2009

Candy Crowley says that what’s going on is just politics as usual. She obviously needs to be rendered to a Changeyhopeiness black site overseas.

41. marisacat - 6 February 2009

hmm reading that title from Fisk reminded me of this, from Electronic Intifada

“The BBC cannot be neutral in the struggle between truth and untruth, justice and injustice, freedom and slavery, compassion and cruelty, tolerance and intolerance.” Thus read a 1972 internal document called Principles and Practice in News and Current Affairs laying out the guidelines for the BBC’s coverage of conflicts. It appears to affirm that in cases of oppression and injustice to be neutral is to be complicit, because neutrality reinforces the status quo. This partiality to truth, justice, freedom, compassion and tolerance it deems “within the consensus about basic moral values.” It is this consensus that the BBC spurned when it refused to broadcast the Disaster Emergency Committee (DEC)’s video appeal to help the people of Gaza.

The presumption that underlies the decision is that the BBC has always been impartial when it comes to Israel-Palestine. An exhaustive 2004 study by the Glasgow University Media Group, Bad News from Israel, shows that the BBC’s coverage is systematically biased in favor of Israel. …

42. marisacat - 6 February 2009

listening to a round up on PBS, a local news show. The “moderates” who recrafted it whacked money to the states, education, forward paying Food Stamp (I guess that means future spending), Headstart, school building construction and “greening” state buildings.

LOL I would say Difi and Barbara and Pelosi will have to do some fast talking and blame someone.

Apparently CA is angy over the bee money. Our almond crop… etc.

So I assume other states hit too.

Carry on, nothing to see.

Oh the “moderates” added to the Pentagon $$$$ apparently… no details

43. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Fox News Sunday: Obama aide Summers, Sen. Cornyn

This Week: Summers, RNC Chair Steele. Roundtable with Newt Gingrich, Claire Shipman, Robert Reich, George Will.

Meet the Press: Sens. Ensign, McCaskill, Reps. Frank, Pence

Face the Nation: Sens. Conrad, Coburn and White House Council of Economic Advisers chair Romer.

State of the Union: Transportation Sec. LaHood, Sens. Shelby, Schumer, South Carolina Gov. Sanford, Jack Welch

Plus: White House Chief of Staff Emanuel on NewsHour Friday.


I had News Hour on… think Axelrod took his place. FWIW, which is nothng.

44. NYCO - 6 February 2009

China declares drought emergency as crops threatened

Feb. 6 (Bloomberg) — China, the world’s largest grain producer, raised its drought-emergency alert to level one, the highest class, for the first time, as dry weather threatened crops, livestock and rural incomes.

About 143 million mu (9.5 million hectares) of winter wheat are in drought, more than 40 percent of the crop, and about a third of that is in a “severe” condition, according to the Office of Flood Control and Drought Relief Headquarters. Some 4.3 million people and 2.1 million large livestock have limited access to drinking water, the office said.

The dry weather may cut grain output, curb exports and hurt efforts by the government to boost farm incomes at a time when 20 million migrant workers have lost their jobs.

Article goes on to say that China has at least the equivalent of half its annual wheat production in reserve. So things aren’t grim.

45. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

Foodstamps is one of the programs that most efficiently moves money into the economy, bar none. EVERY penny gets spent, and usually spent in locally owned businesses. Unemployment payments is another one. People spend that money, quickly.

Maddow actually had a good rundown on stimulus money tonight. Start around 3 minutes in.

She’s WAY too forgiving of the worthless dems, but some good stuff in the clip.

Good numbers (which jive w/ other stuff I’ve read about it) are about 5:30 in. Foodstamps numbers are at about 6:10.

46. marisacat - 6 February 2009

via Politico, list of what was cut. Not that it matters. NTIM.

47. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Who is who and what is up. Luv the classic “strong arm” games.

[T]im Starks, a reporter for Congressional Quarterly, said he witnessed Strohm approach Panetta and ask a question, just before the man began “grabbing him by the arm and moving him away.”

“I said to the guy, ‘That’s not the way you do it,’” recalled Starks.

Starks said that he’s covered the CIA for years and had never seen a reporter strong-armed that way before, adding that the agency is typically respectful of journalists.

Reflecting on the incident, Strohm played it down somewhat, saying that he’s “had worse happen” while reporting. …

48. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

those cuts are a whole lot of penny ante bullshit …

49. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Apparently a lot of it was meant to be relief to the states… to avoid state level lay offs. Or so I am gathering.

Some of what is listed of course I don’t know what it is … code names and acronyms.

in CA 200,000 state workers are on the list for twice a month “furlough” (started today) which, I heard a report tonight, is really a list readied to start lay offs.

I could see massive state lay offs and quite a few agencies reduced to 4 days a week.

A lot of restructuring of the public schools over the past few years, some of it in place but not all, some waiting for money, is going to be undone. From what I have heard all week, if the money did not come thru.

Meanwhile Arnold declines a salary but lives large on the state ticket. Someone on KGO last week read well over a hundred names on his staff that make well over 100K… they read names and salaries.. to the dollar to the penny… costs for him to fly back and forth… stay on the 13th flr of the Park Hyatt in Sacto and so on.

On and on it goes.

Then again apparently they sold this list based on the bill changing again in committe.. who knows.

50. marisacat - 6 February 2009

well there is an article running around.. can’t remember wehre, that his Council of Economic HooHoos is a list of his cash supporters. Aside from the fac that Penny Pritzker is there.

I noticed Volcker did not look too happy today.

Who knows.

I think of the Obs as Flash Splash and Dash. Get in, get showy, grab what you can and leave. So, they fit the mold.

51. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009
52. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

some context for the link above:

These snips of the president speaking in pottymouth are from his audiobook. They’re excerpts where he’s reading for a friend he knew, as I understand it. But taken out of context, they are pure awesome.

53. Madman in the Marketplace - 6 February 2009

Barack Obama is tired of your motherfucking shit (Techno Zuendli Mix)

Thank Crom that the “we can’t make fun of him” thing has worn off …

54. marisacat - 6 February 2009

on their lousy knees and cleaning the senate carpet with their tongue. I wish I could leave the party every week, just for that single moment of [metaphorically] kicking them to the gutter and then to storm drain.

WASHINGTON — CIA Director-nominee Leon Panetta formally retracted a statement he made Thursday that the Bush administration transferred prisoners for the purpose of torture.

“I am not aware of the validity of those claims,” he said.

Sen. Kit Bond, R-Mo., chastised Panetta for careless words. “You cannot be making statements or making judgments based on rumors and news stories,” he said.

Because he has not yet been confirmed, Panetta has not been briefed on the details of the secret program.

The Obama administration will not prosecute CIA officers who participated in harsh interrogations that critics say crossed the line into torture, Panetta said Friday.

Asked by The Associated Press if that was official policy, Panetta said, “That is the case.” …

What a stupid useless fake party. Always, always apologising…

55. lucid - 6 February 2009

I mad this edit on the Wiki page about Isis and Osiris today – first venture into that vomitous land – and it will not last. But I thought for a second, maybe someone should consider it…

These two myths are very closely linked to the Jesus myth. With respect to Isis/Osiris it is the earliest mythic idea of a ‘virgin birth’. With respect to both of them it is the earliest idea of a God dying and resurrecting. The wine, of course, has more to do with the Dionysian myth – as well as the figure of Mary Magdelene, as Dionysios was always in the company of women, and the idea of transubstantiation involves the passing of wine within a chthonic cult of which Dionysios is the best exemplar. The ‘lord of the dead’ is much closer to the Osirian model. As the Jews were a wandering people, and informed by the dictate of diaspora, their mythology became a quilt of other beliefs in their region. When faced again with an imperial force in Rome, they put together the ‘Shards of Binah’ and proffered an idea for a moshiach melding the myths of their heritage – one who could undermine the Roman empire ultimately by allowing non-Jews to become Jews – hence, the way to god is through me, with all the rizmarraz of virgins, wine and women…

And I have to say, the fact that this page doesn’t remotely mention this, is disgraceful. Some ‘encyclopedia’.

56. lucid - 6 February 2009

Within 5 minutes, my edit was out… fuckin’ a

Are they paying people to make every article factually challenged?

57. marisacat - 6 February 2009

Think Intermittent Bystander said it upthread, on NY PBS broadcast time.. but Greenwald and Rosen on with Moyers are very very good. the transcript

58. marisacat - 6 February 2009


The wine, of course, has more to do with the Dionysian myth – as well as the figure of Mary Magdelene, as Dionysios was always in the company of women, and the idea of transubstantiation involves the passing of wine within a chthonic cult of which Dionysios is the best exemplar

…and people sent Wikipedia 6 mil last month, to save them.

59. lucid - 6 February 2009

So they can butcher truth…

60. lucid - 6 February 2009

And the guy who nixed all of my edits [I made others] – apparently a mad raving zionist given his history… go figure.

Can’t deal with history, must cling to myths… nobadaddy, the bean-bag chair in the sky.

61. lucid - 7 February 2009

Our nobadaddy, who art in nobadadiness,
Nobadaddy be thy Noba.
Thy nobakewl come.
Thy nobathwart be done,
On noba as it is in betternoba.
Give us this day our daily noba.
And forgive us our anti-noba,
As we forgive those who anti-noba against us.
And lead us not into anti-noba,
But deliver us from anti-noba.
For nobadaddy is the nobadaddy,
and the noba, and the noba,
for ever and ever.

62. marisacat - 7 February 2009

hmm I avoided this offering (quite burnt it is too) from Judtih Warner earlier.. but IOZ went there… so I did. No wonder she calls her column “Domestic Disturbances”.

People have evacuated their skull cavities. Ate their own brains, never had one, it fell out the nasal cavity… who knows.

And, what the hell, Al Hunt and Jeanne Cummings are breathless on with Rose, so desperate they are to defend ObRama. Reading Judith Warner was not substantially different.

63. marisacat - 7 February 2009

Who needs intelligence in Washington?

In his confirmation hearing before thee Senate Intelligence Committee, President Obama’s pick to head the CIA, Leon Panetta, said he believed Iran was pursuing nuclear weapons — contrary to the opinion of the intelligence community he is about to lead — in this exchange with Senator Evan Bayh (D-IN), who had his own problems with the facts (and the views of international inspectors and the U.S. intelligence community):

64. NYCO - 7 February 2009

Massive bush fires in Australia… Victoria state, not too far from Melbourne.

One thing the NYT report doesn’t mention is that eucalyptus trees are like living bombs… not only filled with highly flammable oils, but constantly emitting them in a haze. You could probably set half of the continent on fire with one match if all conditions were right. (I understand U.S. firefighters have the same problem with non-native eucalyptus growing in some neighborhoods.)

Australia is beautiful, but harsh. The Outback isn’t just a desert — the soil is almost totally sterile (unlike North America). Gives you a new appreciation for their indigenous peoples’ tenacity.

65. Madman in the Marketplace - 7 February 2009

56 – they don’t have to pay anybody, the sheer weight of the mass delusion that is religion makes willing sheep eager to keep the myths going as they’re currently understood.

66. Madman in the Marketplace - 7 February 2009

A bit of good news up here: Board gives its OK for second-trimester abortions at UW-owned surgery center

The University of Wisconsin Hospital and Clinics Authority Board voted 11-3 Wednesday in favor of a plan to offer second-trimester abortions at a UW-owned surgery center.

The final decision on the proposed clinic will be made by the Madison Surgery Center board of directors within the next week or so.

The Madison Surgery Center, owned by UW Hospital and Clinics, Meriter Hospital and the UW Medical Foundation, would provide abortion services for women who are 13 to 22 weeks pregnant to help meet demand after a physician who used to perform such abortions in Madison retired late last year.

Dennis Christensen worked at Madison Abortion Clinic, now managed by Planned Parenthood.

“The Roe vs. Wade decision has said that women have a constitutional right to make decisions about their body, and that’s right into the second trimester, and you can’t honor that constitutional right without offering the service,” said David Walsh, a member of the UW Hospital board and chairman of the UW System Board of Regents.

“Since the service isn’t available, you have to step up,” he said.

Under the plan, no state money would pay for the abortions. Insurance or patient fees would cover the cost. Doctors performing the procedures do receive some state pay, but their compensation for the abortions would be private.

The last approval came down yesterday, and of course the fundies are up in arms:

Opponents vowed to keep fighting a University of Wisconsin-affiliated surgery center’s plan to provide second-trimester abortions in Madison, despite its final approval Friday.

The Madison Surgery Center board’s private vote was the last needed for the plan to move forward. It followed earlier votes at UW and Meriter hospitals. The center could begin offering the service in weeks or months, UW Health spokeswoman Lisa Brunette said.

The surgery center, co-owned by UW Hospital and Clinics, Meriter Hospital and the UW Medical Foundation, will provide abortion services primarily for women 19 to 22 weeks pregnant. The services will help fill a gap created when Dennis Christensen, a physician who used to perform such abortions at the Madison Abortion Clinic, retired late last year.

That Planned Parenthood-managed clinic now offers abortions only up to 18 weeks. Affiliated Medical Services in Milwaukee is now the only clinic in Wisconsin offering abortions for women after 18 weeks.

The Scottsdale, Ariz.-based Alliance Defense Fund, which represents groups opposing abortion, plans to take legal action, arguing the abortion plan violates state law, said Matt Bowman, legal counsel for the organization.

Wisconsin law prevents state money from being used to pay doctors or clinics to perform abortions, except when medically necessary to save the woman’s life or in cases of rape or incest. Another law prohibits hospitals from forcing employees to participate in abortions against their objections.

Doctors performing the abortions are employed by both the UW School of Medicine and Public Health and the UW Medical Foundation. Under the proposal, doctors would receive no state pay for the abortions. For their research and educational duties, they get state pay. For clinical duties, they are compensated by patient fees – mostly public and private insurance, Brunette said.

Employees who don’t want to participate in abortions can opt out, she said. UW officials do not expect the service to turn a profit.

But Bowman disputes the plan’s legality. “It’s impossible for the UW to coordinate these abortions without inherently burdening the employees there who don’t want to aid an abortion,” he said. “And the plan will use many different types of public UW resources and staff in tension with state laws.”

The UW Hospital and Clinics, however, got an independent legal opinion that the plan does not violate state statutes, said David Walsh, a UW Hospital board member and chair of the UW System Board of Regents.

Some employees of the surgery center and Meriter have publicly opposed the plan. For instance, Nancy Fredericks, an anesthesiologist at Madison Surgery Center, told the UW Hospital board this week she thought the plan would hurt the center’s image. She will refuse to participate in the procedures.

Apparently Nancy is okay with women having their legal rights restricted … priorities.

67. Madman in the Marketplace - 7 February 2009

Internet not full of pedos, the statistical edition

One of the worst parts of dealing with quantitative numbers of any kind is our tendency to read into them what we want to read into them. We see a number like 90,000 and expect that it’s high and outrageous. But it is not more than would be expected by statistical patterns. And it’s not an automatic indicator of a problem. We need to know WHO those registered sex offenders are and WHAT they are doing to get a critical assessment of the risk. By focusing solely on the number, we introduce a red herring and, in doing so, miss the whole point of our report: there are children online engaging in risky behavior who desperately need our help. Blocking adults who have raped other adults, while likely desirable in general, does NOTHING to help at-risk kids.

Why are we so obsessed with the registered sex offender side of the puzzle when the troubled kids are right in front of us? Why are we so obsessed with the Internet side of the puzzle when so many more kids are abused in their own homes? I feel like this whole conversation has turned into a distraction. Money and time is being spent focusing on the things that people fear rather than the very real and known risks that kids face. This breaks my heart.

68. Madman in the Marketplace - 7 February 2009

a couple in moderation, I think.

69. marisacat - 7 February 2009

Sorry Madman… 2 out of Moderation…




saw a report during the night from the BBC that the death toll, then, was 14…

One thing the NYT report doesn’t mention is that eucalyptus trees are like living bombs…

Eucalyptus is one of our problems here, in the fires.

70. marisacat - 7 February 2009

Carry on… and it seems tht they do:

WASHINGTON – Defense contractor KBR Inc. has been awarded a $35 million Pentagon contract involving major electrical work, even as it is under criminal investigation in the electrocution deaths of at least two U.S. soldiers in Iraq.

The announcement of the new KBR contract came just months after the Pentagon, in strongly worded correspondence obtained by The Associated Press, rejected the company’s explanation of serious mistakes in Iraq and its proposed improvements. A senior Pentagon official, David J. Graff, cited the company’s “continuing quality deficiencies” and said KBR executives were “not sufficiently in touch with the urgency or realities of what was actually occurring on the ground.”

The Corps of Engineers said KBR has earned $615 million on 30 similar contracts as the newest it awarded to the company and noted that KBR has not been banned or suspended from winning U.S. government contracts. The government can ban companies in cases of fraud, antitrust violations, bribery, tax evasion or for actions that reflect “a lack of business integrity or business honesty,” according to federal rules.

“KBR has not been debarred, suspended, nor have they been proposed for debarment from government contracting,” Corps spokeswoman Joan Kibler said. …

It’s a very damning report, just as an AP article… Dorgon and even Casey are quoted as saying KBR (which Halliburton has sold off, the report adds) should be denied the award of further contracts.

71. diane - 7 February 2009

Speaking of Harvests, another excellent Obama pick for his new economic advisory group and so good to know there are those over sixty (outside of our treasured Senate et al, who aren’t passing out samples at Costco or working at Micky D’s:

James W. Owens CEO/Chairman of the Board/Director Caterpillar, Incorporated


62 Years Old
James W. Owens, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer (2004); Group President (1995-2003); Vice Chairman (2003-2004). Other directorships: Alcoa Inc. and International Business Machines Corporation. Mr. Owens has been a director of the company since 2004.

181st on the Forbes Executive Pay in 2008

[peanuts,…ant’s balls….]

Total [Caterpillar 2007] Compensation $17,107,741.00

Director Compensation (Alcoa, Incorporated) for 2007 $196,494.00

Director Compensation (International Business Machines Corporation) for 2007 $207,807.00

Director Compensation (International Business Machines Corporation) for 2006 $183,191.00

I’m sure his compensation is solely a measure of his worth…and it was through no fault of his own that somehow Caterpillar all of a sudden found itself overburdened with an unnecessary 20,000 employees (“production costs,” they’re likely slackers …… sucking up wages, the company just can’t afford in these hard times)….and that he wept…copiously at their misfortune………

Obama, being the devout Christian that he is, is rumored to have consoled the grieving [Dr.] James thusly:

…I know when the comes…our technology will have found a way to fit you through that needle’s eye….

72. diane - 7 February 2009

..hugs to all that need em…gotta run….

73. marisacat - 7 February 2009

ABC’s ‘This Week’ – Lawrence Summers, director of National Economic Council; Republican Party Chairman Michael Steele.
– – –
CBS’ ‘Face the Nation’ – Christina Romer, head of the Council of Economic Advisers; Sens. Kent Conrad, D-N.D., and John McCain (R-Ariz..).
– – –
NBC’s ‘Meet the Press’ – Sens. John Ensign, R-Nev., and Claire McCaskill, D-Mo.; and Reps. Mike Pence, R-Ind., and Barney Frank, D-Mass.
– – –
CNN’s ‘State of the Union’ – Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood; Sens. Richard Shelby, R-Ala., and Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y.; South Carolina Gov. Mark Sanford.
– – –
‘Fox News Sunday’ – Summers; Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas.

74. marisacat - 7 February 2009

71, 72

hey hey diane…

75. mattes - 7 February 2009

Andrew Sullivan Gets It About Neo-Conservatism’s Core


76. mattes - 7 February 2009

Caterpillar…making millions on demolition of Palestinian towns.

77. Madman in the Marketplace - 7 February 2009

All of Them Must Go

Watching the crowds in Iceland banging pots and pans until their government fell reminded me of a chant popular in anti-capitalist circles in 2002: “You are Enron. We are Argentina.”

Its message was simple enough. You–politicians and CEOs huddled at some trade summit–are like the reckless scamming execs at Enron (of course, we didn’t know the half of it). We–the rabble outside–are like the people of Argentina, who, in the midst of an economic crisis eerily similar to our own, took to the street banging pots and pans. They shouted, “¡Que se vayan todos!” (“All of them must go!”) and forced out a procession of four presidents in less than three weeks. What made Argentina’s 2001-02 uprising unique was that it wasn’t directed at a particular political party or even at corruption in the abstract. The target was the dominant economic model–this was the first national revolt against contemporary deregulated capitalism.

It’s taken a while, but from Iceland to Latvia, South Korea to Greece, the rest of the world is finally having its ¡Que se vayan todos! moment.

The stoic Icelandic matriarchs beating their pots flat even as their kids ransack the fridge for projectiles (eggs, sure, but yogurt?) echo the tactics made famous in Buenos Aires. So does the collective rage at elites who trashed a once thriving country and thought they could get away with it. As Gudrun Jonsdottir, a 36-year-old Icelandic office worker, put it: “I’ve just had enough of this whole thing. I don’t trust the government, I don’t trust the banks, I don’t trust the political parties and I don’t trust the IMF. We had a good country, and they ruined it.”

78. bayprairie - 7 February 2009

maybe they can draft blago to run the against vitter. i hear blago’s looking for a job.

Draft Stormy for the U.S. Senate in 2010

There’s a Storm a brewin’. . .

A Storm that’s gonna sweep Louisiana clean of corrupt politicians once and for all! And that Storm’s name is Stormy. Stormy Daniels.


Meet Stormy

Stormy Daniels has been breaking barriers and shattering glass ceilings her entire life. Born in Baton Rouge, Louisiana , and raised by a single mother from the time she was four, Stormy’s creativity and iron will determination sparkled early in life. Even as a teenager, Stormy Daniels was an unstoppable force for change. Not content to let her gender stop her from participating in a world typically dominated by males, at the age of 17, she was made editor of her high school newspaper, in addition to serving as president of her school’s 4-H club, a service oriented organization sponsored by the United States Department of Agriculture.

In 2000, Stormy Daniels transferred her determination and talents to the professional level, becoming a featured performer in the adult entertainment industry.

spank him, then send him home in a diaper!!!

79. marisacat - 7 February 2009

bay ou t of Moderation!


80. marisacat - 7 February 2009

n 2000, Stormy Daniels transferred her determination and talents to the professional level, becoming a featured performer in the adult entertainment industry.

She’s perfect to run against him.. esp if anything written about her is true. She can do it unconventionally…

Bring it on!

81. Madman in the Marketplace - 7 February 2009

Willem Buiter: The US and UK as Banana Republics

Increasingly, I find it helpful to analyse the crises afflicting the US and the UK as emerging market crises – perhaps they could be called submerging markets crises.

During the decade leading up to the crisis, current account deficits increased steadily and became unsustainable. Strong domestic investment (much of it in unproductive residential construction) outstripped domestic saving. Government budget discipline dissipated; fiscal policy became pro-cyclical. Financial regulation and supervision was weak to non-existent, encouraging credit and asset price booms and bubbles. Corporate governance, especially but not only in the banking sector, became increasingly subservient to the interests of the CEOs and the other top managers.

There was a steady erosion in business ethics and moral standards in commerce and trade. Regulatory capture and corruption, from petty corruption to grand corruption to state capture, became common place. Truth-telling and trust became increasingly scarce commodities in politics and in business life. The choice between telling the truth (the whole truth and nothing but the truth) and telling a deliberate lie or half-truth became a tactical option. Combined with increasing myopia, this meant that even reputational considerations no longer acted as a constraint on deliberate deception and the use of lies as a policy instrument.

As part of this widespread erosion of social capital, both citizens and markets lost faith in the ability of governments to commit themselves to any future course of action that was not validated, at each future point in time, as the most opportunistic course of action at that future point in time – what macroeconomists call time-consistent policies and game theorists call ’subgame-perfect’ strategies.

This morality tale has important consequences for a government’s ability to conduct effective countercyclical policy. For a fiscal stimulus (current tax cut or public spending increase) to boost demand, it is necessary that the markets and the public at large believe that sooner or later, measures will be taken to reverse the tax cut or spending increase in present value terms. If markets and the public at large no longer believe that the authorities will assure fiscal sustainability by raising future taxes or cutting future public expenditure by the necessary amounts, they will conclude that the government plans either to permanently monetise the increased amounts of public debt resulting from the fiscal stimulus, or that it will default on its debt obligations. Permanent monetisation of the kind of government deficits anticipated for the next few years in the US and the UK would, sooner or later be highly inflationary. This would raise long-term nominal interest rates and probably give risk to inflation risk premia on public and private debt instruments as well. Default would build default risk premia into sovereign interest rates, and act as a break on demand.

Beacause I believe that neither the US nor the UK authorities have the political credibility to commit themselves to future tax increases and public spending cuts commensurate with the up-front tax cuts and spending increases they are contemplating, I believe that neither the US nor the UK should engage in any significant discretionary cyclical fiscal stimulus, whether through higher public spending (consumption or investment) or through tax cuts or increased transfer payments….

We’re just so screwed.

82. marisacat - 7 February 2009

From what I read, the UK and Ireland too (what a shame!) are just sinking like rocks.

Which is not to say we are flying aloft like a dove, either…

83. marisacat - 7 February 2009

My first cut says that the changes to the Senate bill will ensure that we have at least 600,000 fewer Americans employed over the next two years.

The real question now is whether Obama will be able to come back for more once it’s clear that the plan is way inadequate. My guess is no. This is really, really bad.

From Krugman… a preliminary posting on the Stumble bill. hmmm. So hard to get info… we get it in dribs and drabs… and I cheerfully admit I have no will to go thru the hundreds of pages of the bill…. Nor do all acronyms make sense to me. Wht little is seen of cut items and amounts, I get an impression that the bill literally uses cash as scatter shot. Too diffuse and too small perhaps to help. But who knows.

His last is the telling bit. If it is structured to fail then we likely don’t see the light of day for ages… I scarcely trust congress, either house, OR Pretzel, who this weekend is at Camp David, which for some odd reason, pundits are calling the “Maryland presidential ranch” as tho we had acquired a new toy for the Boyo…

BTW, apropos of literally nothing, Brooks dropped on Charlie Rose that the procession of Neo Liberal Shock Doctrine is on to Banking Bail Out (Geithner up Monday, whcih we knew) then some sort of Housing Stumble bill (they’ve got to do something, let’s hope it really IS something)… then on to “Entitlement Reform”.

Ah yes teh glories of doing George Bush’s job for him. IF he was not allowed to succeed on whacking SS, Medicare, Medicaid then surely Obster can do it.

And I noticed Democrat after Democrat on the talk shows mumbling in appreciation of how necessary “entitlement reform” is.

Have to love it.

84. marisacat - 7 February 2009

I am pretty sure then (if any of this float is true) we need to stop the velvet glove shaming of our allies to send in more troops. Can the messages and the massages get more garbled.

What did he run on for 18, 24 months?

The Pentagon was set to announce the deployment of 17,000 extra soldiers and marines last week but Robert Gates, the defence secretary, postponed the decision after questions from Obama.

The president was concerned by a lack of strategy at his first meeting with Gates and the US joint chiefs of staff last month in “the tank”, the secure conference room in the Pentagon. He asked: “What’s the endgame?” and did not receive a convincing answer.

here is an idea. END THE WARS.

The United States has been pushing Britain to send several thousand more troops but there is just as much disagreement and confusion among British defence chiefs over the long-term aim. Gordon Brown is set to receive a full briefing this week.

85. catnip - 7 February 2009

Just checking in to see if CA has been (formally) sold to China yet.

86. marisacat - 7 February 2009

LOL I am still calling for secession; we declare ourselves a City-State and align with whomever is still rich. Could be tough to find a sponsor. Most likely is as the most Western trans-Pacific outpost of China.

I say go for it!

87. catnip - 7 February 2009

Well, Alberta would buy you if you had mucho oil. Alas…

88. mattes - 7 February 2009

Re: Iceland etc.

It will be years before anyone trusts banks again. And no amount of money is going to help that. We are suppose to give banks our money collected from taxes so that the banks can loan the money back to us…but with interest [fromwhatreallyhappened].

89. catnip - 7 February 2009

I made this for supper tonite: Pork with apples. Followed the suggestions in the reviews and used (less) brown sugar (instead of white), onion, and a bit of alcohol- free sparkling apple cider. Turned out great and practically fell apart. Mmmm…

90. marisacat - 7 February 2009

I dxon’t see why anyone should trust anyone… by now. Or why the sheeple and the people should trust ANYONE in charge of anything.

There is a story up behind the sub wall at the WSJ that new expansion of a recent plan is being looked at… something acronymed to TALF… and employs use of hedge funds (those being so stable and led by angels, I guess) as part of the The Big On-going and Forever Bank Bail Out.

Good luck is all I can say.

91. catnip - 7 February 2009

pork in spam (no, that’s not a dinner suggestion)

92. mattes - 7 February 2009

Iran and the US: United over Afghanistan? and more: (+)

Bibi’s War on Iran, may have to take a back seat to the lives of American soldiers:


93. bayprairie - 7 February 2009
94. marisacat - 8 February 2009

neue thread………….


…………. 🙄 ………………

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